do any of you use the philly shell defense??

I used to use it when I was just into boxing. But quickly scrapped it when I started MT and I realized it was getting me tagged with wicked MT kicks. Just my experience with it. I rarely use it if at all now.
 
IkkussSpikkuss said:
I used to use it when I was just into boxing. But quickly scrapped it when I started MT and I realized it was getting me tagged with wicked MT kicks. Just my experience with it. I rarely use it if at all now.
Yeah, it is very susceptible to low kicks, or at least seems to be.

But, I can only imagine it making your own kicks easier to launch, especially for people who like to kick from a more sideways stance.
 
Am I the only person who has ever heard of countering low-kicks as opposed to simply checking them?
 
King Kabuki said:
If you mean you block more and actually do move your hands so the guard isn't so tight, then Alexis Arguello was one of the absolute Masters of that trick. A guy who actally pulled off parrying Wing-Chun style in fights.

Are there more good fighters who are using that style effectively ?
 
so when i am boxing the phillie shell works fine for me.
proof is: everytime i wear a white t-shirt, after 1-2 hours of good sparring, the shoulder part of my tshirt is completely red because i succesfully blocked a lot of red gloves with my shoulder which seem to lose their color easily.

my problem is in kickboxing. when there are highkicks chopping down on you. i am not very confident in my shoulder roll then...
any advice on that? should i just lean back and evade the highkick like the thais? or a simple standard block?

(sorry for my bad english)
 
Are there more good fighters who are using that style effectively ?

Arguello is the model for it IMO because of his success in multiple weight classes. Shane Mosely does it to a degree, so did RJJ, and Salvador Sanchez.

my problem is in kickboxing. when there are highkicks chopping down on you. i am not very confident in my shoulder roll then...
any advice on that? should i just lean back and evade the highkick like the thais? or a simple standard block?

Either or. Using the shell doesn't mean your lead arm ALWAYS has to be down either. That's just the stance. You can snap it up to block-and-counter with the cross. Also, a MT fighter I used to train with used to rush in on high kicks. Trained himself out of the instinct of backing off and did the opposite, came in close. More times than not it worked pretty decent for a clinch.
 
can't u use a stiff jab or straight right to counter the leg kick, to either a) keep them out of range off balance or tag them when they throw it..just come right back w/the r.hand.. or just keep sticking the jab and moving. Kind of keep them from committing to really throwing it.
 
Yeah, footwork can escape the leg-kick a-la Benny Urquidez against Suzuki. A stiff jab can ward it off, a cross is arguably the best counter for it, and Don Wilson used to do a pretty good job of countering with a stiff fast side-kick.
 
thanks kk. heres a hl of winky wright vs quartey . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8dN8CYneqw
i remember watchin this fight, about round 8 a fight broke out in the crowd, and wright turned to see what was going on when the ref broke the fighters apart after a clinch. quartey tipped him on the nose with a jab without too much mustard on it as if to say hey man, this fights more important. was funny shit. good sportsmanship from both guys in this fight.
 
Does anyone have advice for fighting against a guy who uses a philly shell defence??

I use an othodox guard and have never really sparred with someone who uses the shoulder roll/philly shell technique untill recently and I did not have much success. Most of my right hands were caught by his shoulder or deflected by his left arm throwing up a counter jab from his waist...

I could really do with some advice on what to look for/ how to open him up. Are there weak spots to this type of defence?
 
Very difficult to get used to, but once perfected, it is highly effective. People do not know how to react when you use this style. I use it and I know other people who use it as well.
 
Does anyone have advice for fighting against a guy who uses a philly shell defence??

I use an othodox guard and have never really sparred with someone who uses the shoulder roll/philly shell technique untill recently and I did not have much success. Most of my right hands were caught by his shoulder or deflected by his left arm throwing up a counter jab from his waist...

I could really do with some advice on what to look for/ how to open him up. Are there weak spots to this type of defence?

Yeah if you're not used to it, it fucks you up. I play around with it sometimes and its awesome for defence and countering.

According to KK in another thread, use jabs to the shoulder and chest. One thing I've found with some of the dudes I spar is to use feints, just like with anybody else, but I find myself using more of them against the shell. Its really hard to get body shots in and I try to remedy this by changing angles and hitting behind/under their arm.
 
You know watching this I really like it. I'll see how it works with MT and see if I can't hybridize/bastardize it.
 
Does anyone have advice for fighting against a guy who uses a philly shell defence??

I use an othodox guard and have never really sparred with someone who uses the shoulder roll/philly shell technique untill recently and I did not have much success. Most of my right hands were caught by his shoulder or deflected by his left arm throwing up a counter jab from his waist...

I could really do with some advice on what to look for/ how to open him up. Are there weak spots to this type of defence?

I'd jab the lead shoulder, just on the inside, trying to touch the pec muscle itself. It stings a bit to get hit there a lot. Body-jabs as well. The 1-3 to the shoulder works well, too.

It's tough, but you have to think 3-4 punches ahead with a Fighter who uses this style, your first couple of punches should be aimed at getting him to move a specific way, into a better-placed punch.
 
I was going to question KK for putting Hopkins in there but not Mayweather he's probably the best Phily Shell specialist in Modern Boxing.
I have more of a problem with having Hopkins there than Mayweather.

Mayweather is always using it when fighting on the inside and back against the ropes,

Giving Hopkins as an example could confuse some people as he has soo many different defence styles like the traditional and is constantly switching.
 
It can be seen when Hopkins is on the defensive for more than a couple of seconds, he tucks his chin, drops his lead hand, and rolls his shoulders.
 
I enjoy using this but when sparring my instructors always tell me i need to keep both my hands high. It's fun to play around with it. I just train for fun anyways so if I suck it's not like I'm losing any money or anything :)
 
Learning it I think requires more thinking than anything else. Like any other position or style. You look at yourself and say "where/how am I weak, and how can I compensate for that without sacrificing my strengths?" That and getting in there with people who WANT to work against it with you. The perk for them being able to learn where it's weaknesses are. Like anything else, practice. It's a little intricate, yes. But there's also only SO much to it.

@Sinister, do you still feel like the Philly Shell is something boxers can learn via repeated usage in practice/sparring without a coach who specializes in it?

My boxing coach showed me the shoulder roll and the shell a couple of weeks ago and I used it in sparring to great success against someone that had more experience than me.

I've read all the threads on here and have been implementing the tips as well as watching and analyzing Briscoe's highlights and Bentons too.
 
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Only if they have a very advanced ability to learn through reverse engineering and can extrapolate the systems answers for a fight 's "questions."
 
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