International Hamas launches surprise attack on Israel; Israel has declared a state of war. Vol. VII

[Strychnine]

This is ugly all around. Israeli anti Netanyahu protests started again. Things were ugly before on the world stage. This aid convoy killing is a massive embarrassing mess.

Good! Get Netanyahu the fudge outta there!

 

[Rational Poster]

Jews are an ethnic group, dont they claim they are descended from the ancient judeans and thats why they have a claim to the Levant after 2000 years? At most you can call it an ethnodemocracy. Israel was designed from the ground up by zionism to be a jewish state run solely by jews where they have the final say in everything. So make no mistake, the moment there is a risk of demographic changes which would favor the arabs, Israel would cease to be a democracy.

I mean obviously Israel was created as with the intention of providing a safe haven for Jewish people from all over the world. But it still remains a secular democracy with representation in government for all ethnic groups.

 

[sangreporsangre]

 

[tastaylvr]

I mean obviously Israel was created as with the intention of providing a safe haven for Jewish people from all over the world. But it still remains a secular democracy with representation in government for all ethnic groups.

Lol I’m sure South Africa and America said the same thing during their apartheid regimes

 

[Rod1]

What makes you think it won't resume?

When the population is already in famine stage, how many lives do you think will be lost until aid arrives? especially when aid was already insufficient.

You realize that when civilians are being used as human shields, they can be misidentified as combatants, right?

Except this was not the case.

But these scenarios did happen in real life. Journalists embedded with Hamas terrorists, ambulances used to transport arms, etc.

But we aren't arguing about those scenarios, we are arguing about this one.

Hamas already broke a ceasefire once by firing rockets into Israel. Are you aware of this happening?

Are you aware that you can actually fight a war without intentionally murdering aid workers?

They apologized

Again.

and promised to investigate what went wrong. What more could you ask from them? If they're taking steps to learn from this mistake and never repeat it,

What steps? what kind of investigation?

is that not a valid form of apology?

No.

This is ridiculous. Do you see Hamas making these kinds of concessions after they commit a mistake like that one time they misfired one of their own rockets near a hospital?

And here we go, Hamas is bad, so its ok for Israel to murder aid workers.

Why exactly are you holding the Israelis to a higher standard than the Gazans?

I am? weird, i don't think i have ever defended Hamas.

Every time I see the Palestinians fuck up, there's not a single mea culpa nor even an acknowledgement of their error, for that matter. All the blame specifically goes to Israel or the Jews. This self-entitled attitude and avoidance of accepting responsibility really go to show how emotionally stunted they are as a whole. This kind of behavior is what you normally expect from a petulant child.

From who? because i saw massive condemnation of Hamas actions from everywhere around the world.

 

[Samjj]

When the population is already in famine stage, how many lives do you think will be lost until aid arrives? especially when aid was already insufficient.


Except this was not the case.


But we aren't arguing about those scenarios, we are arguing about this one.


Are you aware that you can actually fight a war without intentionally murdering aid workers?


Again.




What steps? what kind of investigation?


No.


And here we go, Hamas is bad, so its ok for Israel to murder aid workers.


I am? weird, i don't think i have ever defended Hamas.


From who? because i saw massive condemnation of Hamas actions from everywhere around the world.

What do you think an appropriate apology and investigation would look like? An immediate ceasefire? This one seems like it really hit home with you. Were you an aid worker in a developing country?

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Fair point.

He perhaps has more subtlety than I give him credit for.

Maybe I need to work on that a little.

I basically have him as a toilet basin dweller, but he clearly has at least some skill in the political sphere beyond raging Zionist hatemonger.

I don't know if subtlety is the right word. Much like Trump, he knows how to prey upon his base's fears, and he's also adept at forming strategic alliances which help him gain and keep power. I have to give it to him in that he knows how to survive (like a cockroach), which is why I doubt he'd risk ordering such an immensely stupid act like targeting an aid group.

 

[Rod1]

What do you think an appropriate apology and investigation would look like? An immediate ceasefire? This one seems like it really hit home with you.

An appropriate apology would be to bring reparations for the damage caused, establish a safe zone for aid workers to do their work.

Were you an aid worker in a developing country?

No, but I'm a fan of World Central Kitchen for the work they did in Ukraine, and Israel having the gall to target Westerners is not something i believe the collective West should let it slide unpunished.

Unlike a lot of people, i don't pretend i care for all lives the same, I'm extremely pissed at them targeting these people in the same way a shitload of Israelis were pissed at the murder of Yuval Castleman.

Except that with Yuval Castleman, we know Bibi actually cares about his perception in Israel, he doesn't gives a shit about his perception in the West because he knows the leadership is 100% pro-Israel, at the very least i think there ought to be a court martial for the people involved, someone to take the fall.

We all know that Israel doesn't has the same standards as the West, we all know that if Yuvel Castleman had been a Palestinians his execution would had been unpunished, lets not pretend also that we are super concerned about the lives of Palestinians or Muslims in general, for the most part its a different culture and humans tend to not be as empathic with different people.

Israel really needs to fix this in a way that they make clear they understand not to fuck around with the wrong people.

 

[Samjj]

An appropriate apology would be to bring reparations for the damage caused, establish a safe zone for aid workers to do their work.


No, but I'm a fan of World Central Kitchen for the work they did in Ukraine, and Israel having the gall to target Westerners is not something i believe the collective West should let it slide unpunished.

Unlike a lot of people, i don't pretend i care for all lives the same, I'm extremely pissed at them targeting these people in the same way a shitload of Israelis were pissed at the murder of Yuval Castleman.

Except that with Yuval Castleman, we know Bibi actually cares about his perception in Israel, he doesn't gives a shit about his perception in the West because he knows the leadership is 100% pro-Israel, at the very least i think there ought to be a court martial for the people involved, someone to take the fall.

We all know that Israel doesn't has the same standards as the West, we all know that if Yuvel Castleman had been a Palestinians his execution would had been unpunished, lets not pretend also that we are super concerned about the lives of Palestinians or Muslims in general, for the most part its a different culture and humans tend to not be as empathic with different people.

Israel really needs to fix this in a way that they make clear they understand not to fuck around with the wrong people.

Logistics supply for a hostile civilian population by a waring army is pretty logistically complicated, particularly when your enemy disguises and embeds himself amongst innocents. I don’t see what you’re demanding as an apology as realistic. I appreciate the sentiment though… I have been in different development projects in Central America, Africa, and Sri Lanka in different capacities over the years. I was in northern Ethiopia right before the outbreak of the civil war in 2019 but was lucky to leave before the hostilities started - so I get the tragedy here.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Yes. Obviously, because he did. Do you have any other argument for this being an accident? They literally are admitting this was targeted, claiming they saw some guy that had a gun when they arrived to the center to drop off materials (LOL).

You may want to do more homework on this, you've already admitted to not knowing basic facts (that were posted in here already)...

They obviously fired and killed a bunch of people, but the argument is why did they do it. You're saying that they don't care about public perception and just wanted to starve and punish the Palestinians. I disagree, and say that they actually do care about how they are perceived as their funding and the economic sanctions placed on them are based on how they are perceived.

Why would Bibi call this a "tragic" mistake if he didn't care about public opinion, why wouldn't he just shut the hell up and move on?

 

[Snubnoze707]

They obviously fired and killed a bunch of people, but the argument is why did they do it. You're saying that they don't care about public perception and just wanted to starve and punish the Palestinians. I disagree, and say that they actually do care about how they are perceived as their funding and the economic sanctions placed on them are based on how they are perceived.

Why would Bibi call this a "tragic" mistake if he didn't care about public opinion, why wouldn't he just shut the hell up and move on?

You're acting like this is something new and that the IDF hasn't already been slaughtering aid workers for months already.

This is only making news because it is so blatantly obvious.

You didn't answer your own question about "why" they did it, just shifted to some useless argument about "perception"... so why do you think they intentionally bombed those people?

 

[Rod1]

I don’t see what you’re demanding as an apology as realistic. I appreciate the sentiment though…

They should at least be honest and pay reparations to the family.

Westerners risked their hide by going to Gaza, a place where they would be a prime target as hostages, in order to feed starving people, they didn't deserved this.

 

[Samjj]

They should at least be honest and pay reparations to the family.

Westerners risked their hide by going to Gaza, a place where they would be a prime target as hostages, in order to feed starving people, they didn't deserved this.

I don't think reparations are outside of the realm of possibility. I wouldn't be surprised if that happens.

They absolutely did not deserve what they got. Having put myself in stupidly dangerous positions before out of good will, I can say that you're usually invested in the "mission" of what you're doing and are not always aware of the danger that you put yourself in.

I hope their families are ok...

 

[Chad R. Thundercock]

A baby murderer is a beneficiary of the Pay for Slay program of the Palestinian Authority.

Barbarians.

 

[Chad R. Thundercock]

I don't know about taunting a poster like that, but what I do know is this atrocity is far easier to prove than the Al Shifa Command Center nonsense.

You think it's nonsense? Then how do you explain the recent discovery of weapon caches and the deaths of Hamas terrorists at al-Shifa?

 

[KnightTemplar]

Whole world is watching Israel.

At some point, plausible deniability isn't going to fly. The people defending Israel's actions no matter what are losing more and more credibility.

The whole world might be watching, but America is the only one that matters. And this is an election year. If Biden wants a second term, he can't be seen to not support Israel.

No matter how many aid workers are killed.

 

[meauneau]

A baby murderer is a beneficiary of the Pay for Slay program of the Palestinian Authority.

Barbarians.

They showed you the pay slip?

Why have you never posted anything about the thousands of Palestinian children murdered by the IDF? They are not equal, right?

 

[tastaylvr]

They showed you the pay slip?

Why have you never posted anything about the thousands of Palestinian children murdered by the IDF? They are not equal, right?

His father who is apparently 80 was a Muslim back in the day in Saudi Arabia then he converted to Judaism then Christianity and this has left some sort of scar on his soul where he wants every Muslim dead

Now he 50 years old slinging propaganda on a karate forum

 

[Chad R. Thundercock]

They showed you the pay slip?

Why have you never posted anything about the thousands of Palestinian children murdered by the IDF? They are not equal, right?

Palestinian Authority Martyrs Fund - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Do you see the Israeli government handing out money to its citizens who murder Palestinians? Anti-semitic piece of shit.

 

[Samjj]

His father who is apparently 80 was a Muslim back in the day in Saudi Arabia then he converted to Judaism then Christianity and this has left some sort of scar on his soul where he wants every Muslim dead

Now he 50 years old slinging propaganda on a karate forum

Try again on that propaganda charge ol' buddy.

Palestinian Authority Martyrs Fund - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org