Eddie Bravo Invitational 14: The Absolutes

You shouldn't be put in a domination position in bjj if you didn't earn it just to get a winner.

I like the point system and advantages because at the highest level, it's hard to score, hence advantages.

You "earn" it under this rule set by making it through regulation without being submitted.

"Fastest escape" is a clear winner?

It is under this rule set.

I really don't understand these arguments. It's just saying, "I don't think these rules are right because they're not these other rules." OK, and? That's a pointless argument because the other side says the same thing and it doesn't make either right. I like the rule set but I also like points. I think having a variety of rules is good for grappling and people can choose to generalise or specialize as they want. As long as the rules are focused on something valuable in grappling, they have value. The ability to escape bad positions quickly is a valuable so EBI rules have value.
 
"Fastest escape" is a clear winner?

is throwing a coin a clear winner? have all judges decision always found a clear winner... actually fastest escape is more clear than judges decision, at least you know what you based the winner on, some judges decision cannot be understood.
 
"Fastest escape" is a clear winner?
So attempting a sweep or submission from guard and winning by advantage indicates a clear winner? I mean in IBJJF it does. Listen if I show my dad an ibjjf match and the guy holds guard, attempts a sub and gets an advantage, as soon as he gets the advantage he holds guard pretending to work and wins. My dad would be bored to tears. At least in the EBI rule set there is a clear winner and loser indicated by the rule set. I'm not saying IBJJF isn't important. But the goals of each tournament are different.

Another point I would like to add is, yes being able to escape submission attempts or bad positions is an indication of being a complete grappler.
 
You "earn" it under this rule set by making it through regulation without being submitted.



It is under this rule set.

I really don't understand these arguments. It's just saying, "I don't think these rules are right because they're not these other rules." OK, and? That's a pointless argument because the other side says the same thing and it doesn't make either right. I like the rule set but I also like points. I think having a variety of rules is good for grappling and people can choose to generalise or specialize as they want. As long as the rules are focused on something valuable in grappling, they have value. The ability to escape bad positions quickly is a valuable so EBI rules have value.

I understand that it's the rules. I just stated that they suck. I'm sure some of these guys just try to make it to overtime just to be put in a dominate position that they would never get in the first place lol.
 
I understand that it's the rules. I just stated that they suck. I'm sure some of these guys just try to make it to overtime just to be put in a dominate position that they would never get in the first place lol.
How about the guys who just pull guard and who try and win by advantages?
 
How about the guys who just pull guard and who try and win by advantages?

They still have to earn the advantage with a deep sub attack or almost stabilizing a position. They are just not given a position.

You will have alot of advantages when he top guys go against each other.
 
Right but that's the point of the ot rules. There is a clear winner and loser. No advantages and no points. You are stubborn or really good with your guard but win with advantages in IBJJF tournaments.

Advantages suck. Some kinda of make sense like the one for forcing the guard player to turtle
Ref decisions sucks extremely hard. Personally I don't even celebrate them when I win like and just consider them advancing in the tournament not proper victories.

EBI style OT I don't consider even consider jiu jitsu (it's not something I train and compete or have an interest in watching).
 
They still have to earn the advantage with a deep sub attack or almost stabilizing a position. They are just not given a position.

You will have alot of advantages when he top guys go against each other.

Advantages suck... They are completely fucking gay... and they need to go away...
 
They still have to earn the advantage with a deep sub attack or almost stabilizing a position. They are just not given a position.

You will have alot of advantages when he top guys go against each other.

Advantages suck. Some kinda of make sense like the one for forcing the guard player to turtle
Ref decisions sucks extremely hard. Personally I don't even celebrate them when I win like and just consider them advancing in the tournament not proper victories.

EBI style OT I don't consider even consider jiu jitsu (it's not something I train and compete or have an interest in watching).

No matter what the rule set people will not be happy. I enjoy the EBI rule set. I like the tournament, it's fun to watch.
 
Advantages suck... They are completely fucking gay... and they need to go away...

No they don't. It's hard to score at the highest level.
 
Who are these people and why should I care about their middle school cattyness?
They are the people who run EBI 14. You're in an EBI 14 thread.

The rest isn't rocket science.
 
I understand that it's the rules. I just stated that they suck. I'm sure some of these guys just try to make it to overtime just to be put in a dominate position that they would never get in the first place lol.
Which is stupid because you don't get paid in overtime. You only get paid if you sub in regulation.
 
Advantages suck. Some kinda of make sense like the one for forcing the guard player to turtle
Ref decisions sucks extremely hard. Personally I don't even celebrate them when I win like and just consider them advancing in the tournament not proper victories.

EBI style OT I don't consider even consider jiu jitsu (it's not something I train and compete or have an interest in watching).

To me, the EBI OT is "advantages" for the sub-only set. I don't get why every BJJ ruleset has to cannibalize itself with some artificial technicality. EBI sets out to be this awesome thing where anything goes and stallers aren't invited, but then it's like "oh yeah you can also just stall to the OT and win by fastest escape."
 
is throwing a coin a clear winner? have all judges decision always found a clear winner... actually fastest escape is more clear than judges decision, at least you know what you based the winner on, some judges decision cannot be understood.
Which is stupid because you don't get paid in overtime. You only get paid if you sub in regulation.

But you get paid by doing seminars later on where you can claim you beat someone by winning in the overtime..
 
But you get paid by doing seminars later on where you can claim you beat someone by winning in the overtime..
I guess but you dont get the 20k potential. I mean 5k a win is a lot of money to turn down.

I don't disagree with you. Usually those really defensive guys who do nothing lose. There was a purple belt at EBI 13 that had really stubborn defense and would just scramble out of every bad position. He lost the second round. I don't like those matches either. It's like you said with advantages. You can win with them but you aren't going to beat a high level guy like Gordon Ryan by just defending and doing nothing hoping to win in overtime. It will be really difficult or near impossible.
 
No they don't. It's hard to score at the highest level.
I know it's hard to score at the highest level but I would rather a tie come down to judges instead of advantages. Advantages are so subjective anyways, and they lead to some of the more over the top meta-gaming in BJJ. I feel like advantages are like half a point for bricked free throws instead of air balls.

That might not be the best analogy but it just seems weird to give a score for "almost" doing something successfully.

I think they could maybe improve the point system and do away with advantages. I wish they would give 4 points for back control with a body triangle (and not just hooks), give 2 or even 3 points for a crucifix, and maybe give 2 points for forcing someone to turtle after you cleanly pass the guard.
 
But you get paid by doing seminars later on where you can claim you beat someone by winning in the overtime..

its absolutely the same, you get paid by doing seminars where you can claim you beat people on judges decision... . orlando fucking sanchez beat 4 guys by literally being bigger and stronger and pushing them more times out out bounds.. He still won adcc. Those matches were the definition of a travesty match.

its actually quite simple, you dont want people to be on your back without earning the position? well finish the match, or may be score (im advocating ebi ot over judges decision at any type of rule set).
 
its absolutely the same, you get paid by doing seminars where you can claim you beat people on judges decision... . orlando fucking sanchez beat 4 guys by literally being bigger and stronger and pushing them more times out out bounds.. He still won adcc. Those matches were the definition of a travesty match.

its actually quite simple, you dont want people to be on your back without earning the position? well finish the match, or may be score (im advocating ebi ot over judges decision at any type of rule set).

It's hard to dominate great opponents. If two out of the three refs agree that you win, I'm ok with the decision.
 
I know it's hard to score at the highest level but I would rather a tie come down to judges instead of advantages. Advantages are so subjective anyways, and they lead to some of the more over the top meta-gaming in BJJ. I feel like advantages are like half a point for bricked free throws instead of air balls.

That might not be the best analogy but it just seems weird to give a score for "almost" doing something successfully.

I think they could maybe improve the point system and do away with advantages. I wish they would give 4 points for back control with a body triangle (and not just hooks), give 2 or even 3 points for a crucifix, and maybe give 2 points for forcing someone to turtle after you cleanly pass the guard.

The biggest hidden problem with the IBJJF point system is that sweeps are way overvalued. Sweeps are one of the easiest scoring moves to get in BJJ, sometimes happening almost by accident, yet the 2 points are just one less than passing the guard, which is one of the most difficult things to do (at the highest level). When you add that the guard player has more opportunities to get advantages than the top player, sweeping becomes the primary move in most BJJ matches, such that the beginning of the match is a race to see who can start on bottom.
 
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It's hard to dominate great opponents. If two out of the three refs agree that you win, I'm ok with the decision.

so you think its better to win a match via stalling via stalling for 20 minutes than by actually performing a technique?

sorry it really makes no sense.

I think I would agree when the decision is lets say a clear 10-8, but when the decision is not clear, ebi ot rules is a great solution for the problem.
 
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