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Tae Kwon Do

Get ready, because this is going to come as a shock to you and the rest of sherdog...

WE KNOW HOW TO KICK PEOPLE IN THE BALLS AND PUNCH THEM IN THEY THROAT AND POKE THEM IN THE EYE!!! THESE ARE NOT SOME MASTERFUL TECHNIQUES ONLY KNOWN TO JASON BOURNE AND TKD GRANDMASTERS. INDEED WE CAN DO THESE FASTER AND BETTER BECAUSE OUR OVER ALL TECHNIQUE IS 99% BETTER.


get ready because this is going to come as a shock to you and the rest of the MT nut huggers...

YOU FIGHT HOW YOU TRAIN!! IF YOU TRAIN WITH GLOVES ON, MOST LIKELY YOUR FIRST REACTION IN A STREET FIGHT IS TO PUNCH, NOT EYE GOUGE!!! WHEN CONFRONTED ON THE STREET, THE FIRST THING ON YOUR MIND IS TO THROW THAT JAB ROUNDHOUSE COMBO YOU'VE BEEN PRACTICING, NOT FISH HOOK!!!
 
Feel free to post a vid of TKD people sparring/training fish hooks, eye gouges, biting, scratching etc.
 
You know what? You're absolutely right, you can see my round kick coming a mile off. But here's more food for thought: maybe at long range MT and TKD are more equal than people give them credit for, you can't KO me and I can't KO you; so inevitibly the fight is going to go to punching range and the clinch. So how are your flashy kicks and footwork going to save you their? Deep down inside you and every other TKDer know that as soon as a Nak Muay, BJJer, boxer or MMA student is within arms reach of you, we'll drop you like a bad habit. Don't deny it.

this guy knows what he is talking about.
 
Feel free to post a vid of TKD people sparring/training fish hooks, eye gouges, biting, scratching etc.

No one in here ever said that these techniques were trained in TKD. The reference was in regard to top GOV'T/Elite Military/Secret Service. Not anyone from any formal TMA background.
 
this guy knows what he is talking about.

This guy knows little. Here's one thing about fighting that's completely non-discriminative of discipline: If you telegraph your attacks then it greatly decreases your chance of connecting. It also greatly increases your chance of getting countered.
Ever watch Boxing?? The great fighters practice clean non-telegraphic technique and train to react and capitalize on any movement, stance, or habit that their opponent has.

So if you stand tall, step forward and outside with your lead foot and swing your arms before you kick, a good fighter, whether a boxer, wrestler, karateka or judoka will read and react.
 
No one in here ever said that these techniques were trained in TKD. The reference was in regard to top GOV'T/Elite Military/Secret Service. Not anyone from any formal TMA background.
I stand corrected.

In that case than can someone post a vid of ANYBODY sparring with fish hooks, eye gouges, biting, scratching etc. I don't care what style, just want to see how it is taught...
 
God when I saw that episode of fight quest on Krav maga all I saw were some weapon techniques, brutal conditioning, huge brawls and a women who was like 60 pounds lighter than everybody fuck up everybody. I mean I would rather have someone who practiced kicking the nuts etc experience than no experience at all. 1 is better than 0 right?
 
God when I saw that episode of fight quest on Krav maga all I saw were some weapon techniques, brutal conditioning, huge brawls and a women who was like 60 pounds lighter than everybody fuck up everybody. I mean I would rather have someone who practiced kicking the nuts etc experience than no experience at all. 1 is better than 0 right?

agreed.
 
So if you stand tall, step forward and outside with your lead foot and swing your arms before you kick, a good fighter, whether a boxer, wrestler, karateka or judoka will read and react.
So would a NakMuay because that is not proper technique. Its not done step by step, that is all done in one single motion, and it is supposed to be timed or set up. Even then, just knowing you are about to have a Thai kick thrown at you doesn't always mean you can do anything about it.
 
get ready because this is going to come as a shock to you and the rest of the MT nut huggers...

YOU FIGHT HOW YOU TRAIN!! IF YOU TRAIN WITH GLOVES ON, MOST LIKELY YOUR FIRST REACTION IN A STREET FIGHT IS TO PUNCH, NOT EYE GOUGE!!! WHEN CONFRONTED ON THE STREET, THE FIRST THING ON YOUR MIND IS TO THROW THAT JAB ROUNDHOUSE COMBO YOU'VE BEEN PRACTICING, NOT FISH HOOK!!!

NO. IT. WONT. And as I and everyone else who knows what their talking about have pointed out, how in the fuck to you expect to do all these masterful techniques you mention:rolleyes: against someone whos kneeing, punching and elbowing you in the face? Are you twelve? You talk about fish hooking, throat ripping and eye gouging like they're some amazing undefendable moves that you'll just easily get 100% of the time, and you're saying you'll do this against strong, fast, trained fighters. For your sake I hope you never get into a fight and try to pull that shit because you're eyes will be opened quick, fast and in a hurry.

I don't recall the issue or author, I want to say Kelly McCann BUT I MIGHT BE MISTAKEN (and sense you probably don't know who that is, he's one of the foremost experts of hand to hand combat on earth) in BB magazine, but in this article he mentioned two things, more or less:

1) The best overall self defense methods are Boxing (for striking), Muay Thai (for clinch) and the Philipino arts (for weapons). Along with some form of grappling...

2) He recalled a story from Hawaii where some "trained killer" douchebag sound familiar? just kidding, I kid with love... Anyway said "trained killer" douchebag tried his whole running in and gouging his opponent. Little did "trained killer" douchebag know that his opponent was a boxer and jiu jitsu player. Well long story short the fighter got trained killer douchebag in his mount AND STARTED GOUGING BACK.

You might get your ball kick and eye poke in on someone, true story but you better hope you do kill them with that first hit or you might get just as good as you give. And I encourage you to think on this, because I truly wouldn't want any bad to come to anyone no matter how naieve they are: you might get your eye gouge or your ball kick in, hell you might even win, but until you do... YOU'RE IN THEIR WORLD SON.

P.S.: bahahaha isn't it ironic how "trained killer" douchebag is TKD...ha ha ha
 
So would a NakMuay because that is not proper technique. Its not done step by step, that is all done in one single motion, and it is supposed to be timed or set up. Even then, just knowing you are about to have a Thai kick thrown at you doesn't always mean you can do anything about it.

See video:

YouTube - Muay Thai training - kicks

It instructs one two take a 45 degree step and swing their arm down away from their face. What percentage of mid or high roundhouse kicks land in MMA, K-1, or MT bouts??? Not many.

Compare that to a TKD vid:
YouTube - Revolution Of Kicking Vol 1 (RoundHouse Kick)

and Karate:
YouTube - Kyokushin Karate Jodan Mawashi Geri KOs

Yes you can generate more power by expanding the degree of rotation by the 45 degree step but at what cost??
It's analgous to winding up for a haymaker rather than throwing a crisp, straight right cross.

I've done both so I know the difference.
P.S. The top-top level Thais don't take the step......most just throw it and try to land rather load up before throwing it.
 
You talk about fish hooking, throat ripping and eye gouging like they're some amazing undefendable moves that you'll just easily get 100% of the time, and you're saying you'll do this against strong, fast, trained fighters.


It all depends on the fighter. Can a 45 year old soccer mom who uses eye gouges and ball grabs defeat Anderson SIlva? No. Why? Because she doesnt have the necessary reflexes, speed, agility to pull them off.

Now you take me for instance, who has been training since middle school in various styles (MT included) who has the necessary reflexes and knowledge of spacing etc who has the mind set of taking someones eye out, breaking their knee cap, etc, and you have a very dangerous individual.
 
sorry but every time i hear TKD i think of point fighting. I respect it because anything that you dedicate yourself to is good, but i dont know how well it will help in many situations.
 
sorry but every time i hear TKD i think of point fighting.
Things must have changed since I competed in Karte, TKD, Kung fu championships bitd. TKD rules were 2 minute round, full contact, with full contact style judging by round. The only bummer was no hands to the head, which cost me a couple DQs.
 
Things must have changed since I competed in Karte, TKD, Kung fu championships bitd. TKD rules were 2 minute round, full contact, with full contact style judging by round. The only bummer was no hands to the head, which cost me a couple DQs.

this is the case of the people i knew, or at least the people i trained w/as most were older cats; but their students trained in a similar manner...

everytime i say this though people act as if im crazy or making sh*t up
 
TKD effectively split into two styles in the mid 60s, when Gen. Choi split left the KTA, left Korea and formed the ITF.

ITF never had a presence in Korea, where the rules would turn to full contact in various forms. ITF rules were never full contact, due in large part to whom they were teaching TKD - the West. Jhoon Rhee, the inventor of Saf-T gear, the original red gloves, booties and helmets most associated with point fighting, was associated with the ITF. This was in full swing during the 70s, right around the time the KTA was setting up the WTF as the worldwide governing body of TKD.

The KTA was more heavily influenced by a boxing mode of thinking, which is why full matches were 3 rounds by 3 minutes, cumulative score and emphasized hard, full contact.

During the time that the ITF was recruiting overseas Koreans, the KTA experimented with various sets of rules with the aim of promoting full power han-bang (one-shot) techniques and thus tried to come up with ways of protecting fighters. Various hogu were tried, starting with kendo bogu. One of the first TKD specific hogu were covered bamboo slats, which had to be audibly broken/split by hand or foot technique to score a point. This mentality lead to the phrase most often translated as "trembling shock" as a requisite for a scoring point. Up until the late 80s/early 90s, full 9 minute matches would often end in 0-1 or 2-1 type scores. Scores above 5 points were rare. Matches with that many heavy strikes being thrown usually ended in a knockout.

Some time in the 90s, this mentality was lost as WTF TKD became a full Olympic sport and emphasis shifted to speed and counterfighting. Because one of the flags for scoring criteria for a hard hit was the loud slap a foot makes on the hogu, elite players began playing for the sound and not the actual hit. Sports bureaucrats supported this because it made for a faster, more exciting (read: higher point) sport for spectators. The concept of trembling shock fell by the wayside. These days, power is an afterthought in the Olympic TKD game. It's fully allowable, but no longer really a requisite, despite the letter of the rules.
 
In my younger days (I'm 29) my old Karate school (hybrid - Kyokushin/Shotokan/Kempo/JJJ) shared a facility w a TKD belt factory.

While I won't go so far as to bash the entire style, what I saw at this dojo (and the stupid point fighting tournaments we would go to) were a bunch of teenagers with purchased black belts that threw high kicks with their hands by their sides and couldn't punch their way out of a paper bag. It wouldn't be fair to say ALL, but I'd say that applies to most of what I saw. Even Olympic TKD looks like kick tag to me.

I'm sure there are some tough and dangerous SOBs who know TKD. I just haven't met any that I know of.
 
TKD effectively split into two styles in the mid 60s, when Gen. Choi split left the KTA, left Korea and formed the ITF.

ITF never had a presence in Korea, where the rules would turn to full contact in various forms. ITF rules were never full contact, due in large part to whom they were teaching TKD - the West. Jhoon Rhee, the inventor of Saf-T gear, the original red gloves, booties and helmets most associated with point fighting, was associated with the ITF. This was in full swing during the 70s, right around the time the KTA was setting up the WTF as the worldwide governing body of TKD.

The KTA was more heavily influenced by a boxing mode of thinking, which is why full matches were 3 rounds by 3 minutes, cumulative score and emphasized hard, full contact.

During the time that the ITF was recruiting overseas Koreans, the KTA experimented with various sets of rules with the aim of promoting full power han-bang (one-shot) techniques and thus tried to come up with ways of protecting fighters. Various hogu were tried, starting with kendo bogu. One of the first TKD specific hogu were covered bamboo slats, which had to be audibly broken/split by hand or foot technique to score a point. This mentality lead to the phrase most often translated as "trembling shock" as a requisite for a scoring point. Up until the late 80s/early 90s, full 9 minute matches would often end in 0-1 or 2-1 type scores. Scores above 5 points were rare. Matches with that many heavy strikes being thrown usually ended in a knockout.

Some time in the 90s, this mentality was lost as WTF TKD became a full Olympic sport and emphasis shifted to speed and counterfighting. Because one of the flags for scoring criteria for a hard hit was the loud slap a foot makes on the hogu, elite players began playing for the sound and not the actual hit. Sports bureaucrats supported this because it made for a faster, more exciting (read: higher point) sport for spectators. The concept of trembling shock fell by the wayside. These days, power is an afterthought in the Olympic TKD game. It's fully allowable, but no longer really a requisite, despite the letter of the rules.

Very informative sir...
 
Having done some TKD (ITF) to a basic level, the only thing i took from it was a decent side kick which can come in handy in MT sparring as an unusual strike. Boxing did far more for me if im honest.

That said, the national champion who trained at the dojo did have some serious power and speed to his kicks, however he did cross train in BJJ.
 
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