What am I missing? - Jones' Asking Price

[krelianx]

Jones is claiming 8-10m for a fight with Ngannou is "not nearly enough."

Now, Jones has never sold over 869k ppvs (Cormier 2). Nor has Ngannou, for that matter.

Let us take what we know of UFC 200 as an example:

UFC 200, Jul 9, 2016.

Total Revenue: $55,279,396
Other Costs: $12,848,217
Fighter Compensation: $19,905,008
Total Costs: $32,753,225

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2020/6/...much-does-jon-jones-make-fighting-for-the-ufc

That's with a card with: Lesnar, Cormier, Silva, Nunes, Tate, Aldo, Edgar, Cain...

It sold 1 million buys.

Brock's purse was 2.5m. Even assuming he made thrice as much in undisclosed bonuses, we are talking 7.5m. Jones is saying 10m is not nearly enough to fight Francis.

Khabib vs. McGregor made 2.6m. Conor's purse was 3m, Khabib was 6m. again, assuming the actual amount is triple disclosed: we are looking at 9m and 18m for the biggest fight in UFC history, with the biggest star in the sport's history, by a long shot.

Even assuming the event with Jones and Ngannou makes around 1.2m/1.3m and makes around $60m-70m in revenue, if they paid 15m to Jones and 10m to Ngganou, that would be 25m in fighter compensation costs only in the main event. That would be 2.5x higher than what Khabib and Conor made for a 2.6m ppv, and more 5m over the total pay for UFC 200 which included Lesnar and all the other guys that competed there.

 

[Ares Black]

Jones is trying to price himself out of the fight IMO.

 

[DS66]

While I agree with most of what you're saying, I think part of the point is that UFC fighters have been historically underpaid, especially compared to elite boxers. So just because fighters were underpaid in the past, does not necessarily mean that Jones should accept being underpaid now.

Having said that, he does seem to be asking for too much here... but that's how negotiations work. You have to start high, sometimes absurdly so, if you want to end up actually getting what you believe is right.

 

[maximus__]

Jones is claiming 8-10m for a fight with Ngannou is not nearly enough. Now, Jones has never sold over 869k ppvs, nor Ngannou for that matter.

Let us take what we know of UFC 200 as an example:

UFC 200, Jul 9, 2016.

Total Revenue: $55,279,396
Other Costs: $12,848,217
Fighter Compensation: $19,905,008
Total Costs: $32,753,225

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2020/6/...much-does-jon-jones-make-fighting-for-the-ufc

That's with a card with: Lesnar, Cormier, Silva, Nunes, Tate, also, Edgar, Cain. It sold 1 million buys.

Brock's purse was 2.5m. Even assuming he made thrice as much in undisclosed bonuses, we are talking 7.5m. Jones is saying 10m is not enough to fight Francis.

Khabib vs. McGregor made 2.6m. Conor's purse was 3m, Khabib was 6m. again, assuming the actual amount is double disclosed: we are looking at 6m and 12m for the biggest fight in UFC history.

Even assuming the event with Jones and Ngannou makes around 1.2m and makes around $60m-70m in revenue, if they paid 15m to Jones and 10m to Ngganou, that would be 25m in fighter compensation costs only in the main event. That would be 2.5x higher than what Khabib and Conor made for a 2.6m ppv, and more 5m over the total pay for UFC 200 which included Lesnar and all the other guys that competed there.

Ngganou deserves to get paid more than Jones.Champ vs Challenger.
They are both unproven to sell 1m PPVs and don't deserve that much cash based off previous fights.

 

[blaseblah]

Jones is claiming 8-10m for a fight with Ngannou is not nearly enough. Now, Jones has never sold over 869k ppvs, nor Ngannou for that matter.

Let us take what we know of UFC 200 as an example:

UFC 200, Jul 9, 2016.

Total Revenue: $55,279,396
Other Costs: $12,848,217
Fighter Compensation: $19,905,008
Total Costs: $32,753,225

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2020/6/...much-does-jon-jones-make-fighting-for-the-ufc

That's with a card with: Lesnar, Cormier, Silva, Nunes, Tate, Aldo, Edgar, Cain...

It sold 1 million buys.

Brock's purse was 2.5m. Even assuming he made thrice as much in undisclosed bonuses, we are talking 7.5m. Jones is saying 10m is not enough to fight Francis.

Khabib vs. McGregor made 2.6m. Conor's purse was 3m, Khabib was 6m. again, assuming the actual amount is double disclosed: we are looking at 6m and 12m for the biggest fight in UFC history.

Even assuming the event with Jones and Ngannou makes around 1.2m/1.3m and makes around $60m-70m in revenue, if they paid 15m to Jones and 10m to Ngganou, that would be 25m in fighter compensation costs only in the main event. That would be 2.5x higher than what Khabib and Conor made for a 2.6m ppv, and more 5m over the total pay for UFC 200 which included Lesnar and all the other guys that competed there.

You have no idea what those fighters got paid. Pure speculation. For top level fighters the majority of the money they make is from the PPV side.

 

[Kvothe_the_kingkiller]

I missed him saying $8m-$10m is not enough. Do you have a source for that?

He confirmed he makes $5m and wants more than that. He denied he ever asked as high as $30m. I thought that's all we had so far.

I assumed $15m-$20m was his middle ground, but I hadn't heard he flat out said $10m was too low.

Anyway, I don't think you're missing anything. He wants a bigger piece of the pie. And if it's heavily PPV point based instead of flat, then the more PPVs sell, the more Jon AND UFC make.

 

[krelianx]

Ngganou deserves to get paid more than Jones.Champ vs Challenger.
They are both unproven to sell 1m PPVs and don't deserve that much cash based off previous fights.

So if they both make 15m, that's 30 million in only fighter compensation from the main event. If you exclude other fighter costs, going by UFC 200 numbers, and you add around 13m, you are looking at 43m in costs between the main event and non-fighter pay. If the event makes 60m in revenue that leaves you 17m for fighter pay and for company profit. Assuming you leave the rest of the card with low draws and spend 2m in the other 12 fights...

 

[krelianx]

I missed him saying $8m-$10m is not enough. Do you have a source for that?

He confirmed he makes $5m and wants more than that. He denied he ever asked as high as $30m. I thought that's all we had so far.

I assumed $15m-$20m was his middle ground, but I hadn't heard he flat out said $10m was too low.

Check his twitter.

 

[MCDojoMMA]

It is his pathetic way to Duck this fight. Jones wont fight again. One of the best is retired now.

 

[snackgod]

Jones is claiming 8-10m for a fight with Ngannou is not nearly enough. Now, Jones has never sold over 869k ppvs, nor Ngannou for that matter.

Let us take what we know of UFC 200 as an example:

UFC 200, Jul 9, 2016.

Total Revenue: $55,279,396
Other Costs: $12,848,217
Fighter Compensation: $19,905,008
Total Costs: $32,753,225

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2020/6/...much-does-jon-jones-make-fighting-for-the-ufc

That's with a card with: Lesnar, Cormier, Silva, Nunes, Tate, Aldo, Edgar, Cain...

It sold 1 million buys.

Brock's purse was 2.5m. Even assuming he made thrice as much in undisclosed bonuses, we are talking 7.5m. Jones is saying 10m is not enough to fight Francis.

Khabib vs. McGregor made 2.6m. Conor's purse was 3m, Khabib was 6m. again, assuming the actual amount is double disclosed: we are looking at 6m and 12m for the biggest fight in UFC history.

Even assuming the event with Jones and Ngannou makes around 1.2m/1.3m and makes around $60m-70m in revenue, if they paid 15m to Jones and 10m to Ngganou, that would be 25m in fighter compensation costs only in the main event. That would be 2.5x higher than what Khabib and Conor made for a 2.6m ppv, and more 5m over the total pay for UFC 200 which included Lesnar and all the other guys that competed there.

it called back tracking from moving up to heavyweight.

 

[Kvothe_the_kingkiller]

Check his twitter.

lol ya right.

 

[cauti0n]

The fans of this sport fucking suck. So much pushback on this topic is ridiculous.

 

[TheGreatA]

You have to add a couple of millions as hazard pay.

 

[Fergelmince]

Jones is claiming 8-10m for a fight with Ngannou is not nearly enough. Now, Jones has never sold over 869k ppvs, nor Ngannou for that matter.

Let us take what we know of UFC 200 as an example:

UFC 200, Jul 9, 2016.

Total Revenue: $55,279,396
Other Costs: $12,848,217
Fighter Compensation: $19,905,008
Total Costs: $32,753,225

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2020/6/...much-does-jon-jones-make-fighting-for-the-ufc

That's with a card with: Lesnar, Cormier, Silva, Nunes, Tate, Aldo, Edgar, Cain...

It sold 1 million buys.

Brock's purse was 2.5m. Even assuming he made thrice as much in undisclosed bonuses, we are talking 7.5m. Jones is saying 10m is not enough to fight Francis.

Khabib vs. McGregor made 2.6m. Conor's purse was 3m, Khabib was 6m. again, assuming the actual amount is double disclosed: we are looking at 6m and 12m for the biggest fight in UFC history.

Even assuming the event with Jones and Ngannou makes around 1.2m/1.3m and makes around $60m-70m in revenue, if they paid 15m to Jones and 10m to Ngganou, that would be 25m in fighter compensation costs only in the main event. That would be 2.5x higher than what Khabib and Conor made for a 2.6m ppv, and more 5m over the total pay for UFC 200 which included Lesnar and all the other guys that competed there.

The fight is bigger than the fighters in the fight, so forecasting by using either fighters' ppv history is not altogether the best indicator.

 

[daPROFESSOR]

He is negotiating openly. This is his way of telling the ufc where to start. Not lower than 8-10M

 

[Zebra Cheeks]

While I agree with most of what you're saying, I think part of the point is that UFC fighters have been historically underpaid, especially compared to elite boxers. So just because fighters were underpaid in the past, does not necessarily mean that Jones should accept being underpaid now.

Having said that, he does seem to be asking for too much here... but that's how negotiations work. You have to start high, sometimes absurdly so, if you want to end up actually getting what you believe is right.

You always want to start strong and ask for a number where if you’re asked to split the difference, you end up at a number you can live with.

The classic scenario is that if someone offers you 1 million, you ask for 2 million, and both parties want to negotiate in good faith, you end up at 1.5.

The problem is, and I’m sure Jon knows this from dealing with the ufc many times, the ufc doesn’t normally negotiate in good faith. They are the best organization and they know that it’s easier for them to get another fighter than it is for jones to get another organization.

Realistically, it probably looks more like this

Ufc: we’ll pay you 5 million

Jones: that’s not close. I don’t think I would even do it for 8-10 million (likely angling for something around 9-15)

UFC: fair point, we’ve taken your feedback into account. Well offer 6 million, and we’ll throw in (random intangible worth 10-100k) Final offer.

They don’t negotiate in good faith. I’m not saying that I know for a fact that Jones does either, but I think we all know the UFC pushes these guys around.

 

[avenue94]

Jones is claiming 8-10m for a fight with Ngannou is "not nearly enough."

Now, Jones has never sold over 869k ppvs (Cormier 2). Nor has Ngannou, for that matter.

Let us take what we know of UFC 200 as an example:

UFC 200, Jul 9, 2016.

Total Revenue: $55,279,396
Other Costs: $12,848,217
Fighter Compensation: $19,905,008
Total Costs: $32,753,225

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2020/6/...much-does-jon-jones-make-fighting-for-the-ufc

That's with a card with: Lesnar, Cormier, Silva, Nunes, Tate, Aldo, Edgar, Cain...

It sold 1 million buys.

Brock's purse was 2.5m. Even assuming he made thrice as much in undisclosed bonuses, we are talking 7.5m. Jones is saying 10m is not nearly enough to fight Francis.

Khabib vs. McGregor made 2.6m. Conor's purse was 3m, Khabib was 6m. again, assuming the actual amount is triple disclosed: we are looking at 9m and 18m for the biggest fight in UFC history, with the biggest star in the sport's history, by a long shot.

Even assuming the event with Jones and Ngannou makes around 1.2m/1.3m and makes around $60m-70m in revenue, if they paid 15m to Jones and 10m to Ngganou, that would be 25m in fighter compensation costs only in the main event. That would be 2.5x higher than what Khabib and Conor made for a 2.6m ppv, and more 5m over the total pay for UFC 200 which included Lesnar and all the other guys that competed there.

If your promoter is making more money than the actual star fighter (if not star fighters combined), then your sport's pay structure is ass backwards. End of story. Unless you think the UFC brand is more important than Conor or Ronda, let alone them combined.

 

[maximus__]

So if they both make 15m, that's 30 million in only fighter compensation from the main event. If you exclude other fighter costs, going by UFC 200 numbers, and you add around 13m, you are looking at 43m in costs between the main event and non-fighter pay. If the event makes 60m in revenue that leaves you 17m for fighter pay and for company profit. Assuming you leave the rest of the card with low draws and spend 2m in the other 12 fights...

Put it on a fight night card..... Derrick Lewis said he will do it for 7-8 mil. That's the fight to make because my understanding is Jones doesn't even have a date for when he is ready for HW. Jones is pricing himself out and definitely looking for that last big pay day. He should have kept the title and had it as a champ vs champ fight.

 

[laleggenda27]

Jones has been talking about moving to HW for 10 years, yet people still fall for the okie doke. The vast majority of what Jones says is an attempt to get attention--nothing more. Maybe he's serious this time, but I'll believe it when I see it. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he "changed his mind" and decided to fight Jan instead.

 

[Antix]

You always want to start strong and ask for a number where if you’re asked to split the difference, you end up at a number you can live with.

The classic scenario is that if someone offers you 1 million, you ask for 2 million, and both parties want to negotiate in good faith, you end up at 1.5.

The problem is, and I’m sure Jon knows this from dealing with the ufc many times, the ufc doesn’t normally negotiate in good faith. They are the best organization and they know that it’s easier for them to get another fighter than it is for jones to get another organization.

Realistically, it probably looks more like this

Ufc: we’ll pay you 5 million

Jones: that’s not close. I don’t think I would even do it for 8-10 million (likely angling for something around 9-15)

UFC: fair point, we’ve taken your feedback into account. Well offer 6 million, and we’ll throw in (random intangible worth 10-100k) Final offer.

They don’t negotiate in good faith. I’m not saying that I know for a fact that Jones does either, but I think we all know who the UFC pushes these guys around.

Good breakdown.

I’m no fan of Jones but understand what he’s doing, he knows how risky a fight this is and how dangerous Ngannou is.

If Ngannou starches him he’s not going to be anywhere near the money he’s asking for again. This is an “all the chips on the table” fight, buy in, risk it all, cash out.