Elections Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez: Establishment Democrats' Wakeup Call

[abiG]

Establishment get a wake-up call in N.Y: 28-year-old Socialist ousted the 4th-Ranked House Democrat

They got a wake up call or exactly what they wanted? Isn't the agenda to open the borders?

 

[Jack V Savage]

Man, I really have to disagree strongly with getting rid of ICE. I assume that means you want to return the responsibility to INS + Border Patrol. I can't do that right now with the political instability in Central America and outrageously violent drug smuggling industry at the border. Doesn't mean I would keep any of the policies the way they are, or that I would keep them the same size, but I want a hardcore law enforcement agency available. If we can keep the effectiveness of ICE and shift them into a better organizational structure or something, cool.

Yes, obviously there would still be immigration enforcement. Overhauling it would be OK, too, but it's way out of control now, and I don't think rounding up non-criminal unauthorized immigrants and deporting them should be a priority of the federal gov't.

The whole ball got rolling on the issue from this:

https://www.thenation.com/article/its-time-to-abolish-ice/

 

[MayhemMonkey]

They got a wake up call or exactly what they wanted? Isn't the agenda to open the borders?

well considering she only raised 300 grand(almost entirely through small donations) and her opponent raised over 3 million(and spent more than he raised, mostly from corporate doners also) I think its safe to say that the "establishment" didnt get what they want

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

Wood

 

[Patrick Carey]

Sounds like a problem for Super Delegates to fix

 

[Cirris]

She's a "free shit" socialist. promises the moon, but can rarely deliver once the corporates get a hold of them.

 

[jamel]

Well damn, she got a pretty ass smile dont she?

 

[VivaRevolution]

Huh, seems the voters didn't get the memo.

Trump won election because?

So obviously things will return to normal in 2018, and 2020.

Here is your sign.

 

[Gandhi]

From her platform, just the things that are worrisome:

Require Congresspeople to take no money from the gun lobby or private equity companies that invest in the firearms industry
Blatantly unconstitutional

It’s time to abolish ICE
Batshit nuts

LGBTQIA+ rights
Never go full BBQ. For real, the full call letters are a signal that she's way over the top here, regardless of real issues.

Gotta be careful with zealots. She ticks the progressive boxes, but she has no common sense and a few really sketchy positions that don't seem well thought-out.

The real question is if this can in anyway be mirrored to what has been happening on the right (tea party then trump / troll party neutering the adults in the room).

Some of this is good, so good for her for shaking things up a bit, but I have yet to see evidence that this means we now have a left wing version of political populist insurgency that we have on the right.

 

[PHATV]

NEW FACE OF THE LEFT...

MSNBC HOSTS GUSH...

Women dominating Dem primaries...

PELOSI SNAPS; ASKED ABOUT FRESH CANDIDATES...

DEMS VOW INSURGENCY, FLOAT 'CARETAKER'...

 

[Fawlty]

The real question is if this can in anyway be mirrored to what has been happening on the right (tea party then trump / troll party neutering the adults in the room).

Some of this is good, so good for her for shaking things up a bit, but I have yet to see evidence that this means we now have a left wing version of political populist insurgency that we have on the right.

That's subtle (or at least that's what passes for subtle lately), the equivocation of the progressive left and the Trump right. Using the example of this candidate, people will take the proposal to abolish ICE (which I think is a really bad idea right now), and pretend that it means having open borders and no immigration controls. That gives them permission to say "you're the same level of crazy as Trump, so I pick Trump." Many of our Never Trumpers are looking for stuff just like that, so they can rationalize their support for the Republican Party.

You're right though, I haven't seen evidence of the left going full Tea Party, and I was worried Bernie's influence would do that. It could still happen in 2020 so I don't think the Democrats are out of the woods yet.

 

[deviake]

well considering she only raised 300 grand(almost entirely through small donations) and her opponent raised over 3 million(and spent more than he raised, mostly from corporate doners also) I think its safe to say that the "establishment" didnt get what they want

You know American politics better than most Americans.

 

[MayhemMonkey]

You know American politics better than most Americans.

only learned about that from watching Secular Talk lol

 

[Ichibanner]

wrong, they are becoming an actual opposition to conservatives

You really think farther reaching leftists will be opposition to center or right conservatives? Especially if unemployment continues to trend downward under Trump and a Republican Congress?

 

[Ichibanner]

wrong, they are becoming an actual opposition to conservatives

Ummm...you didn't see what happened when Bernie went against the grain and the Democrat's sacred cow Hillary? Yes, please introduce farther reaching leftists

 

[deviake]

only learned about that from watching Secular Talk lol

I watch that as well. The Humanist Report, The Jimmy Dore Show, and The Real News are also good sources.

Edit: For American politics I should say

 

[MayhemMonkey]

You really think farther reaching leftists will be opposition to center or right conservatives? Especially if unemployment continues to trend downward under Trump and a Republican Congress?

offering an alternative to neoliberalism and conservatism will improve politics so people have actual choice.... instead of just corporatism no matter what

 

[MayhemMonkey]

I watch that as well. The Humanist Report, The Jimmy Dore Show, and The Real News are also good sources.

Edit: For American politics I should say

I watch them now and then, but Kyle is a regular watch for me. I tend to agree with him on most things

 

[MayhemMonkey]

Ummm...you didn't see what happened when Bernie went against the grain and the Democrat's sacred cow Hillary? Yes, please introduce farther reaching leftists

but this is grassroots politics winning over corporatism.....if the democratic party actually stand for something again it will only be a good thing for your country

 

[Gandhi]

That's subtle (or at least that's what passes for subtle lately), the equivocation of the progressive left and the Trump right. Using the example of this candidate, people will take the proposal to abolish ICE (which I think is a really bad idea right now), and pretend that it means having open borders and no immigration controls. That gives them permission to say "you're the same level of crazy as Trump, so I pick Trump." Many of our Never Trumpers are looking for stuff just like that, so they can rationalize their support for the Republican Party.

You're right though, I haven't seen evidence of the left going full Tea Party, and I was worried Bernie's influence would do that. It could still happen in 2020 so I don't think the Democrats are out of the woods yet.

Yeah I think the equivocation is wrong for a whole bunch of reasons. The two most obv is simple economic history and the other is the fidelity to actual ideas. That being said there is a point where the left does jump the shark and becomes just as bad, indentitarian in its own way, and culturally detrimental.

I just don’t buy into all the self equivilancies and common retorts from trumpers that sjws caused all this and are somehow the justification. We are nowhere near that.

I also think talk about abolishing ICE to be counter productive and the JVS article framed the whole issue in terms that just don’t align well politically. Immigration needs to be framed as a benefit to society and the so called ills of illegals need to be put in context for what they are. And the reaction we have to it does impact how we stand as a democracy. But to say we need to reframe immigration away from security and towards human rights and diversity for diversity sake is not going to be a winning theme. Nor is calling ICE Nazis.

So in summary there is much more substance to what she is saying than your standard tea derper but I don’t think it’s the right direction to go for the party as a whole.