Darren Till The MuayThai Master

[Snubnoze707]

Where ever did he get the MT master spiel from if he's never actually fought & achieved anything in proper MT

Because the lamestream fight media lacks an ability to differentiate between Kickboxing and Muay Thai. All thing's considered, he wasn't a top dog in Kickboxing either. Nobody outside of the British kickfight circle had heard of him prior to his acclaim.

 

[executionermma]

Till is a cracking fighter

But has he ever fought under full MT rules?

Yes he did, amateur bouts it seems, fought in Thailand too IIRC..

Because the lamestream fight media lacks an ability to differentiate between Kickboxing and Muay Thai. All thing's considered, he wasn't a top dog in Kickboxing either. Nobody outside of the British kickfight circle had heard of him prior to his accolades.

Of course he wasn't a top dog, he was 16-18 years old when he was competing at KB, he was a good and solid prospect, who knows where he could be right now if he hadn't made the transition to MMA..
He beat and hold his own against some other prospects when he was coming up, guys that turned out to be pretty good/legit, like Badoi (Kunlun) and Adrian Mitu (SK)

His case is very different from Stephen Thompson's who came to MMA when he was 27 years old or so and was calling himself a "5 time world champion", Till won a KB tournament in Romania (it's at YT) where he looked to have some serious potential, fast forward a bit and he chooses to fight at MMA.

 

[Snubnoze707]

Yes he did, amateur bouts it seems, fought in Thailand too IIRC..
Of course he wasn't a top dog, he was 16-18 years old when he was competing at KB, he was a good and solid prospect, who knows where he could be right now if he hasn't made the transition to MMA..
He beat and hold his own against some other prospects when he was coming up, guys that turned out to be pretty good/legit, like Badoi (Kunlun) and Adrian Mitu (SK)

His case is very different from Stephen Thompson's who came to MMA when he was 27 years old or so and was calling himself a "5 time world champion", Till won a KB tournament in Romania (it's at YT) where he looked to have some serious potential, fast forward a bit and he chooses to fight at MMA.

I'm not claiming he is a poor fighter or that he wont have success in the UFC, just acknowledging the over hyped narrative that this guy was a big deal in "Muay Thai" before coming into the UFC. I'ts just not accurate.

 

[executionermma]

I'm not claiming he is a poor fighter or that he wont have success in the UFC, just acknowledging the over hyped narrative that this guy was a big deal in "Muay Thai" before coming into the UFC. I'ts just not accurate.

I never saw anyone other than this ultimate goof in MindSmash hyping him as a "MT master" or something like that, i saw some people like Rogan and Shoreman backing up his striking skills, which are legit given his MT background and his success in KB as a up and coming guy, going undefeated while fighting some good prospects. But i guess i understand what you're saying. Probably there's some idiots out there saying that just like UFC does with Stephen Thompson and his "kickboxing world titles", i just never saw it.

 

[PeakyBlinder]

Yes he did, amateur bouts it seems, fought in Thailand too IIRC..
Of course he wasn't a top dog, he was 16-18 years old when he was competing at KB, he was a good and solid prospect, who knows where he could be right now if he hadn't made the transition to MMA..
He beat and hold his own against some other prospects when he was coming up, guys that turned out to be pretty good/legit, like Badoi (Kunlun) and Adrian Mitu (SK)

His case is very different from Stephen Thompson's who came to MMA when he was 27 years old or so and was calling himself a "5 time world champion", Till won a KB tournament in Romania (it's at YT) where he looked to have some serious potential, fast forward a bit and he chooses to fight at MMA.

ok fair enough he had amateur bouts but that doesn't make him an "MT Master"

 

[executionermma]

ok fair enough he had amateur bouts but that doesn't make him an "MT Master"

Sure. But let's not forget this "MT master" thing came out of the mouth of the guy comparing Till to Saenchai.. he's just a uneducated fool.

 

[PeakyBlinder]

Sure. But let's not forget this "MT master" thing came out of the mouth of the guy comparing Till to Saenchai.. he's just a uneducated fool.

you are right mate

 

[VERBAL-FEDOR]

no one,same for stephen Thompson,Cerrone,Edson Barboza and all the other "kickboxing-MT masters" on MMA

Edmund Tarvedeyan was 45-0-1 in underground women’s kickboxing.

Can’t find the videos but best believe Edmundo would have KO’d Gokan Saki back in his day.

 

[Sano]

I can't STAND this Mindsmash guy. Haven't heard about him since everyone was going crazy with Conor and "the law of attraction". If you guys haven't watched that stuff, stay far away. Consider how over the top he was in the OP video. Now imagine Conor being his favourite fighter, the hype with Conor at his height and add the law of attraction. I cringe just thinking about it.

Anyway, Till is a solid fighter. Has a good straight, good range control, decent elbows and solid counters. There's no real "MT masters" in MMA. Well maybe Dejdamrong, though he is past his prime.

 

[Kassitus]

MindSmash getting props from Adessanya

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Well im not trying to be elitist, but MMA is almost always for ignorant people or for who dont know combat sports

TBH I think boxing fans are the most ignorant, because a lot of them would tell you that a top boxer would beat kickboxers and MMA fighters under their own rules.

The annoying thing with these analysts is that for every Jack Slack, BJJ Scout or Conor Reubusch, you have a bunch of others who don't really know any more than the bare basics and present it as though it's advanced knowledge.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Because the lamestream fight media lacks an ability to differentiate between Kickboxing and Muay Thai. All thing's considered, he wasn't a top dog in Kickboxing either. Nobody outside of the British kickfight circle had heard of him prior to his acclaim.

No one had really heard of him from the British circle either

 

[Cocakillbana]

TBH I think boxing fans are the most ignorant, because a lot of them would tell you that a top boxer would beat kickboxers and MMA fighters under their own rules.

The annoying thing with these analysts is that for every Jack Slack, BJJ Scout or Conor Reubusch, you have a bunch of others who don't really know any more than the bare basics and present it as though it's advanced knowledge.

Serious boxing fans don't go out of their lane in the way that "combat sports fans" do to sound like some kind of universalist expert.

Jack Slack was mesmerized that Saenchai was able to throw a straight left, and lauded the fighter for adding it to his repertoire in his Glory debut. The problem with that: Saenchai has had a left straight in his pocket for a long time.

Conor Reubusch has said that Singdam's bad posture Is a result of bad trainers. The problem with that: Singdam doesn't have bad posture and he was produced at freakin Kiatmuu9.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Serious boxing fans don't go out of their lane in the way that "combat sports fans" do to sound like some kind of universalist expert.

Jack Slack was mesmerized that Saenchai was able to throw a straight left, and lauded the fighter for adding it to his repertoire in his Glory debut. The problem with that: Saenchai has had a left straight in his pocket for a long time.

Conor Reubusch has said that Singdam's bad posture Is a result of bad trainers. The problem with that: Singdam doesn't have bad posture and he was produced at freakin Kiatmuu9.

I was talking more about in terms of actual strategy and tactics. Jack and Conor both freely admit that they don't know nearly as much about the Thai scene.

 

[Deleted member 363827]

The Thai scene is pretty much the exception to every rule in boxing, kickboxing, mma, etc.

Whenever a kickboxer/mma fighter manages to win a strap in boxing or vice versa, both sides just trash talk
the shit out of each other that the athletes from their sports are superior.

But when I point out that muay thai fighters from Thailand have been doing that for decades...in 3 or 4 professional boxing fights (Saensak/Veeraphol) my posts basically got ignored.

Such a tragedy that so many great Thai fighters need to fight Westerners to even get acknowledged.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

The Thai scene is pretty much the exception to every rule in boxing, kickboxing, mma, etc.

Whenever a kickboxer/mma fighter manages to win a strap in boxing or vice versa, both sides just trash talk
the shit out of each other that the athletes from their sports are superior.

But when I point out that muay thai fighters from Thailand have been doing that for decades...in 3 or 4 professional boxing fights (Saensak/Veeraphol) my posts basically got ignored.

Such a tragedy that so many great Thai fighters need to fight Westerners to even get acknowledged.

My issue with boxers from Thailand, is that a lot of the time they have a 50-0 record and at least 12 of those fights will be against some guy making his debut. I think that is in part why they're not recognised very often, don't get me wrong, there ARE legit boxers from Thailand, but say a guy like Yodsanan Sityodtong, who I really like, or Srisaket, who really shocked me when he beat Choclatito, have so much padding on the record and they quite often don't fight the best from outside Thailand, which in western boxing is a fairly big deal.

I mean either way, they're still better at western boxing than western boxers are at muay thai, which is why I think they're the best all around strikers in the world, and ironically I think they're better boxers than the dutch who are known for punching in kickboxing, but I do kinda get why their boxing isn't recognised as often.

 

[UWanaPlayDaGame]

(...) when I point out that muay thai fighters from Thailand have been doing that for decades...in 3 or 4 professional boxing fights (Saensak/Veeraphol) my posts basically got ignored.

"Combat sports fans" have made an art out of working around that info. Every time the discussion involves muay thai someone will say that "thais are bad at boxing" and when you point out that Thailand has produced dozens of world boxing champions over several decades guys keep saying that they saw a muay thai fight where someone was winging punches so it means they "have bad hands".

 

[UWanaPlayDaGame]

My issue with boxers from Thailand, is that a lot of the time they have a 50-0 record and at least 12 of those fights will be against some guy making his debut. I think that is in part why they're not recognised very often, don't get me wrong, there ARE legit boxers from Thailand, but say a guy like Yodsanan Sityodtong, who I really like, or Srisaket, who really shocked me when he beat Choclatito, have so much padding on the record and they quite often don't fight the best from outside Thailand, which in western boxing is a fairly big deal.

I mean either way, they're still better at western boxing than western boxers are at muay thai, which is why I think they're the best all around strikers in the world, and ironically I think they're better boxers than the dutch who are known for punching in kickboxing, but I do kinda get why their boxing isn't recognised as often.

Boxing was built on record padding. Every western boxing star has had years of record padding too. is it more obvious with thais? Maybe. They often fight 10-15 fights in Thailand and go undefeated but then again all other boxers have 20-30 fights worth of padding in Las Vegas against cans as well.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Boxing was built on record padding. Every western boxing star has had years of record padding too. is it more obvious with thais? Maybe. They often fight 10-15 fights in Thailand and go undefeated but then again all other boxers have 20-30 fights worth of padding in Las Vegas against cans as well.

I definitely agree with you on that, especially up at heavyweight, but I think the lower weight divisions of boxing tend to have more quality records, I know he's generally an exception anyway because of his amateur career, but Lomachenko is a good example, Rigondeaux too.

You tend to find that after about 15 fights they start fighting more quality opposition, but I've seen Thai's who are still fighting debuting fighters over 40 fights into their career.

 

[UWanaPlayDaGame]

I've seen Thai's who are still fighting debuting fighters over 40 fights into their career.

Lomachenko and Rigondeaux are absolute exceptions. and the thais who are still fighting cans after 40 fights aren't the ones who are worth bringing up when talking about thai boxers. There are several who moved on to legit competition halfway around that and did fine.