Official Judo Thread

New year's resolutions for judo?

I'd just like to sort out my work hours and get down to training.
I need to try and get out to the high performance class, rather than just the standard class I've been going to. Unfortunately, because it's earlier, I have trouble getting to it after work. I'd like to get back into it enough that I could compete.
 
I need to try and get out to the high performance class, rather than just the standard class I've been going to. Unfortunately, because it's earlier, I have trouble getting to it after work. I'd like to get back into it enough that I could compete.
I feel ya.
 
Been concentrating on my neglected guard lately in jiu jitsu, but just decided to jump into a judo tournament, a little bigger than last time, in two weeks, so it looks like I will be doing some stand up to try to catch up haha
 
lean into your osoto/harai a little more and really push into your vector and you should be fine. you're coordinated enough you could probably dial in some footsweeps too. i know you're going for ippon, but being able to land on top and overwhelm people is also part of judo.

i'll venmo you a dollar if you win with a pin :)
 
I will have competition at the end of month, I wish myself luck, lol. Will be exciting for sure
 
i can't speak to the other continents, but here it's a labor of love. there's usually a per-diem to cover part of travel/food costs, maybe more for head refs, but that's about it. i'm only a regional ref, but i've never been offered or asked for pay, and i'd honestly feel bad if i was/had. i was thinking of getting my national cert this year, but i figure if i'm gonna travel to the sites where those test take place, i might as well play.

despite how disappointed people can be with the various unions and organizations, judo's definitely a grassroots sport. tournament fees cover costs, but that's about it.

personally, i don't even enjoy refereeing so much as i enjoy the opportunity to keep the sport going. we've only got one IJF ref left in the state, and he's been at it for i think 25-30 years. he and his wife have organized and hosted countless tournaments, and always make sure we're fed.

for as cantankerous and stubborn as some of the old guard can be about things, it's really humbling to take stock of how much time they've put in.
 
That explains why judo tournaments are cheap compared to BJJ.

That being said i dunno If I will do another judo tournament this year. I train way more BJJ than judo and still mostly lose in BJJ competition. I got thrown pretty hard at the last judo tournament because I was unprepared and I'd rather that not happen again. But I do feel like I'm getting better.
 
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You gotta keep pluggin away while you can man. You're only young once. That said, I tell people to ride out chokes, but tap or slap when they need to. Unless it's a big points/money tournament, it's better to save yourself the risk of injury than go out on your shield.
 
Step 1: Learn to perform the throws technically correct in static positions
Step 2: Learn methods to open up uke for attack for your technique
Step 3: Post randori videos of yourself

I have a strong suspicion #1 and #2 have not been worked on, so there really is little I can help with the randori side. The cold hard truth is that every throw/takedown you did was the result of poor balance of uke. I'd encourage you to study / post videos related to #1 and #2 instead.

Sorry to be harsh but you keep focusing on randori results.


It's been a while since I checked in here.


You left out practicing the throws dynamically, with appropriate movement patterns, unless you include that in Step 2.
 
yeah, there are no cumulative scores. you either get ippon, all the wazaris, or nothing.

the new rules are great. it was stupid leg grabs were penalized more harshly, and did not make the sport more dynamic or exciting.

i like how there are three pages that specifically clarify when it's okay to drop someone onto their head, but another page that says arm-in guillotines from guard 'endanger the neck'.

same with the bow-and-arrow: i don't think it's about grabbing the leg, i think it's about hyperextending the knee. there's a lot of leeway there.

again, none of this shit would be an issue if people cross-trained, but a lot of referees don't. it'd also be better if referees weren't so fucking overzealous. they're definitely trying to get us to back off and only intervene when necessary (blatant penalties, blatant stalling) but otherwise just let people play.

i'm personally kinda sick of hearing older folks unfamiliar with BJJ label techniques they've NEVER DONE as 'dangerous'. especially when those same techniques are done in white belt BJJ competition and nobody dies.

you know what's dangerous? throwing two white belts out there and having them throw each other ass-over-head AS HARD AS THEY CAN.

i've talked with our instructor a lot about this stuff, and we're both of the mind that we're not there to teach IJF Judo. it's silly to not teach canon judo techniques simply because somebody decided they were ILLEGAL. it's not like double legs ceased to exist. it's not like guillotines don't work. everything is unsafe if it's unfamiliar.

I thought they had moved back to wazari-awasete ippon... I checked (again) and indeed that is the rule for 2018-2020.

I've had different experiences with arm-in guilliotine, sometimes it's bad on my neck, other times not so much. We experimented with it a bit for a while, but dropped it from But I'm old and creaky...

A Hadaka Jime from front is still legal in Judo competition, as long as no neck-cranking happens.

I had a student competing in the Elite 8 Canadian nationals last weekend, and they had not implemented the awasete-ippon rule yet.
 
I just looked over the 2018 rules and couldn't believe it (maybe it was there before) - do they actually have exceptions (e.g. seoi toshi, sode tsuri komi goshi, and koshi guruma) on where "involuntary head defense" is legal? So you can legally spike someone now as long as it's accidental. I always interpreted the rules as it was up to tori to make sure the throw was safe. Only Exception would be if uke is trying to block the throw with their head. Next quadriplegic competitor should sue the IJF for this...

And we're trying to promote the same thing... good Judo. IJF rules have always been stupid and usually get worse upon revisions.

The rule change regarding "involuntary head defense" was put in so uke would not be penalized if he/she did not purposely block with their head.

The throws listed are ones in which that commonly happens.

It's still illegal to purposely spike someone on the head.

I'm glad to see they put in those exceptions, same with exceptions to 'leg grab' penalties. They are fairly common-place occurrences.
 
Studying it now. I actually feel like I had a good off balance, but I think I was hopping towards Osoto rather than committing hard to the Harai. If I hipped in, I think I would have thrown him, but the hesitation allowed him to set a body lock, plant and reverse the momentum. He really threw his weight between my legs (30+ lb difference between us) and the main thing was his right foot blocking mine, which I think really sent me flying. Curious to hear what the better judokas in this thread think about it. A break fall would have been nice, I landed on the point of my elbow and it is pretty bruised up and tender, a little swollen right now.

Anyways, this is how the match started:

This is how the match ended:



He was waiting on you, you walked right into it. Very nice counter on his part, to say the least. Not Kosoto Gari on his part, but that doesn't really matter. Look up Daki Wakari...

He had a wide base, and it looks like you tried to keep going sideways on the Osoto instead of hopping more to your left to cut the angle. It also looked like he was holding your leg then switched to a belt grip, but the video is fast and a bit blurry to my trifocals.

Trying to out-power a bigger guy who has some skill can be a dangerous game to play.
 
That's a good point, I was definitely trying to "hop" into Osoto to feel it out, and maybe i can't help but wonder what would have happened if I committed to one or the other. I watched it frame by frame in slow motion and I felt I had enough kuzushi that I should have been able to throw him despite the mechanical problems setting it up.

I agree with what Qing Tian wrote, if you look at your collar grip, you entered, and THEN tried to control his head. Too late...
 
There is difference between head diving (tori) and using head for defense (uke). If I understand correctly, head diving is still penalized.
Intentional landing on the head (eg. trying to use head to stop rolling seoi-nage) is still penalized. Accidental landing on the head won't.
That is my understanding as well.
 
I hope you're right and I'm wrong, but the Explanatory guide that was posted a few pages ago shows the exceptions (with pictures). Look at slide 12-14. Previously, if it was obvious tori was doing this in a match and tori wasn't trying to either come up to complete the throw or complete the rotation before hitting the mat, I'd have given hansokumake. Now, it's taking the judgement away from the ref and explicitly saying neither uke or tori will be penalized.

http://99e89a50309ad79ff91d-082b8fd...2017-10-26_Explanatory_guide_o-1509786984.pdf


For tori to get HSM, you have to believe that he intentionally tried to injure uke.

IME, that is a pretty tough hurdle to meet in a normal judo match. Of course, punching a guy in the nose would be obvious...

So in these cases, tori tries to throw, uke defends, but does not purposely use his head as a defense, hitting his head/face is a result of another type of defense, or a combo of tori weak/ineffective attack and uke defense (not using head on purpose).
 
Thank you for following through with that explanation. So in the example of uke front-bridging for a drop seoi-nage, it would still be hansokumake on uke, right? They're just pointing out the 3x exception throws where more incidental head contact with the mat would be expected.

Similarly, if tori grabs a lapel koshi guruma and just bulldogs uke's head into the mat, it'd still be hansokumake on tori. But I gotta say, from the pictures they included and naming exceptions, that wasn't very clear. I thought they were giving a green light on this type of practice.

No, it would not necessarily be HSM on tori...he has to have intent to injure uke.

Judo is tough, stuff happens. I've seen maybe 5 at most direct HSM for tori purposely trying to injure uke in 37 years of Judo. And I reffed extensively for 20+ of those years, too.
 
the old farts are really worried some kids are gonna break their necks trying to avoid being thrown, and want to discourage the problem from the top-down.

i can understand that. it'd be hard to bring new people into a sport where people run the risk of paralyzing themselves while attempting to circumvent the rules, and that's not even mentioning the concussion risks...

but like i've said, it blows my mind that guillotine chokes 'endanger the neck', yet we've also basically said that certain throws that may spike uke onto their head/face fall under the 'eh, shit happens' category...

getting thrown ass-over-head endangers your neck. period. far more than a fucking guillotine choke.

anatomically, your head bends in that direction.

were i king, the rule would simply be "any techniques that intend to hyperextend or twist the spinal column are illegal" - no twisting neck cranks, no reverse guillotines, no twisters, no lion tamers, no atlas cranks, no can openers.

Where are you guys finding that "guillotine choke" is now illegal in IJF competitions ? Neck crank, yes, always been illegal in Judo comps.

Same with the arm in guillotine...here is the quote from the IJF .pdf of the new "rules".
Kata-sankaku grip IJF RULES 2018-2020 (Kata sankaku is basically head and arm type positions)
Kata-sankaku grip in tachi-waza must be mate.
It is allowed to use kata-sankaku grip in newaza action.
Kata-sankaku in newaza is prohibited to block the opponents body with the legs and must be mate. (my comment: so you can't lock in dojime/full guard and apply an arm-in guillotine).

Mae Hadaka Jime is and has been legal in judo comps for as long as I've been doing Judo. You just cannot do a neck crank, and we all know what that looks like.
 
Been concentrating on my neglected guard lately in jiu jitsu, but just decided to jump into a judo tournament, a little bigger than last time, in two weeks, so it looks like I will be doing some stand up to try to catch up haha
Let us know how it goes !
 
It's been a while since I checked in here.


You left out practicing the throws dynamically, with appropriate movement patterns, unless you include that in Step 2.

A bit off topic, but I haven't found the common "movement" drills very helpful. Throwing a compliant uke while moving just requires simple adjustments, whereas getting your uke to react the way you want is comparatively difficult both in concept and execution.

Therefore, I would say that the process of opening up uke includes whatever movement pattern you need to accomplish the entry.

I would like there to be more resources on this topic. It is basically useless to show the end technique but virtually all Judo books or videos just focus on it.
 
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