Adapting TKD to MMA

[philong]

Now, to business:
philong, bud, I was actually agreeing with the bulk of your post, really...I just inferred from your tone (which I later admitted was most likely due to kyun's nonsense...), that you were one of those who happen to believe that all the major conflicts of the last century fell squarely upon the US's shoulders to win. Which is simply not the case, although god alone knows where things would've ended up had you guys not been there (eventually...:wink: ..I kid...).

You read something into my post that was not there. I was responding to the critical remark ("thank the US Army for that") posted by an obtuse person with no knowledge of what the US Armed Forces has done. I was merely pointing out SOME (by no means ALL) of the things that he SHOULD be thanking the US Armed Forces for.
I come from a military family, we fought in the Revolutionary War and virtually every war / action since (sometimes on both sides- War between the States & Indian Wars), and I take offense at some internet (kyun) poser slandering the Military (ANY Military). I served in the Army. My Brother, 2 sisters, 2 Brother-in-Laws, a Nephew & 3 Nieces served in the Army. Currently 1 Sister & one Nephew are serving in the Army, one Nephew is in the Marines, one Niece is in the Air Force and my Son is in the Navy.
Our Military (and other countries Militaries) sacrifice a great deal so that people like him have the right to spout off moronic BS. We proudly serve our country in the defense of freedom and I take offense at slanderous remarks but my response is in no way meant to belittle the contributions and sacrifices made by other soldiers.

 

[Groucho]

You read something into my post that was not there. I was responding to the critical remark ("thank the US Army for that") posted by an obtuse person with no knowledge of what the US Armed Forces has done. I was merely pointing out SOME (by no means ALL) of the things that he SHOULD be thanking the US Armed Forces for.
I come from a military family, we fought in the Revolutionary War and virtually every war / action since (sometimes on both sides- War between the States & Indian Wars), and I take offense at some internet (kyun) poser slandering the Military (ANY Military). I served in the Army. My Brother, 2 sisters, 2 Brother-in-Laws, a Nephew & 3 Nieces served in the Army. Currently 1 Sister & one Nephew are serving in the Army, one Nephew is in the Marines, one Niece is in the Air Force and my Son is in the Navy.
Our Military (and other countries Militaries) sacrifice a great deal so that people like him have the right to spout off moronic BS. We proudly serve our country in the defense of freedom and I take offense at slanderous remarks but my response is in no way meant to belittle the contributions and sacrifices made by other soldiers.

First, let me again state we are sympatico on kyun's bs...I'm also from a military family, but Canada and British Empire (1812 onward in Canada that we are certain of...haven't missed one yet...)...had my back up to lay some smackdown on him myself, but decided it was best to leave it to a representative of the US military...

But seeing as we're all hugging and singing "Kumbaya", lemme just add to kyun, if Krnguy03 hasn't choked him to death: Dude, disagree with the foreign policy of your country as much as you wish...it's your right to do it...but NEVER lose sight of the fact that brave men and women put themselves in harm's way to support that right, and to slag them for doing so just reveals you to be a complete and utter *sshole

 

[SigSauer229]

High kicks are ego driven. Name a fighter who's a KO king (other than Cro COp) with the high kick?

Tick tock, tick tock.

OK, maybe only a handful in the fighting world? And I'm not talking tournament point sparring either. I'm talking KTFO high kick power.

Not many.

 

[Evil Eye Gouger]

What do you mean by "KO king"?

There are so many fighters in K1, kickboxing, Muay Thai, Kyokushin and MMA who have finished a fight with a high kick that it's not even funny.

And let's not even talk about all the head kick KOs in TKD tournies, which are also full-contact.

 

[Gregster]

High kicks are ego driven. Name a fighter who's a KO king (other than Cro COp) with the high kick?

Tick tock, tick tock.

OK, maybe only a handful in the fighting world? And I'm not talking tournament point sparring either. I'm talking KTFO high kick power.

Not many.

I've seen plenty of footage of Muay Thai fighters putting someones' lights out with a high kick.

Anyway, there's no "ego" component to high kicks if a specific fighter uses them wisely and correctly. A high, head-level kick is usually an opportunity shot, one that requires a fighter to be able to capitalize quickly when said opportunity presents itself.

Anyway, sorry if I'm beating any particular horse to death, as I've not followed this thread and am too lazy to read the whole thing in detail. With regards to adapting TKD to MMA:

1) Of TKDs' large and impressive arsenal of kicking techniques, I'd stick to the basic five or six which novice TKDers must master in order to lay a foundation for the advanced techniques (front, roundhouse, side kick, spinning-back, axe kick). Mastering some of the trickier/flashier kicks involves an investment of time and effort which would probably have poor returns in MMA competition.

2) If you're going to develop proper, powerful TKD kicks (NOTE: you'd do well to ignore people who talk about TKD kicks like they're nothing but sissy-boy slaps, as these guys obviously either never trained TKD or got crappy training if they did) you will of course need to avail yourself of the services of a knowledgeable instructor. You will also need a similar caliber of coach to teach you how to apply them in a fight; it is here, in my opinion, where your problems will perhaps arise.

A knowledgable, skilled, and experienced TKD instructor with a solid sparring background is very likely going to train you to apply kicking in a manner consistent with TKD fighting. This includes learning to string together 2, 3, or 4-kick combinations in rapid, seamless succession, something I've not seen much of MMA (though it should be noted I'm not a devoted follower of competitive MMA). Persuant to that, a critical component of learning to do this involves making sure you're in a proper stance, and the TKD stance is not (from what I've seen, anyway) is not entirely conducive to MMA fighting for a couple of reasons, an obvious one being that avoiding double-leg takedowns is not a going concern that competitve TKD fighters have the need to address.

 

[Groucho]

High kicks are ego driven. Name a fighter who's a KO king (other than Cro COp) with the high kick?

Tick tock, tick tock.

OK, maybe only a handful in the fighting world? And I'm not talking tournament point sparring either. I'm talking KTFO high kick power.

Not many.

okay, I'll play:

Hug, Hoost, Feitosa, Semmy (but at 6'11", even his low kicks are high...)...now, let's go WAY old school...Jean-Yves Theriault, 61 KO's

Damn, I'm not even trying yet...

 

[Evil Eye Gouger]

Some of the non-Mirko high-kick victories in MMA I can think of:

Yves - Thomson
A. Silva - Stiebling (this one was a cut)
Mo Smith - Coleman
Sylvia - Telligman

 

[aaron_mag]

Wait a second, do you have a bigger photo of that magazine cover, Aaron?

I could swear that it says: Zelg Galesic: Taekwondo works in MMA.

If he really said that in an intervies, as a Cage Rage champion fighting in Pride, the haters will bite their dicks off.

EDIT: Few people know that he still trains TKD and gives TKD seminars. He holds a 4th degree black belt and is a former world champion.

But yeah, it's useless.

That is exactly what it says.

I've had people tell me, "But you can't use good athletes like Zelg as an example..."

Frick! Who else would you use? You have to compare athletes to athletes. Do people just want to beat down on soccer moms and then proclaim themselves as badasses?

 

[SigSauer229]

okay, I'll play:

Hug, Hoost, Feitosa, Semmy (but at 6'11", even his low kicks are high...)...now, let's go WAY old school...Jean-Yves Theriault, 61 KO's

Damn, I'm not even trying yet...

Wow you went old school with Jean-Yves Theirault. You could probably lob Rob Kaman in there too.

Again, thank you. There are only a handful with high kick KO power.

 

[krnguy03]

Wow you went old school with Jean-Yves Theirault. You could probably lob Rob Kaman in there too.

Again, thank you. There are only a handful with high kick KO power.

i dont think everyone is going to take the time and look up every fight that has ended with a ko high kick just because you asked...

 

[krnguy03]

okay, I'll play:

Hug, Hoost, Feitosa, Semmy (but at 6'11", even his low kicks are high...)...now, let's go WAY old school...Jean-Yves Theriault, 61 KO's

Damn, I'm not even trying yet...

what about kaoklai on mighty moe? buakaw? dekkers? the list goes on...

 

[Groucho]

what about kaoklai on mighty moe? buakaw? dekkers? the list goes on...

As I said, I wasn't even trying to come up with names...just accessing the mental highlight reels...

mos def dekkers, I've seen him almost kick people's heads clean off...fihlo's been known to hunt a head or 2 (but more in his Kyokushin career)...back to K1, even fighters considered more well rounded, as in not notorious for head hunting, like Peter Aerts and Ray Sefo have won a few via high kick,

if memory serves me, about the only guy I haven't seen rattle his opponent's brainpan is Bob Sapp...not while they were standing, anyway...

[Edit] GSP took out Hughes with a kick to the head...yay, Kyokushin...

 

[Toujourpret]

Sorry, you just lost all credibilty. The code was up up down down left right left right B A (select for 2 players) start.

:icon_chee

it amazes me people still have this memorized. Do you still remember the Mike Tyson's Punch Out (when it was still cool and had him in the game) code?

I still play with Legos.

I still love legos. is it me or are they betting better now that i need to be embarassed for buying them? I just had the generic space men and generic knights.

 

[Doughbelly]

Some of the non-Mirko high-kick victories in MMA I can think of:

Yves - Thomson
A. Silva - Stiebling (this one was a cut)
Mo Smith - Coleman
Sylvia - Telligman

Mo too Coleman to a UD. Petey KO'd Coleman.

The only guy Mo high kick KO'd in a cage was Marcus Silviera (who's in prison now for dealing drugs) in Extreme Fighting and as much as Maurice is a cool guy, that was an early stoppage.

 

[savageasfuk]

this thread is too long and is way off topic.

Adapting TKD to MMA....

hmm it's possible as with pretty much any martial art, hence mixed martial arts. But once you throw in the leg kicks, shooting, guillotines, arm bars, punching...it's pretty much just a shadow of what it originally was because the majority of the techniques used in TKD aside from the spinning back kick, side kick, or high kick, there isn't much to use.

I think what Kyun was merely trying to say is that there are other martial arts that can you invest your time with and have a easier time adjusting to MMA or incorporating other martial arts to make you a more well rounded fighter. He didn't come off saying, but that's what i think he was trying emphasize.

As far as the Armed Forces discussion which is completely off-topic....

I grew up in a military family and have had members in every single branch besides the Coast Guard. I've been around it my entire life. Do you honestly believe that everyone that is serving in the military believes in the oath of enlistment when they are stating it? I don't think so.

For those that honestly joined the US military or any military because they really wanted to serve their country then God bless them. In front of a camera or when asked they will probably state that they did, but I bet in the back of their head they were thinking medical, gi. bill, guaranteed paycheck. If you are able to obey orders and read, then you can join the US military and probably make a decent life out of it. Don't get the truth twisted with your hopes of Americanism that isn't embedded in the mind of the guy who hopped a fence to get here wanting to feed his family so he remembered an oath and signed the dotted line.

As far as the guys flaming Kyun because all these military accomplishments in the past that they weren't a part of... Did you storm the beach of Normandy?

 

[Groucho]

...

As far as the guys flaming Kyun because all these military accomplishments in the past that they weren't a part of... Did you storm the beach of Normandy?

according to my meditation guru, when he took me through the bardo, yes...and I died heroically... back 'atcha

don't blame you for skimming, it was way OT, but the military history rants were actually between me, philong, Doughbelly and Krnguy...the thread was so far gone at that point, wtf, why not?

the swipe I took at kyun was for slagging the people supporting his right to be a keyboard warrior, no matter what their motive for signing up was...just isn't right, and I stand by that...

just so's you're up to speed...

 

[Jubacat]

Glad to see this thread back to fighting about adapting TKD to MMA.

 

[Evil Eye Gouger]

Mo too Coleman to a UD. Petey KO'd Coleman.

The only guy Mo high kick KO'd in a cage was Marcus Silviera (who's in prison now for dealing drugs) in Extreme Fighting and as much as Maurice is a cool guy, that was an early stoppage.

Yep, you're right, I always mix those two fights up for some reason.

 

[Doughbelly]

Yep, you're right, I always mix those two fights up for some reason.

It's funny because immediately after Petey-Coleman, which happened at the heels of Mo-Coleman, Petey turns to Maurice (kickboxing champ, K-1 veteran, and the guy who Ken brought in to train the LD in standup) and says, "See? THAT'S how you throw a high kick."

 

[Doughbelly]

I think what Kyun was merely trying to say is that there are other martial arts that can you invest your time with and have a easier time adjusting to MMA or incorporating other martial arts to make you a more well rounded fighter. He didn't come off saying, but that's what i think he was trying emphasize.

As far as the Armed Forces discussion which is completely off-topic....

I grew up in a military family and have had members in every single branch besides the Coast Guard. I've been around it my entire life. Do you honestly believe that everyone that is serving in the military believes in the oath of enlistment when they are stating it? I don't think so.

For those that honestly joined the US military or any military because they really wanted to serve their country then God bless them. In front of a camera or when asked they will probably state that they did, but I bet in the back of their head they were thinking medical, gi. bill, guaranteed paycheck. If you are able to obey orders and read, then you can join the US military and probably make a decent life out of it. Don't get the truth twisted with your hopes of Americanism that isn't embedded in the mind of the guy who hopped a fence to get here wanting to feed his family so he remembered an oath and signed the dotted line.

As far as the guys flaming Kyun because all these military accomplishments in the past that they weren't a part of... Did you storm the beach of Normandy?

I don't think you're really following the thread. Kyun got flamed for being an internet tough guy/real life pussy. The military history flamewar never really involved him.

Kyun was also an asshole and wasn't really trying to say that there are martial arts that are more easily adaptable. He took the stand that TKD was next to useless, based off of his limited experience which was particularly annoying because there are people right here on these boards who took TKD, MT, kickboxing and/or MMA to a much higher level than he ever did. When he got called on it, he shat his pants and ran.

The problem with your generalizations, being what they are, particularly concerning why people join, is that they are generalities. Personally, when I signed up, I wasn't thinking of any of those things (medical, GI Bill, OR pay) because one, I was already on scholarship and didn't need Army/ROTC money and two, pay/medical was a non-factor because I was attending a high prestige university. Despite some arguments to the contrary, Army officer pay is shit compared to a real job. If I'm honest about it, then years after the fact, the real reason I signed up was A.) adventure - got to jump out of airplanes and helicopters and B.) my father DIDN'T want me to do it so the first thing I did when I was old enough in college was I walked in to the ROTC department and said "sign me up!" Also, a part of me says I wanted to hold some rank over the old man (30+ years military himself).

And yeah, patriotism and service to my country had very little to do with my decision. On the other hand, you're wrong about it no applying to others, especially all those who signed up after 9/11.

To bring back some levity to this thread within a thread, I don't really count the USAF as military. They're more like a heavily armed civil service.