2017 Boxer of the Year

Sunfish said:
Seriously if @Queen B can ask his buddy why is list and explanations are hilariously idiotic and can let us know if he did any research or just used the search function on esb that would be useful.

Why is fat dan ignoring Sri?
Click to expand...

A bad case of DKSAB ?
 
Hagler said:
A bad case of DKSAB ?
Click to expand...
I guessed @Queen B would go quiet when he saw this. Has dan heard of him and if so why does he think he doesn’t deserve an honorable mention when he has ranked Ryan fucking Burnett. I would ask him on Twitter but he blocks people who question his rankings and that was a few years ago now.
 
Dr. Will said:
I can't make a judgement on Russell Jr personally, I have no clue. It doesn't help that he's living like a regular titleholder fighting lesser opposition.

Sosa is not mediocre. He is a proven good fighter. He has beaten Gamboa (was shamelessly robbed), Fortuna and Smith. He is thus belt holder material.
As for Walters, Walters to me had proven he was elite. He beat Sosa a competitive but very clear match. He also beat Marriaga wide although that was competitive, too.
He also knocked out a past prime Donaire by blitzing him. He was seen as a borderline P4P'er before fighting Loma. A certain number of people were adamant he'd KO Loma.
He disappeared for a while, came back to fight some journeyman but dropped out last minute because he had the flu. His heart is not compatible with boxing.

Marriaga is the same guy who lost to Oscar Valdez, a top prospect very narrowly. It was a 115-113 type of fight. I think Marriaga is a good fighter, at the end of the day he did better than any other fighter against Lomachenko since Russell Jr.

All in all, I see Loma a little like Naseem Hamed in that they lose a spark about them when they fight him.
Click to expand...

Sosa just had a drawish fight (I didn't see it as a shameless robbery) with the ghost of Gamboa. Neither Fortuna nor Smith are good fighters (and Sosa had to come from behind and pull off a late KO to beat him). He doesn't meet the threshold of "good" in the sense that "good" is a meaningful term at the elite levels of boxing.

As for Walters, I think he does likely qualify as "good", but he didn't look particularly good in last two outings before fighting Lomachenko. He was briefly considered as potentially a p4p fighter after stopping Donaire, but his stock had clearly dropped since then and he wasn't in the conversation by the time he fought Lomachenko after a year long layoff.

Marriaga was a smallish FW without any notable accomplishments who was brought up to SFW. It's an irrelevant win for a fighter of Lomachenko's standing.
 
Seano said:
I don't get how anyone could say size was no factor in Lomachenko/Rigondeaux. Size is a factor for a guy moving up 2 weight classes, especially a guy small for the weight class he's moving up from.

Lomachenko dominated him but come on now, give this win the same criticism everyone gave Floyd, Canelo and Golovkin when they fought smaller guys.
Click to expand...

Well, normally the smaller guy has a chance with speed and technique, Loma was faster, more skilled and moved better. It's not that size wasn't a factor, but that Lomachenko didn't win using size/power advantage, he won with skill, finesse and speed.
 
JayE said:
Sosa just had a drawish fight (I didn't see it as a shameless robbery) with the ghost of Gamboa. Neither Fortuna nor Smith are good fighters (and Sosa had to come from behind and pull off a late KO to beat him). He doesn't meet the threshold of "good" in the sense that "good" is a meaningful term at the elite levels of boxing.

As for Walters, I think he does likely qualify as "good", but he didn't look particularly good in last two outings before fighting Lomachenko. He was briefly considered as potentially a p4p fighter after stopping Donaire, but his stock had clearly dropped since then and he wasn't in the conversation by the time he fought Lomachenko after a year long layoff.

Marriaga was a smallish FW without any notable accomplishments who was brought up to SFW. It's an irrelevant win for a fighter of Lomachenko's standing.
Click to expand...
This is excessively critical.
The majority thought the Sosa-Gamboa result was a robbery. Anyone can look it up and see. Gamboa is past prime for sure but he still looks alright.
Sosa still KO'd both Fortuna and Smith to prove he is a modern era belt holder. For me, good fighters are B graders, very good fighters are B+ to A- and elite fighers are A, and the very best are A+ ...that's just the general way I see it.

His stock had dropped then because he was robbed of a victory against Sosa and people didn't know who Sosa was, but in hindsight, the competitive but clear victory looks better now. Lomachenko fought him when he was seen as a potentially P4P fighter and Sosa is a tricky, stocky fighter who's not easy to land clean on.
'Year long layoff' - people go O.T.T when discussing the inactivity. It was 11 months and that isn't a scary amount of time away from the ring at all.

'Smallish FW' - this is all semantics which holds no water to someone who has watched him fight before Valdez and Loma. He is a good sized FW who didn't look too small to be in the ring at all with Loma. But you didn't comment on the fact that he did have a razor close fight with Valdez.

There's a purpose behind yo being excessively negative view on these fighters. I'm not sure why that is. Maybe it's a reaction to people saying Loma is TBE when he hasn't proven himself at the highest level yet.
Marriaga to me is B grade. BUT he win is a B- though because it wasn't at his best weight.
Walters strikes me as A- ...the world felt that when he was on his run, he was A grade...and maybe he is...who knows.
Sosa is a regular B grader.
 
I keep coming back to Conor.
 
LogicalInsanity said:
Same here...no other name makes sense...

Ps. That fight was stopped early. He had Mayweather in trouble several times.
Click to expand...
I’m taking the guys who appeared in here to explain why pulling guard wouldn’t be dumb as shit in a bar fight.
 
Woldog said:
1. Jeff Horn, beat all time great Manny Pacquiao in his prime and beat future hall of famer Gary Corcoran in his prime.
Click to expand...
i'm a fan of jeff, but would you really call the "hell raiser", a future hall of famer? sorry i didn't see you wrote pacquiao in his prime, now i know you taking the piss.
 
Just saw boxingscene has Joshua as their pick. Will the win over Klitschko was indeed very impressive, I have to go with Sor Rungvisai.
 
The RING's Fighter of the Year
lomachenko-rigondeaux-fight%20(7).jpg

Vasyl Lomachenko Named 2017 RING Magazine Fighter Of The Year
 
Dr. Will said:
So it's settled! The Ring Magazine 2017 Fighter of the Year:
https://www.ringtv.com/525496-vasyl-lomachenko-named-2017-ring-magazine-fighter-year/
Click to expand...

For The RING it is. Not for the BWAA who announces their Sugar Ray Robinson Award winner for FOTY in late January. The 19th is their cut off date for voting (e-mail ballots), so, look for the 22nd to be the day that they're tallied and the 27th or 28th that it's published by them and the rest of the media outlets that cover boxing. Most wouldn't care but they're also doing their inaugural FFOTY (Female Fighter of the Year) this year.
Terence Crawford and Vasyl Lomachenko are among the finalists for BWAA 2017 Fighter of the Year

2017 Sugar Ray Robinson Fighter of Year Finalists

Terence Crawford

Mikey Garcia

Anthony Joshua

Vasyl Lomachenko

Srisaket Sor Rungvisai
Click to expand...
2017 Christy Martin Female Fighter of the Year nominees (The first)

Cecilia Braekhus

Jessica Chavez

Naoko Fujioka

Mariana Juarez

Amanda Serrano

Claressa Shields

Katie Taylor
Click to expand...
BWAA Announces Its 2017 Award Finalists
 
I'd vote for Sor Rungvisai, but Lomachenko is a decent pick.
 
The Ring magazine Fighter of the Year
2010s
Sugar Ray Robinson Award (BWAA's FOTY)
2010s
 
Dr. Will said:
This is excessively critical.
The majority thought the Sosa-Gamboa result was a robbery. Anyone can look it up and see. Gamboa is past prime for sure but he still looks alright.
Sosa still KO'd both Fortuna and Smith to prove he is a modern era belt holder. For me, good fighters are B graders, very good fighters are B+ to A- and elite fighers are A, and the very best are A+ ...that's just the general way I see it.

His stock had dropped then because he was robbed of a victory against Sosa and people didn't know who Sosa was, but in hindsight, the competitive but clear victory looks better now. Lomachenko fought him when he was seen as a potentially P4P fighter and Sosa is a tricky, stocky fighter who's not easy to land clean on.
'Year long layoff' - people go O.T.T when discussing the inactivity. It was 11 months and that isn't a scary amount of time away from the ring at all.

'Smallish FW' - this is all semantics which holds no water to someone who has watched him fight before Valdez and Loma. He is a good sized FW who didn't look too small to be in the ring at all with Loma. But you didn't comment on the fact that he did have a razor close fight with Valdez.

There's a purpose behind yo being excessively negative view on these fighters. I'm not sure why that is. Maybe it's a reaction to people saying Loma is TBE when he hasn't proven himself at the highest level yet.
Marriaga to me is B grade. BUT he win is a B- though because it wasn't at his best weight.
Walters strikes me as A- ...the world felt that when he was on his run, he was A grade...and maybe he is...who knows.
Sosa is a regular B grader.
Click to expand...

I don't think Gamboa looks alright relative to his prime; he looks like a complete shell of himself. Sosa is a tough guy who isn't really all that talented. The fact he was highly competitive with Gamboa to me rather clearly suggests he's a step down from the best at SFW. That doesn't make him a bad win or a blemish on Lomachenko's resume, it just means that beating him shouldn't be considered a big deal for someone in the discussion of being p4p #1.

Walters was a good win; either the first of second best of Lomachenko's career (again, I probably rate Russell Jr. as the best, but just how good that win was will be more apparent if we see Russell Jr. fight another genuinely elite fighter). Walters had shown himself to be relatively versatile in the sense that he could fight at different ranges and also had a decent punch and Lomachenko completely took him apart. That was definitely impressive. I'd say that it is still not wholly apparent just how good Walters is above FW, but he showed enough at FW and against Sosa for us to know that he was a good fighter and a meaningful win (there would be no argument for him being a p4p fighter at that point in time, though, but being p4p rated isn't the be all end all of quality).

Marriaga is a game FW who, in his last outing before fighting Lomachenko, gave a FW who is still effectively a prospect a good fight. I called him a smallish FW because he is a smallish FW. In the past he typically rehydrated into the 130s. I'm not calling him a terrible fighter, I'm just saying that a SFW who is in p4p #1 discussions isn't going to get much credit for beating him.

I'm not saying that Lomachenko had a bad year (you can reasonably argue that he is FOTY even if I don't think he quite deserves it) or that he deserves blame for his reputation exceeding his resume, but if we're going to talk about his resume, I think we need to keep it in context and be honest about it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
1,236,718
Messages
55,437,191
Members
174,774
Latest member
Ruckus245

Share this page

Back
Top