Economy Updated project canceled: California bullet train costs soar to $77 billion

I've never been to New York or Boston so I can't speak that great on how their subway systems work but the only major American city that I have seen do public transit even half way decent is SLC with that rail system they have. It literally does a loop that cuts through the city center so you can get just about everywhere within a 1-4 block walk downtown.
 
Before I went to Vegas for the first time I had friends and coworkers telling me that it's dry heat so it's not as hot as here in FL. It was 117 degrees and hot as fuck. It was miserable.

47 degrees? Yeah, that is way too much. I've had that before in Australian heatwaves and it sucks major balls. Anything over 40 is too hot.

I actually prefer humidity to dry heat though. I find it way more comfortable and relaxing. Nothing worse than fucking windburn. Much rather sweat my balls off.

31 degree here right now in BKK which is about perfect for me. 25-33 is my preferred range with 27-30 being the sweet spot.
 
They should pay Germany or Japan to take over the project. They can do these things much more efficiently and without so much corruption. Of course that would rob the crooked US politicians of a lot of their motivation for even considering the project.
 
Who would have thought that large infrastructure projects through varied urban and rural environments across hundreds of miles could be so complicated?
If I remember correctly, the initial conversation also included:

Concerned Citizen: "We should have super fast trains like they do in Japan and in Europe. After all, we already have miles and miles of rail track."

Engineers of super fast trains: "Yes, we do have lots of track, but those tracks were laid down a long time ago. Super fast trains need rails that are MUCH more wide than what is currently on the ground. We would have to completely rebuild everything for it to work."

Concerned Citizen: "We should have super fast trains like they do in Japan and in Europe."

Engineers of super fast trains: "Did you hear what I just said?"

California government: "Let's be the first state to have super fast trains like they have in Japan and in Europe."

Engineers of Super fats trains: "ummmm.....OK. Here is our proposal."

Concerned Citizen: "As a resident of San Francisco, I want to discuss the ins and outs of our quarterback and the flag."
 
California bullet train costs soar to $77 billion, opening delayed
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/09/cali...g-delayed.html

The projected cost of California's bullet train from San Francisco to Los Angeles has jumped to $77 billion and the opening date has been pushed back four years to 2033, according to a business plan released Friday.

The two-year plan presented by the California High-Speed Rail Authority is the first under new chief executive Brian Kelly, who has promised more transparency about the project's challenges after years of cost increases and delays.
While the goal is to connect the two major cities, the new plan focuses primarily on opening track between San Francisco and the Central Valley, an agriculturally dominant, less-populated portion of inland California. That portion of track is now set to be finished by 2029, also marking a four-year delay, and significant challenges remain.

One of them is how to cross through a section of mountains — a critical segment to link Silicon Valley to the Central Valley. Rail officials are still working on how best to do that, Kelly wrote in the plan's introduction.

The $77 billion cost, a 20 per cent increase, is a baseline estimate, but Kelly also included high and low ranges in the plan based on potential risks.
It says 119 miles (192 kilometres) of track in the Central Valley is scheduled to open by 2022, which would make it the first operational segment. That's 14 years after voters approved a $10 billion bond for high-speed rail in November 2008.

A summary of the plan reviewed by The Associated Press offers limited details on the portion from Central Valley to Los Angeles. The agency hopes to complete all necessary environmental reviews for the entire line by 2022, a delay from initial timelines that planned for environmental clearance by 2017 for most parts of the track.
How to pay for the entire project remains "uncertain," Kelly said.

The state has spent $2.5 billion in federal stimulus money and has an additional $930 million in federal money on the table. That's on top of the $10 billion bond from voters.
The rest of the money comes from California's cap-and-trade auctions, a system meant to limit carbon emissions by selling credits to pollute and a volatile source of revenue that can be diverted by lawmakers in the future. Predicted private investment has not come in either.


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Thats last paragraph is beyond troubling, thats a whole lot of carbon credits
"Costs soar". No, they just lied about the estimate to get approval.
 
When people talk about government waste and inefficiency this is exactly what they are talking about. This state could spend that money a hell of a lot better on water storage, roads, infrastructure instead of the bullet train to no where.

could it? or would it just get wasted with a different name attached
 
Typical project run by liberals. Uh doy what is dollars hur dur hurr. Please gives to us, too stupid to work.

Kind of like the Southern border wall.

Trump, 2016 - It will cost $4 billion tops

Trump, 2017 - Okay, maybe more like $12 billion

Analysts, 2017 - Yeah, more like $30 billion, plus $5 billion annually
 
When people talk about government waste and inefficiency this is exactly what they are talking about.

Is it, though? This looks like a lot of cushy transactions with private contractors. When people talk about government waste and inefficiency, isn't it usually about how government is inefficient and private enterprises would do the job more cheaply?

Also, it looks like California recognizing the property rights of private landowners, instead of just summarily confiscating land like we did with the border fence and will do with the border wall, is driving up costs.
 
China and UAE are just building it now.

JAPAN has had this shit for over 40 years now!
Their rail system is really something to behold. They have the advantage of very high population density, 10 times that of the US, which makes it more cost effective, so it's understandable. I still agree it should have been a priority a couple of decades ago at least. However, big oil keeps the cost of oil low enough that they can still sucker people into believing that it's much nicer to sit around in traffic sucking up smog in your own car than to cruise along on a high speed train stretched out, having a drink, and enjoying yourself, instead of driving.
 
Fucking Democrap scumbags really fucked Cali with this.

Add more lanes to the freeways? Naw... highspeed rail instead! Oh and enjoy the construction for over a decade causing even more traffic and congestion wasting more gas and ruining our "green" eco friendly state... LOLDEMOCRAPS

Don't forget breh, you can ruin the environment by paying an incremental fee.

But otherwise you're killing your children's future.
 
Yeah and that bridge was initially budgeted at $250 million. It was approved for $1.2 billion. Over just a few years, the cost estimates soared uncontrollably, and the total bill may be as high as $13 billion.

A vast consortium of corrupt politicians, government officials, and industry interests sells these projects to the public for a fraudulent cost estimate, and then once they are approved sets about extorting 10x the cost, claiming it was ‘unforeseeable.’ That’s how the scam works.

This is the world, children, and both US political parties do it.

Its why watching people actually choose a side is so frustrating.

You're still choosing a criminal.
 
Is it, though? This looks like a lot of cushy transactions with private contractors. When people talk about government waste and inefficiency, isn't it usually about how government is inefficient and private enterprises would do the job more cheaply?

Also, it looks like California recognizing the property rights of private landowners, instead of just summarily confiscating land like we did with the border fence and will do with the border wall, is driving up costs.
It is absurdly over budget. The issue is people voted for it when it was expected to cost 10 billion. Tons of opponents to the bill raised this issue that the projected cost was a pipe dream and it would be way, way higher. Brown and supporters of the train denied it and then when its turned into this mess, just are like "oh well, lets move forward."

Not to mention the train itself will not be high speed rail for the entire ride, as was sold to voters as well. There are parts where you need to take conventional rail to continue the trip from southern to northern CA.

Whole thing is a shit show.
 
Their rail system is really something to behold. They have the advantage of very high population density, 10 times that of the US, which makes it more cost effective, so it's understandable. I still agree it should have been a priority a couple of decades ago at least. However, big oil keeps the cost of oil low enough that they can still sucker people into believing that it's much nicer to sit around in traffic sucking up smog in your own car than to cruise along on a high speed train stretched out, having a drink, and enjoying yourself, instead of driving.
Sucker people into wanting their own transportation, sneaky oil companies
 
I remember when they first installed it. I'd literally see almost every day on the news people crashing into it or something similar. At least it felt that way.

The crashes have gone down but they're still pretty numerous.

This at-grade shit is ridiculous. I think at the very least they should have elevated it downtown. I ride it almost daily and regularly see people on foot literally going faster. After several blocks the train eventually overtakes it but not by much.
 
They should pay Germany or Japan to take over the project. They can do these things much more efficiently and without so much corruption. Of course that would rob the crooked US politicians of a lot of their motivation for even considering the project.
Yes.

Too many people do not understand that completing the project was never truly a goal of the tender of the project. The goal was the disbursement of large amounts of cash. Now, every once in a while a project may actually get done with that dispersal of cash but that is not the driving consideration.

In Ontario Canada we have had Billion dollar boondoggle after billion dollar boondoggle. Whether its Ontario residents paying some of the highest rates in Hydro despite the Province having an abundance of it and selling it cheap to the US citizens or the eDocument Health Care failures. Billions go out to various consultants and others and the projects remain a mess with no real value realized by the citizens whose tax dollars have paid for them. So what does that mean? It means the gov't (a future gov't) gets to try and fix it all again with another Billion dollar budget.

Those are the goals of gov't and I mean that with no hyperbole or cynicism intended. I really do not believe 'success' of the project is even in their top 5 priorities when they tender the job and make payments.
 
The crashes have gone down but they're still pretty numerous.

This at-grade shit is ridiculous. I think at the very least they should have elevated it downtown. I ride it almost daily and regularly see people on foot literally going faster. After several blocks the train eventually overtakes it but not by much.
I like how they gave themselves an award for best rail or some shit like that, they had wrap type signs on the trains saying they won or were voted best....
 
They've had this in Vancouver for like 30+ years. It's really not that complicated.
 
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damnit.
 
They've had this in Vancouver for like 30+ years. It's really not that complicated.

No they haven’t. It’s not even remotely the same. The current Vancouver system is extremely primitive and slow ... it’s no more high speed rail than Pluto is a planet.
 
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