Cro Cop says he was the only guy that had the balls to fight a prime Bob Sapp

[Da Killa]

My personal opinion is that Sapp might have been on some serious PEDs, not only the obvious steroid regiment, but stuff to boost his aggressiveness in the ring. I think after the Cro Cop fight he just realized that the injuries that he would sustain from fighting like that, taking all the damage in the ring would come back and hit him after the fights. Look at he head shots he takes in the Hoost fights, it's unreal what shots he just walks right through. Without his special juice he just didn't have it in him, and just wanted to avoid serious harm to himself while still getting his paychecks.

 

[V5RED]

"Prime Sapp" is like "Fancy Ketchup"

 

[cambo78]

He started throwing fights after mirko fucked his eye up. There was times in the hoost fights where hoost hurt the guy,and dropped him w body shot but sapp got up and fought on. Wed never really see that from him again. Aerts hit him w one knee and dude quit

I watched both fights (along with all of the K-1 ppv's) but saying Sapp "had a prime" when his biggest wins were against Hoost (who had been fighting for 20 years at that time, but regardless quality wins)..... In mma (Yamamoto, losing record.....Tamura, on a 4 fight losing streak before facing Sapp..... Takayama, 1-4 in MMA) is ridiculous. He's been the same fighter his entire life. He just had [mostly] shitty opponents during his so called "prime".

 

[moreorless87]

Dude, mma and K1 are new sports born in 1993.

Believe what you want, but don't tell me i am the one delusional because you are the one that believe in fairy tales and you are the one obsessed with old fighters from Pride.

Yep kickboxing didn't exist before 1993 and Glory's HW division today is better than K-1's in the late 90's/early 00's right?

Again with the simplistic newbie talk, this is the kind of thing Rogan fills the heads of people who've been watching MMA for 6 months with. Notice how it falls back to extreme generalisations because if you look at all in-depth something like Ngannou's performance vs Stipe simply doesnt stand up to logic as "evolution". Not to say certain divisions in MMA haven't improved with time but HW is clearly not one of them.

 

[HHJ]

I watched both fights (along with all of the K-1 ppv's) but saying Sapp "had a prime" when his biggest wins were against Hoost (who had been fighting for 20 years at that time, but regardless quality wins)..... In mma (Yamamoto, losing record.....Tamura, on a 4 fight losing streak before facing Sapp..... Takayama, 1-4 in MMA) is ridiculous. He's been the same fighter his entire life. He just had [mostly] shitty opponents during his so called "prime".

I wouldn't say he had a prime either,but he got changed when he got seriously hurt for the first time.

 

[Bubblun]

Yep kickboxing didn't exist before 1993 and Glory's HW division today is better than K-1's in the late 90's/early 00's right?

Again with the simplistic newbie talk, this is the kind of thing Rogan fills the heads of people who've been watching MMA for 6 months with. Notice how it falls back to extreme generalisations because if you look at all in-depth something like Ngannou's performance vs Stipe simply doesnt stand up to logic as "evolution". Not to say certain divisions in MMA haven't improved with time but HW is clearly not one of them.

Listen Hoost at minute 2 and 30 seconds in this video.
He says that when he started there weren't professional fighters, he was training 3 times a week and started to be a real professional in his 30ies.
Now every top fighter is a professional, today these sports are more mainstream and there are a lot more opportunities.

You and other clueless fans have this nostalgic idea that fighters from the past were invincible demigods, but they had to face a lot more problems that kids that want to be fighters today don't have to face.



Ngannou is a fit in shape 270 pounds monster that moves like a middleweight, we never saw a guy like this in mma before and the guy can strike very well.
Are you trying to compare him to Sapp?



Tell me when Sapp demonstrated to hit like this.
Sapp had MONTHS of training going into the Hoost and Nogueira fights, he was doing K1 and mma at the same time and being in every damn japanese tv show.
The only thing that Sapp had was being absolutely massive, he didn't even knew the rules, he was disqualified in the past and should have been disqualified more.

This is what you call "prime Bob Sapp".

 

[moreorless87]

Listen Hoost at minute 2 and 30 seconds in this video.
He says that when he started there weren't professional fighters, he was training 3 times a week and started to be a real professional in his 30ies.
Now every top fighter is a professional, today these sports are more mainstream and there are a lot more opportunities.

You and other clueless fans have this nostalgic idea that fighters from the past were invincible demigods, but they had to face a lot more problems that kids that want to be fighters today don't have to face.

Ngannou is a fit in shape 270 pounds monster that moves like a middleweight, we never saw a guy like this in mma before and the guy can strike very well.
Are you trying to compare him to Sapp?



Tell me when Sapp demonstrated to hit like this.
Sapp had MONTHS of training going into the Hoost and Nogueira fights, he was doing K1 and mma at the same time and being in every damn japanese tv show.
The only thing that Sapp had was being absolutely massive, he didn't even knew the rules, he was disqualified in the past and should have been disqualified more.

This is what you call "prime Bob Sapp".

Hoost personally was an up and coming fighter and to some degree the Dutch kickboxing scene was just developing although fighters like Dekkers had significant success. The idea you were pushing that K-1 represented a totally new sport in 1993 just doesn't hold up, professional kickboxing had existed for decades prior to that and K-1 was an individual promotion with slightly different rules.

Now K-1 did certainly draw in talent rapidly and ironically this is actually an argument for how HW MMA evolved as well. When the money became serious and promoters were proactive in signing new talent in advanced very quickly, Hoost, Aerts, JLB, Bernardo, Crocop, Hunt, Hug, etc were all around less that a decade latter. Whats more we saw what happened when that proative investment stopped, HW kickboxing became significantly weaker very quickly just as HW MMA has with only really the UFC around who spend barely any money on new talent(why guys like Ngannou who will start for peanuts are there new hopes).

The reaity is beyond the justification your posting hereis just blindly supporting whatever hype the UFC throw your way, sometimes that hype is legit, if someone claimed Dillashaw represented a fighter on Fedors level I would not be critical of them for example. Your a "Ronda Rousey 1 in a million" kind of fan though who gets highly defencive when people point out that perhaps just maybe you've fallen for corporate spiel telling you that every single thing the UFC is selling you is the bestest best thing EVER!.

Sapp had a couple of years training but honestly watching Ngannou fight Stipe I think the question isn't "how did this guy get so technical so quickly?" and more "how is this guy so lacking in technique after 5+ years?" that to me was a daming criticism of supposedly "evolved" modern training. Physically as well Ngannou looked more than a little like Sapp(who lets remember was 350lbs+) or Lesnar to me, big and fast but clumsy, certainly not something new to MMA.

 

[Bubblun]

Hoost personally was an up and coming fighter and to some degree the Dutch kickboxing scene was just developing although fighters like Dekkers had significant success. The idea you were pushing that K-1 represented a totally new sport in 1993 just doesn't hold up, professional kickboxing had existed for decades prior to that and K-1 was an individual promotion with slightly different rules.

Now K-1 did certainly draw in talent rapidly and ironically this is actually an argument for how HW MMA evolved as well. When the money became serious and promoters were proactive in signing new talent in advanced very quickly, Hoost, Aerts, JLB, Bernardo, Crocop, Hunt, Hug, etc were all around less that a decade latter. Whats more we saw what happened when that proative investment stopped, HW kickboxing became significantly weaker very quickly just as HW MMA has with only really the UFC around who spend barely any money on new talent(why guys like Ngannou who will start for peanuts are there new hopes).

The reaity is beyond the justification your posting hereis just blindly supporting whatever hype the UFC throw your way, sometimes that hype is legit, if someone claimed Dillashaw represented a fighter on Fedors level I would not be critical of them for example. Your a "Ronda Rousey 1 in a million" kind of fan though who gets highly defencive when people point out that perhaps just maybe you've fallen for corporate spiel telling you that every single thing the UFC is selling you is the bestest best thing EVER!.

Sapp had a couple of years training but honestly watching Ngannou fight Stipe I think the question isn't "how did this guy get so technical so quickly?" and more "how is this guy so lacking in technique after 5+ years?" that to me was a daming criticism of supposedly "evolved" modern training. Physically as well Ngannou looked more than a little like Sapp(who lets remember was 350lbs+) or Lesnar to me, big and fast but clumsy, certainly not something new to MMA.

Your bias towards Pride is making you blind, i don't give a damn about the UFC, i only care about fights.
We aren't in 2007 anymore, all this UFC vs Pride is ridiculous.

This is the disclosed payroll of Pride 2006 in Las Vegas

Main Event Fighters

-Fedor Emelianenko: $100,000 (defeated Mark Coleman)

-Mark Coleman: $70,000 (lost to Fedor Emelianenko)

Main Card Fighters

-Josh Barnett: $60,000 (defeated Pawel Nastula)

-Dan Henderson: $50,000 (defeated Vitor Belfort)

-Kevin Randleman: $40,000 (lost to Mauricio “Shogun” Rua)

-Vitor Belfort: $30,000 (lost to Dan Henderson)

-Eric “Butterbean” Esch: $30,000 (defeated Sean O’Haire)

-Mauricio “Shogun” Rua: $25,000 (defeated Kevin Randleman)

-Pawel Nastula: $20,000 (lost to Josh Barnett)

-Phil Baroni: $15,000 (defeated Yosuke Nishijima)

-Yosuke Nishijima: $15,000 (lost to Phil Baroni)

-Sean O’Haire: $15,000 (lost to Eric “Butterbean” Esch)

-Kazuhiro Nakamura: $10,000 (defeated Travis Galbraith)

-Robbie Lawler: $10,000 (defeated Joey Villasenor)

-Joey Villasenor: $3,000 (lost to Robbie Lawler)

-Travis Galbraith: $2,000 (lost to Kazuhiro Nakamura)

Disclosed Fighter Payroll: $495,000



https://www.mmaweekly.com/pride-usa-fighter-salaries-2


And this the 2007 show


Main Event Fighters

-Wanderlei Silva: $150,000 (28th fight in Pride; lost to Dan Henderson in main event)

-Dan Henderson: $50,000 (18th fight in Pride; defeated Wanderlei Silva in main event)

Main Card Fighters

-Mauricio “Shogun” Rua: $50,000 (13th fight in Pride; defeated Alistair Overeem)

-Takanori Gomi: $20,000 (15th fight in Pride; lost to Nick Diaz)

-Antonio Rogerio Nogueira: $20,000 (10th fight in Pride; lost to Rameau Thierry Sokoudjou)

-Nick Diaz: $15,000 (1st fight in Pride; defeated Takanori Gomi)

-Joachim Hansen: $15,000 (6th fight in Pride; defeated Jason Ireland)

-Hayato Sakurai: $10,000 (11th fight in Pride; defeated Mac Danzig)

-Frank Trigg: $10,000 (2nd fight in Pride; defeated Kazuo Misaki)

-Kazuo Misaki: $10,000 (8th fight in Pride; lost to Frank Trigg)

-Sergei Kharitonov: $10,000 (11th fight in Pride; defeated Mike Russow)

-Alistair Overeem: $10,000 (14th fight in Pride; lost to Mauricio “Shogun” Rua)

-Travis Wiuff: $10,000 (1st fight in Pride; lost to James Lee)

-Rameau Thierry Sokoudjou: $10,000 (1st fight in Pride; defeated Antonio Rogerio Nogueira)

-Mac Danzig: $10,000 (1st fight in Pride; lost to Hayato Sakurai)

-Jason Ireland: $10,000 (1st fight in Pride; lost to Joachim Hansen)

-Mike Russow: $10,000 (1st fight in Pride; lost to Sergei Kharitonov)

-James Lee: $10,000 (1st fight in Pride; defeated Travis Wiuff)

Disclosed Fighter Payroll: $430,000

https://www.mmaweekly.com/pride-fighter-salaries-for-the-second-coming-2



Ngannou is getting more money than the whole Pride cards, tell me how the UFC stopped investing money or some fantasy stuff like that.

MMA is getting bigger and bigger, there are more gyms and practitioners all around the world, fighters are paid more money than ever, this idea that the sport peaked a decade ago when the sport itself was 10 years old is ridiculous and nostalgia driven.
Believe what you want to believe, i already know that your aren't going to change your idea.

 

[moreorless87]

K-1 were notorious for hiding there actual pay-outs for US events for tax purposes, I 'm guessing Pride were very similar so those payouts are not to be trusted.

If the UFC investment has been so vast in HW talent can you explain to me why theres so little of it? I mean how many quality fighters have they introduced this decade? Stipe and Ngannou is pretty much it isn't it? maybe Blaydes although honestly he doesn't look thast great to me. The division is depending on guys like Reem, Werdum, Arlovski, Barnett, Hunt, Rothwell, etc who've been around since the Pride era.

Heck even someone like JDS probably got into MMA thinking he would be fighting in Pride, the way he fought Joaquim Ferreira twice for example to me seems like a bit of a giveaway that he got stuck fighting smaller matches for longer than he wanted where as by Pride standards he'd probably have debuted by mid 2007.

That was really the draw for new talent in that era, the promise of good money quickly. The UFC pays established names just as well or better but it simply does not take many risks, it tends to demand fighters spend years in minor orgs then start on very small contracts. You think Crocop and Hunt move to MMA if they need to spend 2-3 years in minor orgs and start off with 20/20K contracts even when they get signed? Heck even Lesnar was actually tempted into MMA by FEG not the UFC.

 

[Readybodisready]

A very undersized Ray Sefo fought prime Sapp soon after CC did actually. That's possibly the most humiliating fight I've ever seen. After Sapp fouled Ray and saw how pissed he got, Bobby took a beating and ended up looking like such a joke. By the end he was literally crying in the ring.

 

[therealdope]

In case any potential MMA newbies on here haven't seen it, here's the context for Sapp "almost breaking Nogueira's spine" that Mirko is referring to:

Agree with CC that Nog-Sapp was the craziest fight ever.

 

[Satchm0]

Getting tooled by Big Nog in MMA, CroCop and LeBanner in k1 in their prime is nothing to be ashamed of.

 

[Bubblun]

K-1 were notorious for hiding there actual pay-outs for US events for tax purposes, I 'm guessing Pride were very similar so those payouts are not to be trusted.

If the UFC investment has been so vast in HW talent can you explain to me why theres so little of it? I mean how many quality fighters have they introduced this decade? Stipe and Ngannou is pretty much it isn't it? maybe Blaydes although honestly he doesn't look thast great to me. The division is depending on guys like Reem, Werdum, Arlovski, Barnett, Hunt, Rothwell, etc who've been around since the Pride era.

Heck even someone like JDS probably got into MMA thinking he would be fighting in Pride, the way he fought Joaquim Ferreira twice for example to me seems like a bit of a giveaway that he got stuck fighting smaller matches for longer than he wanted where as by Pride standards he'd probably have debuted by mid 2007.

That was really the draw for new talent in that era, the promise of good money quickly. The UFC pays established names just as well or better but it simply does not take many risks, it tends to demand fighters spend years in minor orgs then start on very small contracts. You think Crocop and Hunt move to MMA if they need to spend 2-3 years in minor orgs and start off with 20/20K contracts even when they get signed? Heck even Lesnar was actually tempted into MMA by FEG not the UFC.

Obviously you think that those payouts aren't to be trusted, it goes against your fantasy world of Pride stars being paid more than current UFC fighters and that "UFC today doesn't invest in new talent" bullshit.

This is from former Crocop manager during the early Pride years.

"It was understood in these days that Mirko’s K-1 fights would earn him $10,000 to $30,000 US, while his early mixed martial arts bouts would earn him two to three times what his K-1 bouts were paying. You have to remember, K-1 wanted Mirko to lose so they could go back to screwing him over financially."

So Crocop was being paid 10k-30k in K1 and around 50k in the early Pride fights.
You may have said it to exaggerate, but 20k-20k wasn't far off from what Crocop was paid in K1 and the early Pride fights.

"Mirko had agreed his best ever purse of $150,000 US for the Sakuraba fight. This was a huge amount in those days. But when Mirko stepped into Yoyogi Stadium and saw 80,000 people, Mirko’s entourage started to get into his ear. At the stadium, as the event was unfolding, Mirko told K-1 that unless they doubled his money, he wouldn’t be walking out into the ring. You can imagine the shitfight this caused; and finally, Mirko was paid his $300,000; but with it, came Ishii’s banishment back into the wilderness. After the event, Ishii publicly pronounced that Mirko, due to his conduct at Shockwave, would be out of the K-1 Grand Prix that year and it was unclear that he would ever be coming back to K-1"

150k for the Sakuraba fight in front of 80000 people, then Crocop managed to get 300k but pissing off the K1 boss.
150k were a huge amount of money in those days, according to the manager.

"I negotiated a purse of $150,000 for Mirko to take on commercial phenomenon Bob Sapp, but prior to working with me, Mirko was generally fighting in K-1 for $10,000 to $30,000. When he went to PRIDE, I basically put a zero on his K-1 money."

150k to fight Bob Sapp, the guy "nobody wanted to fight".

http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/news/Cro-Cop-vs-former-manager-Miro-Mijatovic

So this is what was being paid the biggest non-freakshow fighter in Pride.



I don't know why you being up Lesnar, but Lesnar got 500k in his K1 fight, that's a lot of money for an mma fight in 2007.

https://www.mmaweekly.com/k-1-dynamite-fighter-salaries-2

Main Event Fighters

-Brock Lesnar: $500,000 (defeated Min Soo Kim; no win bonus)

-Min Soo Kim: $30,000 (lost to Brock Lesnar)

Main Card Fighters

-Royce Gracie: $300,000 (defeated Kazushi Sakuraba; no win bonus)

-Johnnie Morton: $100,000 (lost to Bernard Ackah; purse is being withheld for the time being due to refusal to take drug test)

-Melvin Manhoef: $50,000 (lost to Dong Sik Yoon)

-Jonathan Wiezorek: $40,000 (defeated Tim Persey; includes $25,000 win bonus)

-Kazushi Sakuraba: $30,000 (lost to Royce Gracie)


More than the disclosed pay in his first UFC fight

• Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira ($200,000) def. Tim Sylvia ($100,000)
  
  
• Frank Mir ($80,000) def. Brock Lesnar ($250,000)

I am sure than even the UFC doesn't like to pay taxes, you know what it mean?

Point is, only an absolute idiot would think that fighters were paid more a decade ago, now that the sport grow so much worldwide.
Fertitta bought the UFC from SEG for 2 millions, then bought Pride in 2007 for less than 70 millions, that's peanuts.

 

[moreorless87]

Obviously you think that those payouts aren't to be trusted, it goes against your fantasy world of Pride stars being paid more than current UFC fighters and that "UFC today doesn't invest in new talent" bullshit.

This is from former Crocop manager during the early Pride years.

"It was understood in these days that Mirko’s K-1 fights would earn him $10,000 to $30,000 US, while his early mixed martial arts bouts would earn him two to three times what his K-1 bouts were paying. You have to remember, K-1 wanted Mirko to lose so they could go back to screwing him over financially."

So Crocop was being paid 10k-30k in K1 and around 50k in the early Pride fights.
You may have said it to exaggerate, but 20k-20k wasn't far off from what Crocop was paid in K1 and the early Pride fights.

"Mirko had agreed his best ever purse of $150,000 US for the Sakuraba fight. This was a huge amount in those days. But when Mirko stepped into Yoyogi Stadium and saw 80,000 people, Mirko’s entourage started to get into his ear. At the stadium, as the event was unfolding, Mirko told K-1 that unless they doubled his money, he wouldn’t be walking out into the ring. You can imagine the shitfight this caused; and finally, Mirko was paid his $300,000; but with it, came Ishii’s banishment back into the wilderness. After the event, Ishii publicly pronounced that Mirko, due to his conduct at Shockwave, would be out of the K-1 Grand Prix that year and it was unclear that he would ever be coming back to K-1"

150k for the Sakuraba fight in front of 80000 people, then Crocop managed to get 300k but pissing off the K1 boss.
150k were a huge amount of money in those days, according to the manager.

"I negotiated a purse of $150,000 for Mirko to take on commercial phenomenon Bob Sapp, but prior to working with me, Mirko was generally fighting in K-1 for $10,000 to $30,000. When he went to PRIDE, I basically put a zero on his K-1 money."

150k to fight Bob Sapp, the guy "nobody wanted to fight".

http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/news/Cro-Cop-vs-former-manager-Miro-Mijatovic

So this is what was being paid the biggest non-freakshow fighter in Pride.



I don't know why you being up Lesnar, but Lesnar got 500k in his K1 fight, that's a lot of money for an mma fight in 2007.

https://www.mmaweekly.com/k-1-dynamite-fighter-salaries-2

Main Event Fighters

-Brock Lesnar: $500,000 (defeated Min Soo Kim; no win bonus)

-Min Soo Kim: $30,000 (lost to Brock Lesnar)

Main Card Fighters

-Royce Gracie: $300,000 (defeated Kazushi Sakuraba; no win bonus)

-Johnnie Morton: $100,000 (lost to Bernard Ackah; purse is being withheld for the time being due to refusal to take drug test)

-Melvin Manhoef: $50,000 (lost to Dong Sik Yoon)

-Jonathan Wiezorek: $40,000 (defeated Tim Persey; includes $25,000 win bonus)

-Kazushi Sakuraba: $30,000 (lost to Royce Gracie)


More than the disclosed pay in his first UFC fight

• Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira ($200,000) def. Tim Sylvia ($100,000)
  
  
• Frank Mir ($80,000) def. Brock Lesnar ($250,000)

I am sure than even the UFC doesn't like to pay taxes, you know what it mean?

Point is, only an absolute idiot would think that fighters were paid more a decade ago, now that the sport grow so much worldwide.
Fertitta bought the UFC from SEG for 2 millions, then bought Pride in 2007 for less than 70 millions, that's peanuts.

My point about US payouts its just drawn out of thin air, as I said K-1 were notorious for giving official payouts that were clearly far lower than fighters were actually earning in order to allow them to dodge US taxes.

Again my point isn't that people at the top were earning vastly more in Japan(although someone like Hoost has been talked up as worth more than $10 million, probably with a lot of it via endorsements given how massive fighters exposure was) but that they were paid well enough to switch sports early. You look at the big name HW's who came though in that era and hardly any of them worked there way up over 2-3 years in smaller shows.

Fedor - Straight into Rings
Nog - In Rings within months
Crocop - Strainght into FEG MMA fights then Pride.
Hunt - Straight into Pride
Sergei - Had some fights in 2000 but when he chose MMA full time in 2003 was in Pride in months
Aleks - Straight into Pride

Again the proof is in the results isn't it? if the UFC is offering vast amounts to new talent then why arent't we seeing any? the HW division is full of aging names from the Pride era and barely anyone new this decade. Why isn't someone like Rico Verhoeven in the UFC? heck why aren't about half the big names who's fought in Glory given how much weaker kickboxing is economically these days.

The UFC runs MMA more like a cash cow, very rarely will they make a risky investment paying good money to someone who might or might not adapt, for every Crocop there might be a Leko. This kind of tactic is clearly more effective at drawing in both smaller fighters and US wrestlers who have very limited earning potential in their own sport, its not nearly as effective at drawing in fighters who can earn good amounts in their own sports.

 

[Taric]

Nog was legitimately lucky he wasn't paralyzed for the rest of his life from the Sapp bomb.
How he took that kind of punishment and still found a way to win is still amazing.

 

[moreorless87]

Nog was legitimately lucky he wasn't paralyzed for the rest of his life from the Sapp bomb.
How he took that kind of punishment and still found a way to win is still amazing.

That was actually far more dangerous than the Randleplex, with that throw you can see Fedor keeps his neck loose and the angle naturally bends with it so it was more the risk of the impact KOing him, with Nog he was potentially looking at a broken neck or compressed spine, probably saved by grabbing Sapp's leg and shifting at the last moment.

 

[Bubblun]

My point about US payouts its just drawn out of thin air, as I said K-1 were notorious for giving official payouts that were clearly far lower than fighters were actually earning in order to allow them to dodge US taxes.

Again my point isn't that people at the top were earning vastly more in Japan(although someone like Hoost has been talked up as worth more than $10 million, probably with a lot of it via endorsements given how massive fighters exposure was) but that they were paid well enough to switch sports early. You look at the big name HW's who came though in that era and hardly any of them worked there way up over 2-3 years in smaller shows.

Fedor - Straight into Rings
Nog - In Rings within months
Crocop - Strainght into FEG MMA fights then Pride.
Hunt - Straight into Pride
Sergei - Had some fights in 2000 but when he chose MMA full time in 2003 was in Pride in months
Aleks - Straight into Pride

Again the proof is in the results isn't it? if the UFC is offering vast amounts to new talent then why arent't we seeing any? the HW division is full of aging names from the Pride era and barely anyone new this decade. Why isn't someone like Rico Verhoeven in the UFC? heck why aren't about half the big names who's fought in Glory given how much weaker kickboxing is economically these days.

The UFC runs MMA more like a cash cow, very rarely will they make a risky investment paying good money to someone who might or might not adapt, for every Crocop there might be a Leko. This kind of tactic is clearly more effective at drawing in both smaller fighters and US wrestlers who have very limited earning potential in their own sport, its not nearly as effective at drawing in fighters who can earn good amounts in their own sports.

Ah wait a second, signing someone that is 0-0 "who may adapt or not adapt" isn't something the UFC does these days, and rightly so, we are way past that era.

You want kickboxers that never wrestled a day in their life into the UFC in 2018? They would get murdered or they would be protected as much as possible to not kill their career early.

The fans already give flak to the UFC for protecting certain fighters like Sage Northcutt or Paige VanZant, but at some point everyone needs to face reality, and the reality is that the UFC isn't the place to build up your skillset or make experience starting from 0, UFC is the place where the best fight the best.

Signing established talent with big amateur records or champions in smaller shows like RFA, LFA, Titan and so on, it's the right way to do it, and honestly it's fair to all the young guys that choose to go for the mma route.
But that doesn't mean that "the UFC doesn't invest in new talent", there is a reason why it's the most profitable mma organization in the world, because they are the best in building new talent and promoting it, if not they would have closed shop years ago.

 

[moreorless87]

Ah wait a second, signing someone that is 0-0 "who may adapt or not adapt" isn't something the UFC does these days, and rightly so, we are way past that era.

You want kickboxers that never wrestled a day in their life into the UFC in 2018? They would get murdered or they would be protected as much as possible to not kill their career early.

The fans already give flak to the UFC for protecting certain fighters like Sage Northcutt or Paige VanZant, but at some point everyone needs to face reality, and the reality is that the UFC isn't the place to build up your skillset or make experience starting from 0, UFC is the place where the best fight the best.

Signing established talent with big amateur records or champions in smaller shows like RFA, LFA, Titan and so on, it's the right way to do it, and honestly it's fair to all the young guys that choose to go for the mma route.
But that doesn't mean that "the UFC doesn't invest in new talent", there is a reason why it's the most profitable mma organization in the world, because they are the best in building new talent and promoting it, if not they would have closed shop years ago.

MMA is quite a unique sport unlike any of the comparisons you make, it depends heavily on talent transitioning from other sports and this talent is obviously more likely to switch if its offer good money early. If for example Fedor doesn't have that RINGS contract dangled infront of him via RTT's connections perhaps he desides to stay with Judo? Perhaps Sergei desides to stay as an amature boxer if Pride doesn't come in quickly? Crocop and Hunt almost definitely do not move to MMA if they need to spend 2-3 years in small orgs.

Is there a risk? yeah definitely there is, as highlighted Leko for example who was a total bust as a MMA fighter but you need to take those risks to get the successes.

Someone like Ngannou is the kind of fighter the UFC loves because there was no risk, he didn't have earning potential outside MMA so spent years earning limited amounts on smaller shows or with a small UFC contract. In order to build divisions like HW and LHW you need more than this, you need to be proactive which simply isn't happening enough.

 

[KinG]

there was i time many thought sapp would become unbeatable with more training , that was one of the resons nog wanted to face him early in sapps carrier .
Sapp was feared by many back in the days

 

[Bubblun]

MMA is quite a unique sport unlike any of the comparisons you make, it depends heavily on talent transitioning from other sports and this talent is obviously more likely to switch if its offer good money early. If for example Fedor doesn't have that RINGS contract dangled infront of him via RTT's connections perhaps he desides to stay with Judo? Perhaps Sergei desides to stay as an amature boxer if Pride doesn't come in quickly? Crocop and Hunt almost definitely do not move to MMA if they need to spend 2-3 years in small orgs.

Is there a risk? yeah definitely there is, as highlighted Leko for example who was a total bust as a MMA fighter but you need to take those risks to get the successes.

Someone like Ngannou is the kind of fighter the UFC loves because there was no risk, he didn't have earning potential outside MMA so spent years earning limited amounts on smaller shows or with a small UFC contract. In order to build divisions like HW and LHW you need more than this, you need to be proactive which simply isn't happening enough.

You are massively overestimating how much Fedor, Sergei and all those guys got paid by Pride when they started.

Pride on average paid better than the others orgs, but those guys weren't making millions and only certain fighters were making good money.

According to Enson Inoue

"I think I got $80,000 for the Kerr fight. They paid Sakuraba peanuts. Pride didn’t pay Sakuraba well because Takada was in charge of him. He was taking all the money. Pride would pay Takada Dojo. Sakuraba got a salary from Takada Dojo. … That’s why they ended up having a falling-out. They want nothing to do with each other now."

"I believe Pride was the type of association that could take what they could get. It wasn’t an association where they treated all the fighters fairly. I was treated very differently in Pride because I was needed. I was popular in Japan. They knew I didn’t need them. They played hardball with people that needed them. Igor Vovchanchyn made peanuts -- $10,000. They’d threaten Mark Kerr, go down to where Kerr was training and make sure he was ready. Pretty much bully him around."

Paying a guy like Igor Vovchanchyn 10k isn't exactly go after talent, they were exploiting guys, and i feel bad for Sakuraba, the guy gave his health for this sport.