educated liberals lack the courage to sanction those dedicated to shutting down speakers

[jeffk]

The CNN website sucks cancer balls with their autoplay videos with sound. Still this is a good article on the site by John McWhorter.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/21/opini...beral-protestors-mcwhorter-opinion/index.html

(CNN)No one can fail to be amazed by the courage of the people who protested segregation and bigotry in the 1950s and 1960s. Those who endured physical injury justifiably stick in our minds the most.

Today's educated liberals lack the courage they admire in their forebears, at a time when it is needed more than ever. Namely, too many liberals in power lack the guts to sanction those dedicated to shouting down speakers from the right. Instead, they let pass a state of dialogue as choked as the one that Berkeley's Free Speech movement resisted.

Mark Lilla is accused of making white supremacy "respectable" -- for suggesting that Democrats emphasize identity politics less with the goal of winning the White House from Donald Trump.

The verdict is in: even those of us deeply committed to battling discrimination and inequality find this shutting down of speakers barbaric: nonintellectual, uncivil, crude, counterproductive.

 

[wonderbread]

For every asswad lib there is a asswad conservative. Problem we have is the double standard both parties seem to have. Giving their own party a pass on the same shit they bitch about the other side doing.

 

[PolishHeadlock]

McWhorter is a good egg.

 

[Swing]

Everyone in any position of authority seems so worried about the optics of any given situation. It's disheartening. It's pretty easy to find people who were formerly involved in politics and the like that are willing to take positions that I think reasonable people identify with, but it seems like the large majority of individuals whose jobs depend on some form of popular support have all lost their backbones.

The unwillingness to guarantee an environment where guest speakers are allowed to voice their views is so shortsighted it gives me a headache.

 

[Liquid Smoke]

Is there anything new to be said about any of this? Can't we just move on already?

 

[HereticBD]

In order to address a problem, you must first recognize that there is one. A lot of Liberals are struggling with the latter at the moment.

 

[jeffk]

McWhorter was on Glenn Loury's show the other night. They talk about Ta-Nehisi Coates. McWhorter's biggest beef isn't so much about Coates himself. He isn't a fan of Coates because he doesn't think he Coates is aspirational and doesn't think Coates recognizes that we are no longer living in 1960. But his biggest beef is that people think Coates is a like a religious type figure that cannot or should not be criticized. McWhorter is pleased to see that people are starting to treat Coates as a person and people are being critical of some of Coates ideas.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

A thread in the long tradition of empty barrels making the most noise

 

[jeffk]

A thread in the long tradition of empty barrels making the most noise

What does that mean?

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

What does that mean?

It's a reference to an educated conservative who tried to shut down a speaker and lacks the integrity to walk it back even though he was VERY WRONG

 

[Fawlty]

I think what's actually true is that educated liberals find themselves beset on both sides by different forms of intellectual terrorism. On one side, there is a very small but highly publicized amount of it coming from a few loudmouthed, privileged college kids. On the other, there is a tidal wave of it coming from a substantial portion of the right, who, braying beyond the donkeys, super-politicize the fight over these speakers, tacitly threatening that they will become racists unless the educated left submits, variously, to their national identity, or religion, or bad policies.

 

[jeffk]

I think what's actually true is that educated liberals find themselves beset on both sides by different forms of intellectual terrorism. On one side, there is a very small but highly publicized amount of it coming from a few loudmouthed, privileged college kids. On the other, there is a tidal wave of it coming from a substantial portion of the right, who, braying beyond the donkeys, super-politicize the fight over these speakers, tacitly threatening that they will become racists unless the educated left submits, variously, to their national identity, or religion, or bad policies.

The right is trying to make free speech a partisan issue. The left are too willing to go along. It is terrible strategy for the left. No reason to act like stupid asses and disrupt talks at a college when a right winger speakers speaks. Protest outside and point out the obvious flaws in their right wing ideology. Guys like Milo have made a career out of trolling the far left. He really has nothing original to say that is noteworthy.

 

[Fawlty]

The right is trying to make free speech a partisan issue. The left are too willing to go along. It is terrible strategy for the left. No reason to act like stupid asses and disrupt talks at a college when a right winger speakers speaks. Protest outside and point out the obvious flaws in their right wing ideology. Guys like Milo have made a career out of trolling the far left. He really has nothing original to say that is noteworthy.

Most people agree about college campuses. As far as I know, every single person in this forum agrees on that. There isn't consensus like that on anything else. It's not even close to as big a deal as it's being made out to be. It's more useful to ask why (how, actually) an issue of this low level of importance is blown up to such huge significance.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

For every asswad lib there is a asswad conservative. Problem we have is the double standard both parties seem to have. Giving their own party a pass on the same shit they bitch about the other side doing.

There's a lot of truth to this, but this particular issue is much worse on the lib side. Recently a bunch of righties shouted down some lib speaker and National Review spoke out against their action.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Most people agree about college campuses. As far as I know, every single person in this forum agrees on that. There isn't consensus like that on anything else. It's not even close to as big a deal as it's being made out to be. It's more useful to ask why (how, actually) an issue of this low level of importance is blown up to such huge significance.

The lack of freedom of speech on our universities, from a majority of students thinking the First Amendment doesn't protect hate speech, to speech codes, to the constant use of the heckler's veto are a big deal. We need an open exchange of ideas at our universities. I suspect lefties aren't bothered because it is mainly conservative voices being silenced right now.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

I think what's actually true is that educated liberals find themselves beset on both sides by different forms of intellectual terrorism. On one side, there is a very small but highly publicized amount of it coming from a few loudmouthed, privileged college kids. On the other, there is a tidal wave of it coming from a substantial portion of the right, who, braying beyond the donkeys, super-politicize the fight over these speakers, tacitly threatening that they will become racists unless the educated left submits, variously, to their national identity, or religion, or bad policies.

Lol. Complaining about being silenced isn't intellectual terrorism. Failure to discern the difference between reasonable right wing complaints against the far left and the reprehensible actions of the far left is a major fault of educated liberals.

 

[Fawlty]

The lack of freedom of speech on our universities, from a majority of students thinking the First Amendment doesn't protect hate speech, to speech codes, to the constant use of the heckler's veto are a big deal. We need an open exchange of ideas at our universities. I suspect lefties aren't bothered because it is mainly conservative voices being silenced right now.

The problem is turbo-dramatically overstated as an issue in our country. I love how all of a sudden the right cares deeply about academic discourse. Fucking phonies across the board. Sorry, not buying this oh-so-sincere appeal to the sanctity of our universities.

 

[Scheme]

For every asswad lib there is a asswad conservative. Problem we have is the double standard both parties seem to have. Giving their own party a pass on the same shit they bitch about the other side doing.

Conservatives are way more likely to criticize their own party than liberals.

Just look at the media. One station is primarily for conservatives, while the rest are mainly for liberals. For 8 years we rarely heard any criticism of Obama, except for Fox which had like 75% negative coverage of Obama.

Now look at Trump. The only major conservative outlet has a 50% positive coverage of Trump, while the rest have something like 95% negative.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

The problem is turbo-dramatically overstated as an issue in our country. I love how all of a sudden the right cares deeply about academic discourse.

The suppression of speech is not overstated as an issue. Liberals think it is overstated because they are not the ones being silenced.

Fucking phonies across the board. Sorry, not buying this oh-so-sincere appeal to the sanctity of our universities.

I think the health of our universities is important to the health of our society. There's nothing phony about it.

I think those attempting to minimize rather than address and fix the problem are being politically opportunistic. It's working for them, so why address it?

 

[Fawlty]

The suppression of speech is not overstated as an issue. Liberals think it is overstated because they are not the ones being silenced.



I think the health of our universities is important to the health of our society. There's nothing phony about it.

I think those attempting to minimize rather than address and fix the problem are being politically opportunistic. It's working for them, so why address it?

Opportunistic? An opportunity to what?