International Arab-Israeli Conflict, v3: Israel approves new permanent US embassy site in West Jerusalem

The two sides are getting very far apart right now.

Cutting funds is going to end up fucking up the PA and then Israel will have to do more security and that is not going to go over well. It is getting to be a double scoop of a shit sandwich.
 
Lol at crying about giving less money to a government that never tries to negotiate, will never change their out of touch barbarian ways and one that most definitely will not use that money for the good of their people.. It's like TS can't tell the difference between a government that doesn't give a flying fuck about it's own people and the citizens themselves. Who's the money going to go to?? Why don't the Palestinians elect better representatives that actually care for them and aren't all talk? Accountability is a factor here and making it seem like they're all innocent as you often do is fucking absurd.

But then again, this is the same TS who keeps trying to say that Iran should the U.S's number one ally in the Middle East.. The same country who gives the Iranian Revolutionary Guards more power then most of the elected government. The same government that kills and jails it's own people protesting for a better life. I guess Zionism is worst then killing gay people and protesters...

Ya Israel is the big problem here, with out them everything would be all fine and dandy in the Middle East if it never came to be... It's like you have no idea of the history of the Middle East but your hate for Zionism makes you think that you're actually making a good point here.

Get a fucking grip. You're clueless on this subject and this is coming from an anti-Zionist...
 
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Can’t believe we aren’t going to give money to people who give money to suicide bombers families

The two sides are getting very far apart right now.

Cutting funds is going to end up fucking up the PA and then Israel will have to do more security and that is not going to go over well. It is getting to be a double scoop of a shit sandwich.

Both assessments are correct.

Fatah's long tradition of using international aid money to reward families of convicted terrorists ("martyrs" in Arab parlance) is outrageous.

Israel will certainly have to step up security when the Palestinian's funding is shot.

We shall see if all those other countries gonna step up with their checkbooks now, namely their "Arab Brothers".
 
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Fatah's long tradition of using international aid money to reward families of convicted terrorists ("martyrs" in Arab parlance) is outrageous.
Come now, "convicted terrorists" in Israel many times is nothing more than yet anther political prisoner.

Be fair.

Israel will certainly have to step up security when the Palestinian's funding is shot.
Israel needs to end the occupation. The settlements violate international law. The outposts violate Israeli law.

These idiots are stealing Jerusalem as we type. Jerusalem is not even part of Israel. Look it up. We have a cast of characters in power right now that are ready to kick off WWIII for something as stupid as claiming that Jerusalem is the capital of Israel, which itself is disputed territory. And what's worse? We have a bunch of true believers supporting this insanity because it's 'their team.'

Be fair.

We shall see if all those other countries gonna step up with their checkbooks now, namely their "Arab Brothers".
The international community will always support the Palestinian struggle. Deal with it. Look at the near unanimous UN votes regarding this ongoing war crime.

Be fair.
 
I have a feeling that if palestine was in Israel’s place there wouldn’t be anyone left to send aid to
 
We shouldn't be giving them, or Israel, jack shit.
 
Jerusalem is not even part of Israel. Look it up.

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Well if the UN says so... It doesn't mean shit.
 
TRANSLATION: Well if the ALMOST THE WHOLE REST F THE WORLD says so... It doesn't mean shit.
Correct. If the US decides to recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital because Israel is a state as matter of fact and showed up at the table, what good is the opinion of the rest of the world that opposes it? What are going to do? Shake their fists real hard?
 
Come now, "convicted terrorists" in Israel many times is nothing more than yet anther political prisoner.

Be fair.

I'm not playing word games. When I said terrorists, I meant actual terrorists who stabs random people to death, or setting off car bombs in a big crowd. When we're talking about actual non-violent political prisoners, then I'd use the term political prisoners, like we have done in this debate.

I don't have an issue with PA giving foreign aid money to political prisoners, but we're talking about their insistent on bankrolling terrorism with the hundreds of millions donated each year by the international community, particularly the way they're trying to do it under table after the practice was exposed.


The Palestinian Incentive Program for Killing Jews
Mahmoud Abbas may not be able to stop the knife attacks. But he shouldn't pay the killers' families.​

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Hallel Yaffa Ariel, a 13-year-old Israeli girl, was stabbed in her bed.

Whoever said crime doesn't pay hasn't talked to the family of a Palestinian terrorist. For the Palestine Liberation Organization and the related Palestinian Authority, the killers of Jewish Israelis are considered "martyrs." And as such, their families are paid for the service these murderers have done for the Palestinian cause.

This has come to light this week after a Palestinian, Mohammed Tarayra, stabbed Hallel Yaffa Ariel, a 13-year-old Israeli girl, as she was sleeping in her bed. The stabbing was part of a wave of attacks by Palestinians who have for nearly eight months been shooting, stabbing and running down Jews with the encouragement of social media and popular songs.

According to the latest report of the Russian, European, U.S. and U.N. group known as the Quartet, there have been 250 of these kinds of attacks since October. It says, "These terrorist attacks, which have been carried out mostly by young, unaffiliated individuals, contribute to the sense among Israelis of living under constant threat."

But this misses important context. The Quartet's report, which is even handed to a fault, makes no mention of the "martyr's fund," through which the Palestinian Authority and the Palestine Liberation Organization pay the families of all Palestinian prisoners and the families of martyrs. So while there is no evidence that the Palestinian government plans these killing sprees, it encourages them as a legitimate act of resistance.

As Commentary's Evelyn Gordon wrote this week, the prisoners and the families of the prisoners themselves are actually paid a higher wage than what most Palestinians earn for nonviolent work.

The origins of these payments goes back a long way. Before the Palestinian Authority was established in the 1990s through the Oslo peace process, the Palestine Liberation Organization paid the families of "martyrs" and prisoners detained by Israel. That practice became standardized during the Second Intifadah of 2000 to 2005. The Israelis even found documents in the late Yasser Arafat's compound that showed payments to families of suicide bombers.

For years the Israelis and the Americans didn't do much on this issue. The Israel Defense Forces work closely with Palestinian security services to keep the peace in the West Bank. Meanwhile, the Bush and Obama administrations have pressed both sides to restart negotiations over a final status.

This is starting to change. On Friday, Israel's prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, announced that he would begin withholding part of the tax revenue that Israel sends to the Palestinian Authority -- equal to the amount paid to "martyrs."

Frank Lowenstein, the U.S. special envoy for Israeli-Palestinian negotiations, told me the U.S. has recently started withholding funding for the same reason. "We have robustly complied with legislation passed in 2014 that requires us to deduct from development assistance to the Palestinian Authority for Palestinian payments to individuals imprisoned for acts of terrorism," he said. The amount of development assistance that has been withheld is classified.

The Palestinian Authority seems to be aware of this and has figured out ways to hide these payments to the families of murderers, by creating new accounts. Senator Dan Coates, a Republican from Indiana, has introduced new legislation aimed at closing this loophole.

One problem is that the payments to terrorists' families are exceedingly popular these days. Ziad Asali, the president and founder of the American Task Force on Palestine, told me that in recent years the media and politicians have elevated these payments to something "sacred in Palestinian politics." Asali said the Palestinian Authority president, Mahmoud Abbas, and others are too weak to stop it. "This is where we find ourselves now. The vast majority understand there has to be an end to violence; it's not serving the Palestinians in any way," Asali said. "But I think nobody really has the stature and clout to confront these issues publicly."

Asali is getting at one of the many tragedies today for the Palestinians. Abbas came to power initially after he condemned suicide bombing and terrorism during the Second Intifadah. His bravery at the time to confront Arafat earned him a reputation as a peacemaker and is one reason President Barack Obama has never publicly criticized him with the same ferocity he reserves for Netanyahu.

But today Abbas is in the 11th year of a four-year term as president. He has made some vague statements opposing the recent wave of violence. But he never condemns the murderers by name. Meanwhile, his own Fatah Party glorified Tarayra on its official Facebook page.

No wonder the killer's family is so proud of him. His mother told a local news outlet: "My son is a hero. He made me proud. My son died as a martyr defending Jerusalem and the Al-Aqsa Mosque," according to a translation from Palestinian Media Watch.

Israel's alleged peace partner appears to agree. If the past is precedent, she will receive a steady check to honor her son's murder of a 13-year-old Jewish girl in her sleep.


In case anyone is wondering, out of the $693 million in foreign aid that the PA received last year, half of it ($345 million) went to the "Martyrs Fund", and as we already know, the reward that each "martyr" and their family are currently being paid each month for their heroic accomplishments with bloody knives and home-made bombs are more than an average Palestinian's salary.

Israel needs to end the occupation. The settlements violate international law. The outposts violate Israeli law.

These idiots are stealing Jerusalem as we type. Jerusalem is not even part of Israel. Look it up. We have a cast of characters in power right now that are ready to kick off WWIII for something as stupid as claiming that Jerusalem is the capital of Israel, which itself is disputed territory. And what's worse? We have a bunch of true believers supporting this insanity because it's 'their team.'

Be fair.

You're terribly late to the party, and thus have no idea what my view is on the subject matter. Does any of those points sounds unfair to you? o_O

The international community will always support the Palestinian struggle. Deal with it. Look at the near unanimous UN votes regarding this ongoing war crime.

Be fair.

Yes, we have extensively covered that. See page 36 forward for the discussion that you've missed.

I've got a feeling not that many countries who voted for that UN resolution actually want to pony up their tax-payers' money to pay for convicted terrorists, however.
 
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British terror victim to U.K: Are you funding my attackers?
By Art Moore | Jan 14, 2018

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Kay Wilson, a British citizen living in Israel, and Kristine Luken, an American, were hiking west of Jerusalem when they were attacked by two members of a Palestinian Authority-based terror cell.

Luken was murdered in the Dec. 18, 2010, attack, and Wilson suffered severe wounds, having been stabbed 13 times, but survived.

Now, Wilson is asking the British Parliament to investigate whether funds the U.K. has provided to the Palestinian Authority are being used to promote terrorism and support jailed terrorists, reports Israel’s Arutz Sheva.

The answer appears to be yes, as Arutz Sheva notes the Palestinian Authority spends hundreds of millions of dollars each year in stipends and other benefits to jailed terrorists and their families.

Israel’s Defense Ministry found that the PA spent a total of $358 million, or about 7 percent of the PA’s total annual budget, on terrorist stipends last year.

Meanwhile, the U.S. contributes about $600 million annually to the PA, totaling more than $5.2 billion since 1994.

Recalling the attack outside of Beit Shemesh, Wilson said she “somehow managed to get up – with 13 punctures in my lungs and diaphragm, over 30 broken bones, a crushed sternum, dislocated shoulder.”

“I managed to walk over a mile bound and gagged and barefoot through the forest,” she said.

“That was without a doubt the longest walk of my life – and it was a lonely, lonely walk because I thought I was going to die.”

PA defends payments

Last year, Arutz Sheva noted, PA President Mahmoud Abbas defended payments to terrorists and their families.

“Even if I will have to leave my position, I will not compromise on the salary of a Martyr or a prisoner, as I am the president of the entire Palestinian people, including the prisoners, the Martyrs, the injured, the expelled, and the uprooted,” Abbas said.

On his Jihad Watch site, author and Islam expert Robert Spencer said it’s clear that the British government is giving money to terrorists through the PA.

“If the Palestinian Authority is giving any money at all to jihad terrorists, and the U.K. is giving any money at all to the Palestinian Authority, then yes, the U.K. is funding the jihad terrorists who tried to murder Kay Wilson,” he wrote.

Kay said, in a letter to British Member of Parliament Stephen Twigg of the left-leaning Labour Party, said she had evidence the two terrorists responsible for the attack have received more than $12,000 each from the PA.

Twigg is chairman of Parliament’s international development committee.

The PA, Wilson pointed out in the letter, also was a beneficiary of Britain’s Department of International Development, which provides part of the nearly $700 million the PA receives in foreign aid each year.

Wilson argued that in the past, the Department of International Development “has suspended aid packages when evidence has emerged of taxpayers’ money being misspent or on the discovery of unacceptable behaviour and the committee has also been swift to investigate when a misuse of funds or malpractice has been highlighted.”

“However, despite the fact that your committee possesses wide-ranging powers to examine DFID’s work you have chosen to ignore the Palestinian Authority’s funding and incitement of terrorism,” she said.

Wilson said there is now “strong evidence that ministers have misled Parliament about how taxpayers’ money is distributed and there is incontestable evidence that the Palestinian Authority misuses aid funds, glorifies terror and prevents much needed development funds reaching those most in need.”

Arutz Sheva said Twigg confirmed receipt of the letter and pledged to “take its contents very seriously.”

However, a spokesman for Department for International Development denied Wilson’s claims, calling them misleading, the Daily Express newspaper of London reported.

“No U.K. aid is used for payments to Palestinian prisoners or their families,” the spokesman said.

Nevertheless, as WND reported in April 2016, an investigation by Palestinian Media Watch found Palestinian Authority Ministry of Finance documents that showed the PA was secretly continuing to pay “salaries” to convicted terrorists, despite promising in 2014 to stop the payments.

The documents show a transfer of money from the PA to the Palestinian National Fund, the body that funds the Palestinian Liberation Organization, in the amount needed to pay the salaries.

http://www.wnd.com/2018/01/terror-victim-to-u-k-are-you-funding-my-attackers/
 
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I'm not playing word games. When I said terrorists, I meant actual terrorists who stabs random people to death, or setting off car bombs in a big crowd. When we're talking about actual non-violent political prisoners, then I'd use the term political prisoners, like we have done in this debate.


Just because Israel convicts a Palestinian in a military kangaroo court that convicts in nearly 100% of the cases, does not make these people terrorists.

Be fair.

And the damn 'funding terrorists to kill Jews' is absolute grade A bullshit. It's propaganda. Look it up; all governments do it. And it is low level propaganda at that. That stuff is designed to fool the least critical thinkers, the ones who will drink it up faster than they can vomit it out.

Look at how much money Israel spends murdering Palestinians. How much are their 'soldiers' paid?

You're terribly late to the party, and thus have no idea what my view is on the subject matter. Does any of those points sounds unfair to you? o_O
A two-state solution is impossible. If you don't know that, you know nothing of this topic.

I'm being fair.

Yes, we have extensively covered that. See page 36 forward for the discussion that you've missed.

I've got a feeling that not that many countries who voted for that UN resolution actually want to pony up their tax-payers' money to pay for convicted terrorists, however.
That means nothing. The world is clear.

--Jerusalem is NOT part of Israel.

--The settlements are flagrant violations of international law.

Your terrorist card is played out. Try again.

The terrorists are the occupiers. The theft of Palestine began in terror. The Nakba has never ended.

jerusalemed%2B%25281%2529.png
 
Lol at crying about giving less money to a government that never tries to negotiate, will never change their out of touch barbarian ways and one that most definitely will not use that money for the good of their people.. It's like TS can't tell the difference between a government that doesn't give a flying fuck about it's own people and the citizens themselves. Who's the money going to go to?? Why don't the Palestinians elect better representatives that actually care for them and aren't all talk? Accountability is a factor here and making it seem like they're all innocent as you often do is fucking absurd.

But then again, this is the same TS who keeps trying to say that Iran should the U.S's number one ally in the Middle East.. The same country who gives the Iranian Revolutionary Guards more power then most of the elected government. The same government that kills and jails it's own people protesting for a better life. I guess Zionism is worst then killing gay people and protesters...

Ya Israel is the big problem here, with out them everything would be all fine and dandy in the Middle East if it never came to be... It's like you have no idea of the history of the Middle East but your hate for Zionism makes you think that you're actually making a good point here.

Get a fucking grip. You're clueless on this subject and this is coming from an anti-Zionist...

I think he is just a clueless liberal. He dislike Trump Israel and any right wing position or government except those that oppose Trump. I seen american posters in here argue against China and Russia but defend Iran and North Korea or some other oppressive place. It is strange to me.

Why can't Americans just stop imperialst foreign policy? Why trade 1 Islamic dictatorship for another (Saudis for Iran)??? Iran is better than saudi but at what cost. Being with either is stupid. The Russians dont like Iran it only a weapons selling thing Iran does not do there bidding. Maybe if Iran was a secular muslim state like kazakhstan but it not. Iran is to Russia what Saudi is to USA but less so. Russia is closer with Israel than Iran and close with real stable countries like China and Belarus and Armenia and Kazakhstan etc.
 
Whoever said crime doesn't pay hasn't talked to the family of a Palestinian terrorist. For the Palestine Liberation Organization and the related Palestinian Authority, the killers of Jewish Israelis are considered "martyrs." And as such, their families are paid for the service these murderers have done for the Palestinian cause.

This has come to light this week after a Palestinian, Mohammed Tarayra, stabbed Hallel Yaffa Ariel, a 13-year-old Israeli girl, as she was sleeping in her bed. The stabbing was part of a wave of attacks by Palestinians who have for nearly eight months been shooting, stabbing and running down Jews with the encouragement of social media and popular songs.

Kay Wilson, a British citizen living in Israel, and Kristine Luken, an American, were hiking west of Jerusalem when they were attacked by two members of a Palestinian Authority-based terror cell.

Luken was murdered in the Dec. 18, 2010, attack, and Wilson suffered severe wounds, having been stabbed 13 times, but survived.

Now, Wilson is asking the British Parliament to investigate whether funds the U.K. has provided to the Palestinian Authority are being used to promote terrorism and support jailed terrorists

Just because Israel convicts a Palestinian in a military kangaroo court that convicts in nearly 100% of the cases, does not make these people terrorists.

Be fair.

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That is a definitive tap if I ever saw one.

I know you love Israel. I get that, but again, be fair.
Be fair
You're just jealous because you and the rest of the world knows who is gonna whoop dat azzz... again.
Come on be fair.
th
 
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