Is TUF still relevant?

Yea I think it's relevant. Even if it doesn't produce immediate champs. The TUF show is and has been a way for unpopular talent to get a shot. It's hard to walk up to 16 guys and predict which 1-3 are going to have a good career in the ufc. But if you take those 16 guys and let them face each other, a few begin to emerge and that's what this shows all about. It shows which fighters have natural talent and it also shows how they adapt and take coaching. That's a good predictor of how they will do
This is the problem I'm finding with Dana White's Tuesday night contender series. (which I watch and is a good platform for finding new fighters). But with TUF you take 8 or 16 fighters and put them in a tournament, you quickly weed out the weak links and end up with the best fighters for the organization. With DWTNCS you have 10 fighters with 5 winners and 5 losers in different weight classes getting signed because they are exciting fighters, but not tested to any real degree because they simply had one untested competition. DWTNCS will bring in some good fighters no doubt, that's what happens when you sign 25 new fighters every season, but it will also bring in a lot more flops who won't last.
 
If you don’t watch, like it, or think it’s relivent, then how did you click on the “the ultimate fighter” discussion thread?
Apparently, being you clicked on the thread and commented.
I know right. Nothing wrong with people not thinking TUF is relevant, but how did they end up on this thread. I don't spend my time reading treads of things I don't know anything about because it is a waste of my time, just a bunch of names I don't recognize. If someone doesn't watch TUF why on earth were they scrolling through the TUF forum.
 
I know right. Nothing wrong with people not thinking TUF is relevant, but how did they end up on this thread. I don't spend my time reading treads of things I don't know anything about because it is a waste of my time, just a bunch of names I don't recognize. If someone doesn't watch TUF why on earth were they scrolling through the TUF forum.
+1 Reminds me of the guys who complain about WMMA, say they don't watch it or say they don't care for it, but comment about it, and make threads about it.
 
This is the problem I'm finding with Dana White's Tuesday night contender series. (which I watch and is a good platform for finding new fighters). But with TUF you take 8 or 16 fighters and put them in a tournament, you quickly weed out the weak links and end up with the best fighters for the organization. With DWTNCS you have 10 fighters with 5 winners and 5 losers in different weight classes getting signed because they are exciting fighters, but not tested to any real degree because they simply had one untested competition. DWTNCS will bring in some good fighters no doubt, that's what happens when you sign 25 new fighters every season, but it will also bring in a lot more flops who won't last.
Very good point. I haven't give the contender show much attention but I think you are right about this.
 
+1 Reminds me of the guys who complain about WMMA, say they don't watch it or say they don't care for it, but comment about it, and make threads about it.
Well it's not quite the same. People who don't like TUF don't watch TUF and I can't imagine why they would open up a forum with stuff they know nothing about. People who don't like WMMA still have to watch it mixed in with the rest of the UFC, and it pops up in their common forum. It actually has an affect on them and it is reasonable for them to voice their opinion on the matter. TUF doesn't affect those who don't care about it because they can do everything UFC and don't have to take in anything TUF if they don't want to.
 
Well it's not quite the same. People who don't like TUF don't watch TUF and I can't imagine why they would open up a forum with stuff they know nothing about. People who don't like WMMA still have to watch it mixed in with the rest of the UFC, and it pops up in their common forum. It actually has an affect on them and it is reasonable for them to voice their opinion on the matter. TUF doesn't affect those who don't care about it because they can do everything UFC and don't have to take in anything TUF if they don't want to.
Most who claim they don't like WMMA, also claim they don't watch it. Similar to those who claim they don't watch TUF, yet obviously do, being they comment about it. The two are very similar.
 
Most who claim they don't like WMMA, also claim they don't watch it. Similar to those who claim they don't watch TUF, yet obviously do, being they comment about it. The two are very similar.

People can indeed claim whatever they want, but ratings, PPV buys, and live gates don't lie. And they indicate that

-Outside of the now retired Ronda Rousey, even the top female champions have struggled to draw. Nunes vs. Pennington famously did just 85k buys, the lowest figure since the UFC exploded in popularity in 2006, and significantly worse than any number of Mighty Mouse headlined PPV. Invicta chugs along, but a look at their financials reveals the fighters get paid peanuts and their revenue stream is tiny. So people may watch WMMA, but they don't pay for it.

-The ratings for TUF are abysmal, which is why it's being canceled.
 
Most who claim they don't like WMMA, also claim they don't watch it. Similar to those who claim they don't watch TUF, yet obviously do, being they comment about it. The two are very similar.
That is not my experience. I think that people who claim they don't like WMMA still watch it simply because they are watching the other fights and those fights are on the card too, so it is inconvenient to not watch them, however it a card is headlined by a women's fight, they probably watch that too if they've bought the card anyways.
People who say they don't watch TUF probably don't watch TUF. Most of the people I watch UFC with don't watch TUF. It is a big investment of time, and a commitment to a whole season, so they probably don't watch it. That's why I know most of the TUF fighters and how good they are better than they do.
 
People can indeed claim whatever they want, but ratings, PPV buys, and live gates don't lie. And they indicate that

-Outside of the now retired Ronda Rousey, even the top female champions have struggled to draw. Nunes vs. Pennington famously did just 85k buys, the lowest figure since the UFC exploded in popularity in 2006, and significantly worse than any number of Mighty Mouse headlined PPV. Invicta chugs along, but a look at their financials reveals the fighters get paid peanuts and their revenue stream is tiny. So people may watch WMMA, but they don't pay for it.

-The ratings for TUF are abysmal, which is why it's being canceled.

Most of that is true. Though the last ppv 228 the female fighters had the most exciting fights of the night. Jessica Andrade showed scary striking and clean KO power. Tatiana Suarez showed peak level skills, not like a second level fighter. And Aldana and Pudilova was a slugfest from first bell to final bell. Also the know DWTNCS is full of high level female fighters that will make the division exciting if they keep signing 2 a night.

Any source to TUF getting canceled? That's not what I have heard. Actually I thought they were going to cancel it after the season 25, it seemed the perfect finishing season, but they didn't and I have heard that the station picking up UFC is also picking up TUF.
 
Most of that is true. Though the last ppv 228 the female fighters had the most exciting fights of the night. Jessica Andrade showed scary striking and clean KO power. Tatiana Suarez showed peak level skills, not like a second level fighter. And Aldana and Pudilova was a slugfest from first bell to final bell.

This is purely subjective, though. You believe these things, but myself and others don't. Personally, I thought Aldana-Pudilova was a sloppy, unskilled mess barely better than a Toughman contest, and Andrade displayed awful, wild striking, a particularly bad example of the antiquated Rafael Cordeiro style. She merely had rather unnatural physical strength for a woman.

The only one who impressed me was Tatiana Suarez with her wrestling, but being realistic, it was nothing spectacular or special. Very few women can wrestle at all, and Suarez dominated Esparza with solid fundamentals, little more.

Anyways, this is why I used numbers, which are objective.

Any source to TUF getting canceled? That's not what I have heard. Actually I thought they were going to cancel it after the season 25, it seemed the perfect finishing season, but they didn't and I have heard that the station picking up UFC is also picking up TUF.

Yeah, I could be wrong about this. I read somewhere, either on this forum or on a news article that it was the last season. But I might well be incorrect. Still, they have released ratings, and they dip ever lower each season.
 
This is purely subjective, though. You believe these things, but myself and others don't. Personally, I thought Aldana-Pudilova was a sloppy, unskilled mess barely better than a Toughman contest, and Andrade displayed awful, wild striking, a particularly bad example of the antiquated Rafael Cordeiro style. She merely had rather unnatural physical strength for a woman.

The only one who impressed me was Tatiana Suarez with her wrestling, but being realistic, it was nothing spectacular or special. Very few women can wrestle at all, and Suarez dominated Esparza with solid fundamentals, little more.

Anyways, this is why I used numbers, which are objective.



Yeah, I could be wrong about this. I read somewhere, either on this forum or on a news article that it was the last season. But I might well be incorrect. Still, they have released ratings, and they dip ever lower each season.
Well I certainly wasn’t arguing with you with my response, and I appreciate stats. TUF has plummeted in popularity, and I don’t think they are nearly as entertaining as they used to be (again subjective). But I enjoyed the fighter contests between teams. And I preferred more of a focus on fighter life in the house (not the drinking and fighting), but I don’t want to watch training.
It does feel like TUFs time is almost over, despite the fact that they bring the ufc high level fighters. But as a show it is not doing that well.
One of the reasons I think it is still going is because it is like a 40 minute add for the ufc that they get paid for instead of paying for (though I know it has costs), but it’s a good deal for them.
 
Well I certainly wasn’t arguing with you with my response, and I appreciate stats. TUF has plummeted in popularity, and I don’t think they are nearly as entertaining as they used to be (again subjective). But I enjoyed the fighter contests between teams. And I preferred more of a focus on fighter life in the house (not the drinking and fighting), but I don’t want to watch training.
It does feel like TUFs time is almost over, despite the fact that they bring the ufc high level fighters. But as a show it is not doing that well.
One of the reasons I think it is still going is because it is like a 40 minute add for the ufc that they get paid for instead of paying for (though I know it has costs), but it’s a good deal for them.

Recall that when TUF 1 premiered, the UFC was putting on just 5-6 events a year, all PPVs, with only about 8 fights per card. The only real competition was PRIDE, which was putting on just 6-7 events per year itself.

TUF's time was over when the UFC decided to hold 20+ events (now 35+) a year AND there was an explosion of other quality MMA organizations around the entire world. At that point,

-Why would any high-level fighter spend 6 weeks away from friends and family and compete several times without pay? Especially when it's easy to find a slot for them to fight on the dozens of UFC events per year?

-Why would a viewer, who has an almost endless amount of new MMA (let alone older fights) to watch each week be excited about the lower-level fights on TUF anymore?
 
You forgot Matt Serra and Rashad Evans, as past Champs who were on TUF..
Dunno if serra should be counted as a tuf fighter being that he was in ufc prior to being on show.
 
Recall that when TUF 1 premiered, the UFC was putting on just 5-6 events a year, all PPVs, with only about 8 fights per card. The only real competition was PRIDE, which was putting on just 6-7 events per year itself.

TUF's time was over when the UFC decided to hold 20+ events (now 35+) a year AND there was an explosion of other quality MMA organizations around the entire world. At that point,

-Why would any high-level fighter spend 6 weeks away from friends and family and compete several times without pay? Especially when it's easy to find a slot for them to fight on the dozens of UFC events per year?

-Why would a viewer, who has an almost endless amount of new MMA (let alone older fights) to watch each week be excited about the lower-level fights on TUF anymore?

Fighters jump at the oppertunity to be on TUF. Most unsigned fighter (meaning not in UFC or Bellator) are quick to go on TUF. The goal of most fighters is to be in the UFC and it is so hard to break in, even if you have a great record you can easily get lost in the crowd. As for 5-0's and 12-4 type records good luck ever getting noticed by the UFC, your chance is 1 in 100. TUF is an in. Winning it is a garonteed contract, and if you are exciting and do well you can get in anyways. Plus if you don't make it you have a far better shot at getting signed elsewhere because you have a name, even if not much of one. Yes there are a lot lot more cards each year, but there are also a lot lot more fighters out there. UFC is now putting on 10 times the number of shows each year, but there are 100 or 1000 times the number of fighters competing for a place on those shows.

Why would a viewer watch TUF anymore. Well many don't. But I can tell you why I watch TUF. I love mma. However there is only so much pure fighting I can handle. So I love watching other shows associated with the UFC. Like TUF or Looking for a fight. I can enjoy my mma and get a taste of new comer fighters well getting a break from watching fights. If I wasn't watching those I would be watching some show unconnected to MMA to give me a break, so TUF lets me have my break well still staying in the loop and getting ahead in a way.
Besides, the TUF fights may be lower level, but they aren't lower than DWTNCS, and that is getting views, so clearly the level of fighter isn't what is stopping viewers.
 
Dunno if serra should be counted as a tuf fighter being that he was in ufc prior to being on show.
I would say so. Season 4 and season 25 were alumni seasons, just because those fighters were previously in the UFC doesn't mean those seasons don't count towards TUF. The only exception might be James Krause because he was the only fighter who was currently in the UFC at the time when they put him in TUF.
It is irrelevant anyways because I was stating current UFC champs in this post, so that person listing Serra didn't count anyways.
 
Fighters jump at the oppertunity to be on TUF. Most unsigned fighter (meaning not in UFC or Bellator) are quick to go on TUF. The goal of most fighters is to be in the UFC and it is so hard to break in, even if you have a great record you can easily get lost in the crowd. As for 5-0's and 12-4 type records good luck ever getting noticed by the UFC, your chance is 1 in 100. TUF is an in.

Are you talking about now or back in 2005? Although I don't exactly agree with you for either scenario.

doozer said:
Besides, the TUF fights may be lower level, but they aren't lower than DWTNCS, and that is getting views, so clearly the level of fighter isn't what is stopping viewers.

That's the wrong way of looking at it. There is so much MMA nowadays to choose from that even the most obsessive fight fan can't watch all of it.

Back in 2002 or so, there were about 5 UFC events a year that had 8 matches per show and about 6 PRIDE events, with 8 matches per show. If you watched all of that, you saw almost all the relevant MMA there was back then. 88 fights tops.

NOW? The UFC alone holds 39 events in 2018, with about 12 fights per card. That's 468 fights JUST for the UFC alone. Not counting TUF or DWTNCS. That's more than 5 times what there was back in 2002. And don't even get me started on all the Bellator, Rizin, One FC, PFL, the major regional promotions (ABC, M-1, and Fight Nights Global in Russia ALONE)

Naturally, not everyone has the appetite or time to watch so much more MMA. While it was no big deal to watch TUF in addition to a UFC and PRIDE card once every two months back in 2005, that's no longer the case.
 
TUF is a fucking joke. A tremendous snooze fest that is always in the shadows of the UFC.
Put on it on:
Fight Pass
YouTube channel
 
I often hear that TUF isn't relevant anymore. And it appeared that way for a while, the first few seasons made future champs and then there was a dead zone. But recently it has become very relevant again.
As of Nov 4th 2017, after TJ and Rose took their titles and before GSP beat Bisping there were 5 TUF alum UFC Champions.
1. Michael Bisping Middleweight Champ
2. Robert Whittaker Interm Middleweight Champ
3. Tony Ferguson Interm Lightweight Champ
4. T.J. Dillashaw Bantamweight Champ
5. Rose Namajunas Woman's Strawweight Champ

GSP beat Bisping to bring it down to 4, but then Nicco Montano won the Flyweight Champ to bring it back to 5.
And Finally Tony got injured and stripped. So we currently stand at 4.
I understand Nicco was a guaranteed title for TUF. But compared to the number of non-TUF fighters who fight in the UFC verus TUF fighters each year and the total number of belts TUF fighters are doing well above average.
Not when I can’t even watch it on Fight Pass...
 
Me personally, I generally skip half the show and go straight to the fight anyway. Format is a bit stale. Reality TV in general isn’t what it used to be.

When it first came out (reality tv) the internet was pretty fresh still. So most people fully believed half the drama. Nowadays it’s hard to not think it’s just largely scripted. Not saying it is, just the glass has been broken now.
 
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