Can running be replaced by a different type of cardio?

[mozfonky]

Never said running is bad, did I say running is necessary if you're doing all sports specific work (boxing)? Did I say running is a good supplement ontop of sports specific work (boxing)?

Do all boxers run? There are boxers that do and dont. Ofcourse it helps but its not the end of the world if all your conditioning comes from the actual sport itself.

Never did boxing but Ive had 15 smokers for muay thai, and 3 tournaments for bjj. Coach and cornered amateur fighters for muay thai and bjj as well. ive done camps with and without running. Your primary conditioning should come from the sport itself. Drills, more drills, drill so more, sparring ect. Anything added is either more sports specific work or non sports specific work for the overall conditioning.

sports specific doesn't optimize your body, that's what we're talking about here. I have to admit, I hated running when I was young and I mistakenly thought I could get into tip top shape if I trained real hard, and I got into great shape but I learned how limiting the boxing skills are for your wind. People are always trying to look for shortcuts and new, sexy ways to do things, sometimes the wheel cannot be improved. That guy you mentioned who worked with fighters from my old gym, I don't know anything about him but i've seen pics of guys running with weights attached to them, it just seems so unnesseary, it might look romantic and liek the guy is training hard but I don't really believe it's needed that bad. And for whatever reason, most of the guys from my old gym have ended fights heaving and breathing hard after even not so tough fights. I'm not gonna mention names but there was one guy who was starting to make a name for himself there and I told one of my younger buddies who still trained there "his stamina is fucked" not that I knew the guy but I saw how they trained and sure enough, he had a loss that stopped him from getting anywhere because his punches didn't work and he was exhaused after two rounds, i think it was ufc but I can't remember offhand, it may have been another org. DJ seems to have his stamina under wraps but he's about the only one I've seen. Ivan came in shape a few times before his outside issues fucked his career up but believe me, the guys I saw really just hangout. Whether other places are like that or they all are, I don't know but it looks like it from the results I see. Like I said, it's more a social thing for these guys than anything else, which put me off of it. I never understood people who have to fake being friends with people who won't even be in your life in five years. never. but then they thought i was weird, I just wanted to fight, the socializing, the politics, the laziness all literally made me physically sick just thinking how long and slow a road it would be relying on incompetent people. Boxing in my area was and is pretty nonexistent so I would have had to relocate and take a risk with that and I was fully aware how deep the talent pool was in boxing.

 

[MMouse]

sports specific doesn't optimize your body, that's what we're talking about here. I have to admit, I hated running when I was young and I mistakenly thought I could get into tip top shape if I trained real hard, and I got into great shape but I learned how limiting the boxing skills are for your wind. People are always trying to look for shortcuts and new, sexy ways to do things, sometimes the wheel cannot be improved. That guy you mentioned who worked with fighters from my old gym, I don't know anything about him but i've seen pics of guys running with weights attached to them, it just seems so unnesseary, it might look romantic and liek the guy is training hard but I don't really believe it's needed that bad. And for whatever reason, most of the guys from my old gym have ended fights heaving and breathing hard after even not so tough fights. I'm not gonna mention names but there was one guy who was starting to make a name for himself there and I told one of my younger buddies who still trained there "his stamina is fucked" not that I knew the guy but I saw how they trained and sure enough, he had a loss that stopped him from getting anywhere because his punches didn't work and he was exhaused after two rounds, i think it was ufc but I can't remember offhand, it may have been another org. DJ seems to have his stamina under wraps but he's about the only one I've seen. Ivan came in shape a few times before his outside issues fucked his career up but believe me, the guys I saw really just hangout. Whether other places are like that or they all are, I don't know but it looks like it from the results I see. Like I said, it's more a social thing for these guys than anything else, which put me off of it. I never understood people who have to fake being friends with people who won't even be in your life in five years. never. but then they thought i was weird, I just wanted to fight, the socializing, the politics, the laziness all literally made me physically sick just thinking how long and slow a road it would be relying on incompetent people. Boxing in my area was and is pretty nonexistent so I would have had to relocate and take a risk with that and I was fully aware how deep the talent pool was in boxing.

Those exercises you mentioned are most likely gpp (general physical preparediness). In camp or prepping for an actual sport, nothing beats doing the actual sport itself first and foremost.

Nothing against running as its a great supplement. But if you cant or dont want to do it, there's nothing wrong with that either so aslong your primary conditioning is the sport itself and you make up the additional hours if need be.

Nothing optimizes the body getting ready for the sport than doing the actual sport itself. Any additional work is great if need be

Again nothing against running.

 

[mozfonky]

well, we gotta disagree on that one. the old school trainers would too, definitely, they might not even train a guy who won't run, i don't know.

 

[CodeBreaker]

I do jump ropes more than running.

 

[mozfonky]

jumping rope is great too but it ain't running.

 

[aries]

Has anyone used one of these before? I just joined a new gym and figured I do 10 minutes on it. I lasted about 3 minutes before I had to get off. The intensity is way higher than any machine I've ever used before for cardio. It's ten times harder than running.

 

[mozfonky]

I have one at my gym, i haven't touched it but I might. You wanna know the tiredest i've gotten in years? It was recently when I was doing a job for customers, they were building their own gym at the top of their house, they had these workout mats that were big and heavy so, because women are no help with stuff like that, i had to do it alone, first issue was trying to roll them up somehow so I didn't have to try dragging a big sheet of rubber up some steps, then, holding them in that position while i walked up stairs, it was awkward it wasn't fun and it had me heaving harder than i had in years trying to catch my breath, I made, i think four trips up two flights of narrow steps, I'm still trying to figure out why it was so taxing, and i don't know how much the matts actually weighed but I don't think they were more than 150 pounds. the kind of weight I often handle albeit with someone on the other end of a heavy piece of furniture. Anyway, it was painful, tiredest I've been for a long long time.

 

[ccm22]

Has anyone used one of these before? I just joined a new gym and figured I do 10 minutes on it. I lasted about 3 minutes before I had to get off. The intensity is way higher than any machine I've ever used before for cardio. It's ten times harder than running.

I was looking into getting one of these for my basement a couple of years ago, but I wasn’t sure I had the room. I opted for a concept 2 instead but I’ve always wondered what if?

 

[aries]

I was looking into getting one of these for my basement a couple of years ago, but I wasn’t sure I had the room. I opted for a concept 2 instead but I’ve always wondered what if?

I rowed plenty of miles on a concept 2 and they are great machines. But this thing, it's on another level. Mind you it's a lot more expensive than a concept 2.

 

[ccm22]

I rowed plenty of miles on a concept 2 and they are great machines. But this thing, it's on another level. Mind you it's a lot more expensive than a concept 2.

No kidding! It was about 4k. Also looked at a versa climber but didn’t have the clearance downstairs and the wife was against putting it In The living room. The rower is good enough though. I think I’m at 3.5 million metres and counting

 

[Eisenhans]

Okay, now this is off-topic technically since the study is about Judo and not boxing, but here you go:
"Olympic preparation in Brazilian judo athletes" by Takito et al.

http://www.academia.edu/14286019/Olympic_preparation_in_Brazilian_judo_athletes

Aside from cleaning up the myth that Olympic athletes train like 6-8 hours per day (something I have read on Sherdog time and time again) - the average training time per week is 26.3 hours, including everything - at 6 days/week and 2 session/day (this translates to a training session being like 2.1 hours on average). Interestingly, the study also examines what and how the Brazilian Judo guys trained. And that includes cardio.

On page 1609, we can read the cardio/exercise table. Literally 0% of Judo medalists did no running at all. 80% of medalists didn't swim, 90% didn't cycle (and 30% didn't do any strength training which is also surprising). And about running, 30% of medalists did no sprinting, and 30% only did sprints 1-2 times a week.

So, again, this is about Judo. But it presents a strong case for LISS - there just isn't a way around it apparently.

 

[ccm22]

Okay, now this is off-topic technically since the study is about Judo and not boxing, but here you go:
"Olympic preparation in Brazilian judo athletes" by Takito et al.

http://www.academia.edu/14286019/Olympic_preparation_in_Brazilian_judo_athletes

Aside from cleaning up the myth that Olympic athletes train like 6-8 hours per day (something I have read on Sherdog time and time again) - the average training time per week is 26.3 hours, including everything - at 6 days/week and 2 session/day (this translates to a training session being like 2.1 hours on average). Interestingly, the study also examines what and how the Brazilian Judo guys trained. And that includes cardio.

On page 1609, we can read the cardio/exercise table. Literally 0% of Judo medalists did no running at all. 80% of medalists didn't swim, 90% didn't cycle (and 30% didn't do any strength training which is also surprising). And about running, 30% of medalists did no sprinting, and 30% only did sprints 1-2 times a week.

So, again, this is about Judo. But it presents a strong case for LISS - there just isn't a way around it apparently.

It would be interesting to read about the training of judo athletes in other strong judo countries. I know many serious competitors I went to judo with as a youngster didn’t do much training outside of of their judo training, other than running 5k or so at a decent pace.

 

[PHATV]

I'm old-school, but not running would be a mistake, IMO. Lots of running and rope work over years not only gives you cardio, but helps your chin---in the sense that it helps you keep your legs under you if you get clipped and need to hold or get on your bike for a bit. To be clear, it won't stiffen your beard, but you get what I'm saying.
Better than sans running and rope work, anyway. Swimming many laps is very good as well, but running/rope is a prerequisite, I'd think. For cardio mainly, but rhythm and footwork deftness as well.
But get your knee checked out thoroughly first, and if you can't, you can't. And I'm sure you can do something, but I'm one in the you really have to run to box at a high-level camp. Other than a unicorn or two who do something else.
Martinez was mentioned, but soccer is running is the way I look at that.

 

[Omni1]

I'm getting an MRI on my knee because of constant popping. There's barely ever any pain, but when there is it's maybe 2/10 pain, very dull. Now I've still been running, but could I cycle or swim until I'm cleared by the ortho? The pain started about a month ago when I decided to go 6 days in a row running fast paced, 5k's. I'm getting back into boxing within the next couple months and I want to stay in shape. Can I just keep powering through the runs, or should I take a break from it?

If you enjoy running then run on grass in order to save your joints.

 

[eon001]

Shin splints have fucked up my chances of long distance running. I planned on doing some half marathons, but I'll be luck to do a 5k. I can just about manage a high pace sprint for 5 minutes on the treadmill.

I'm loving the step machine though. Get's your heart rate up quicker.

 

[Terp]

Sounds like you have tendonitis. I'd focus on strengthening your leg muscles so they absorb the impact more so than your tendons.

 

[caesar]

Jumping ropes sounded like a perfect activity (because I could do it at home), but is it good for weight loss?

You want to lose weight and you're asking if skipping rope will help, seriously man, you must know the answer to this lol.
Yeah, skipping rope for weight loss is the best, cheapest, most time efficient, and most accurate form of training that you can do, as well as improving balance, coordination, brain activity, it's the total package of a workout.

 

[aries]

Those exercises you mentioned are most likely gpp (general physical preparediness). In camp or prepping for an actual sport, nothing beats doing the actual sport itself first and foremost.

Nothing against running as its a great supplement. But if you cant or dont want to do it, there's nothing wrong with that either so aslong your primary conditioning is the sport itself and you make up the additional hours if need be.

Nothing optimizes the body getting ready for the sport than doing the actual sport itself. Any additional work is great if need be

Again nothing against running.

I know that you aren't suggesting that one only does the sport as your only form of conditioning but I wanted to highlight the importance of cross-training. The problem is the body becomes really efficient at doing the exercise you throw at it all the time so that the cardio improvements become harder and harder to come by. If you do just your sport for your cardio needs you'll only improve to a point. The body improves faster at something that it is inefficient at. So if you've never swam before and you adopt it as your form of cross training then you'll experience the fastest gains in cardio that you can possibly experience. That's one of the benefits of cross-training. So if anything you should be mixing up your cross-training to get the most bang for your buck.

The other benefit of cross-training is injury prevention. If you do the same motor patterns repeatedly that's a sure fire way to pick up an overuse injury.

 

[MMouse]

I know that you aren't suggesting that one only does the sport as your only form of conditioning but I wanted to highlight the importance of cross-training. The problem is the body becomes really efficient at doing the exercise you throw at it all the time so that the cardio improvements become harder and harder to come by. If you do just your sport for your cardio needs you'll only improve to a point. The body improves faster at something that it is inefficient at. So if you've never swam before and you adopt it as your form of cross training then you'll experience the fastest gains in cardio that you can possibly experience. That's one of the benefits of cross-training. So if anything you should be mixing up your cross-training to get the most bang for your buck.

The other benefit of cross-training is injury prevention. If you do the same motor patterns repeatedly that's a sure fire way to pick up an overuse injury.

Definitely. It can be secondary to the sport if the sport was a priority.

It helps prevent overuse injury, helps break up monotonous schedule, helps to the overall conditioning. I agree with what you said.

Specialty athletes like Wrestlers, boxers, and thai boxers ran since the beginning of time added on top of their training regime. Just said running doesnt have to be all or end all if the sport was a priority.

If one cant run due to injury while getting ready for a fight, last thing that athlete needs is to run so more. You replace it with the next best exercise so that they maintain their conditioning levels without making the injury worse.

 

[mozfonky]

skipping rope is great, it's a staple, obviously, but you don't work your legs like you do running, you don't kick, pull and push lie you do when you run, when i was in good shape ironically, i could jump rope way better than i could run, now that i'm fat, i can hardly jump rope anymore without heaving after a couple minutes, i can actually run better, again, things are different, you need more than one.