Brian Ortega asked Dana White to be paid for UFC 226

[Workaholic]

Ah I wasn't aware he re-signed so recently. In that case yeah, his manager/camp just sucks. A lot of these guys seem to have managers that gleefully take a cut of their money without doing much for their fight purse. "Oh I can get you in the ufc!" Just being a talented prospect will get you to the big show. A manager should be getting you there with a contract that doesn't bend you over. Unfortunately a lot of these guys are really young with no business sense, and seem to blindly trust the first camp and manager to come their way. It really is still a young sport.

They also need to realize that a contract negotiation is more than just a dollar figure and a number of fights. Everything about your career is on the table. Guys like Faber have negotiated what spot they have on the card, you can negotiate a fee for being prepared to fight and your opponent falling out as we've discussed, negotiate the types of fights you want given to you during your contract etc. Of course you need leverage for all of that, but if you have it, why aren't you taking advantage of it? It's just a lack of quality representation and of course the lack of fighter organization

It always comes back to the lack of a union lol

 

[Dirge]

Makes sense but Dana has paid guys in the past that had an opponent pull out late.

That they provided a replacement for?

Proof?

 

[Mike]

I get the sense that there is no real standard when it comes to what is the contracts for the fighters, which is fuckin ridiculous for a billion dollar company.

It's divide and conquer. They negotiate each contract separately, behind closed doors, and forbid fighters from sharing info on who is making what. It's the same reason most companies have a policy about not discussing pay. They don't want employees to realize there is not an established minimum or maximum pay for MOST work. It comes down to what each person brings to the table and can negotiate, and some people are absolutely terrible negotiators. Honestly probably most people.

 

[Deleted member 546119]

LMFAO @ all the Corporate Slaves siding with the Corporate Master...Fuck, you people are Corporate Cucks.

He did everything he could to fight Max Halloway.....Max Halloway pulled out....He was offered a replacement but it was a risk and he opt not to.


Up to the Max Halloway pull out point...He did everything, promos, media, weight cut etc.....He fucking did it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


He atleast deserves a bit of paycheck for what he did do....At least the fucking expenses he wasted.


UFC is a crap company, so it doesn't surprise me.

Fuck that. He refused 2 fights. He should not get paid for anything. Fuck em

 

[GOATER]

Gluck getting a music promoter to pay a band $ for canceling a show because one of their band members got sick & couldn't perform & they didn't carry on the show.

@brian

His job isn't just fighting on fight night.

He did Promos, Media, the weightcut, and whatever the fuck else the UFC asked of him before Max Holloway pulled out.

He deserves to at least be paid for what he actually did.

Keep being a Corporate Cuck.

 

[IVovchanchyn]

i don't think he should have made his purse, but they could have at least covered his flight and everything he's actually out of pocket for. Would be like calling for a plumber and telling him you dont need him when he gets there. You're going to have to pay him for his travel and showing up. He won't charge you for the job, but youre going to have to cover i think its the first hours cost.

 

[GOATER]

Fuck that. He refused 2 fights. He should not get paid for anything. Fuck em

@Hitto

Again...his job isn't just fighting.


He did everything the UFC asked before hand like Promos, Media, Weight cutting, etc...He literally did everything until Max Holloway pulled out.

He deserves money for what he did.


We get it bro....You're a corporate slave who gets fucked over each day by corporations so you feel Ortega must get fucked as well....We get it.

 

[Mike]

They also need to realize that a contract negotiation is more than just a dollar figure and a number of fights. Everything about your career is on the table. Guys like Faber have negotiated what spot they have on the card, you can negotiate a fee for being prepared to fight and your opponent falling out as we've discussed, negotiate the types of fights you want given to you during your contract etc. Of course you need leverage for all of that, but if you have it, why aren't you taking advantage of it? It's just a lack of quality representation and of course the lack of fighter organization

It always comes back to the lack of a union lol

Yep guys have negotiated when they get a title fight, if that title fight has to be on ppv so they get points, or can be on a free card. Where specifically on a card they fight, how many fights you can refuse, in what increments your pay increases if you win. Even in the reebok era some fighters negotiate for and DEMAND individual sponsors. A good rule for life is always know your value, and start negotiations asking for more than you actually want. Get as much for yourself as you can.

Too many people think being quiet and loyal will get you paid. That's just not the case at a lot of companies. Open mouths get fed. If you're happy to toil along for 30/30 with no caveats, they aren't going to bend over backwards to give you more just to be nice.

 

[PabloMEX]

It's divide and conquer. They negotiate each contract separately, behind closed doors, and forbid fighters from sharing info on who is making what. It's the same reason most companies have a policy about not discussing pay. They don't want employees to realize there is not an established minimum or maximum pay for MOST work. It comes down to what each person brings to the table and can negotiate, and some people are absolutely terrible negotiators. Honestly probably most people.

That's fair. However, UFC should also be doing a much better job at taking preventative steps towards saving their ppv cards.

 

[TheIrishPsycho]

Well what do you expect bro, you are an independent contractor..

 

[Mike]

@Hitto

Again...his job isn't just fighting.


He did everything the UFC asked before hand like Promos, Media, Weight cutting, etc...He literally did everything until Max Holloway pulled out.

He deserves money for what he did.


We get it bro....You're a corporate slave who gets fucked over each day by corporations so you feel Ortega must get fucked as well....We get it.

Should have got it in writing. Never, ever assume you're going to get more than what's written on your contract because you work hard, your boss appreciates past achievements, or out of the goodness of their heart. If you're going to be unsatisfied if you don't get something, better make sure you got it in writing in your contract.

 

[Dirge]

They also need to realize that a contract negotiation is more than just a dollar figure and a number of fights. Everything about your career is on the table. Guys like Faber have negotiated what spot they have on the card, you can negotiate a fee for being prepared to fight and your opponent falling out as we've discussed, negotiate the types of fights you want given to you during your contract etc. Of course you need leverage for all of that, but if you have it, why aren't you taking advantage of it? It's just a lack of quality representation and of course the lack of fighter organization

It always comes back to the lack of a union lol

It's not just a union issue. Everyone keeps parroting that phrase.

Boxers don't have a union and they do just fine. Why? Because the have real agents negotiating for their fights and endorsements. That's the bigger issue here. Plenty of casuals can name a couple of top boxers off the top of their heads but have no clue which promotions they fight for, Which of several belts they hold etc. That's because they boxers are promoted rather than the org they are fighting for.

Watch any boxing promo vs, a UFC promo. The boxing promo is all about the fighters, the UFC is all about the UFC brand

Guys that make it to the UFC need a real agents instead of letting their camps or coaches negotiate for them.

The fighters allowing the UFC to sign the endorsement deal with Reebok with the collectively dumbest thing all of the fighters ever did.

Until fighters actually get signed with proper agencies that protect their interests the UFC will be able to do whatever it wants especially with their insanely restrictive contracts.

Fuck all the fighters sign away their likenesses to the UFC and make no money off UFC swag

 

[Mike]

That's fair. However, UFC should also be doing a much better job at taking preventative steps towards saving their ppv cards.

They just expect everything to go right, then punish the guy that did his job when someone else fucks up. It's completely ridiculous. But, again, stuff like this is why they need to unionize. And stop expecting the ufc to do extra nice stuff because sometimes the Fertittas would. So far from what we've seen the WME era is going to be more cutthroat, not less. Fighters should plan accordingly. Look at Rory. They wanted to lowball the shit out of him, so he said bye then. Now he's making more money guaranteed in Bellator, has sponsorships, and got an immediate shot based on his name.

Fighters need to stand up for themselves, know their value, and be willing to walk if they don't get it. Just like anyone else in any other profession.

 

[GOATER]

Should have got it in writing. Never, ever assume you're going to get more than what's written on your contract because you work hard, your boss appreciates past achievements, or out of the goodness of their heart. If you're going to be unsatisfied if you don't get something, better make sure you got it in writing in your contract.

Yes bro.... A fucking a contender who is dependent on the UFC, is gonna strong arm the Biggest/Best Promotion in MMA by demanding things on a contract, that can easily hype up someone else to be a contender and fuck over Ortega.

I mean, we all know how Dana, Loves people who ask for too much...He never ever fucks them over after.

Wow you people are fucking delusional lol.

Brian Ortega isn't fucking Conor/Brock/Ronda/etc to be asking for pay money incase a fighter drops out....He isn't on that fucking level at all.

If he tries that shit, the fight might of never taken place because Dana/UFC want complete control...Thus he would be fucked.


You people literally have no common sense....Fucking corporate cucks!

 

[High Altitude]

Ah I wasn't aware he re-signed so recently. In that case yeah, his manager/camp just sucks. A lot of these guys seem to have managers that gleefully take a cut of their money without doing much for their fight purse. "Oh I can get you in the ufc!" Just being a talented prospect will get you to the big show. A manager should be getting you there with a contract that doesn't bend you over. Unfortunately a lot of these guys are really young with no business sense, and seem to blindly trust the first camp and manager to come their way. It really is still a young sport.

Unless you are the champ or sell 700k+ ppvs, the managers have very little power and pretty much just take what the ufc gives.

 

[Zefram Cochrane]

I didn't realize sherdog was full of commies and slackers. If you guys ran a business you wouldn't last a week before going bankrupt.

The UFC invested in promotion and offered replacement opponents.
Ortega invested in camp and training. He's completely free to turn down the replacements, but the value he produces comes when he fights. If he doesn't want to fight then fair enough, he keeps the title shot, but there's no reason to pay him for a job he didn't do. The fact it wasn't his fault is irrelevant. It wasn't UFC's fault either. They both know when a fight is made that fighters pulling out is a risk and they take it. Well, entrepreneurial risk 101, both Ortega and the UFC will have to put whatever they invested for this fight under the loss column. They don't like it? Then negotiate insurance coverage for these situations. Tough shit, that's life.

The UFC often makes some really disgusting moves, but there's really nothing immoral or unfair about what they did in this case.

 

[Danis_champ]

If UFC pays fighters when their opponent pulls out, no fighter will ever accept a replacement fight again.

UFC should pay 25% of fighter show money. That would be fair it covers the training camp and other costs. I don't think fighters would reject replacement fights when they would get paid only 25% of their purse

The other way would have been dana's promise to give Ortega title shot what ever happens in the Stephens fight

 

[Workaholic]

It's not just a union issue. Everyone keeps parroting that phrase.

Boxers don't have a union and they do just fine. Why? Because the have real agents negotiating for their fights and endorsements. That's the bigger issue here. Plenty of casuals can name a couple of top boxers off the top of their heads but have no clue which promotions they fight for, Which of several belts they hold etc. That's because they boxers are promoted rather than the org they are fighting for.

Watch any boxing promo vs, a UFC promo. The boxing promo is all about the fighters, the UFC is all about the UFC brand

Guys that make it to the UFC need a real agents instead of letting their camps or coaches negotiate for them.

The fighters allowing the UFC to sign the endorsement deal with Reebok with the collectively dumbest thing all of the fighters ever did.

Until fighters actually get signed with proper agencies that protect their interests the UFC will be able to do whatever it wants especially with their insanely restrictive contracts.

Fuck all the fighters sign away their likenesses to the UFC and make no money off UFC swag

I said almost all of this earlier in the thread except for the boxing comparison

The reason boxing and MMA isn't comparable is there is no dominant boxing organization. The UFC has made the brand bigger than the athlete. They should have fought against that harder, like boxers did but they didn't and that fight has for all intents and purposes been lost. Unionizing is the most intelligent course of action to combat that at this point

 

[TheAmericanGazelle]

It's interesting how some people in this thread are funneling this through their emotional and mental issues instead of just straightforward economics/business.

 

[High Altitude]

i don't think he should have made his purse, but they could have at least covered his flight and everything he's actually out of pocket for. Would be like calling for a plumber and telling him you dont need him when he gets there. You're going to have to pay him for his travel and showing up. He won't charge you for the job, but youre going to have to cover i think its the first hours cost.

And that is all agreed to before the plumber even gets in his truck.

If it isn’t in the contract, it isn’t in the contract.

Ortega should have took the fight with Jeremy. He fucked up, lowered his stock, pissed off his boss, lost fans etc.... all because he didn’t want to fight someone who he will fight eventually anyway.

The ufc was willing to make it an interim title fight. Ortega should have jumped on it.

It was an outstanding opportunity to further his career and put his relationship with the ufc and Dana in a position for easier negotiations for better pay and preferential future treatment.