Experienced Reality based combateer V Pro MMA fighter on the street

[babycart]

Didn't we have Krav Maga, combatives etc. guys in early MMA years when almost everything was legal? How did they do? One example:

https://www.tapology.com/fightcenter/fighters/moti-horenstein

In the end it's all about the practitioner, not the art. A shitty MMA guy would lose to a great Krav Maga guy.

The scenario was everything was the same except for the manner they trained in. Basically a guy splitting himself into two clones and going to learn from different styles. Of course it's going to be about the art. Or basically, what the art exposes you to.

 

[Dessyboy]

Marines undergo a certain amount of unarmed combat training but wouldn't be maintaining or using those skills that much during their military career

Even when deployed in combat, and just isolating enemy engagements, it would be something like 99 percent weapons engagement and if your lucky, 1 percent hand to hand engagement

the attributes developed through round after round of hard sparring really is everything. Distancing, timing, power generation, defence reflex is all developed through sparring

If you can land a jab or a pro fighter, you can land a finger jab or most people on the street

I

 

[William Huggins]

@William Huggins lives on Sherdog

Spoiler

as do I

Just Bang........

 

[whougonnacall]

The scenario was everything was the same except for the manner they trained in. Basically a guy splitting himself into two clones and going to learn from different styles. Of course it's going to be about the art. Or basically, what the art exposes you to.

Wouldnt his ability to split himself into clones be the ultimate martial art anyway

 

[zapataxiv]

Wouldnt his ability to split himself into clones be the ultimate martial art anyway

yes but turtle hermit style would trump that in any sort of tournament format (barring any unforeseen vans..)
please if anybody gets the reference don't explain it... i am so embarrassed already..

 

[shincheckin]

Erran Morad ftw!

 

[rmongler]

'Reality based combat' = the subtle art of fighting with bar stools, cinderblocks, and cricket bats.

 

[Tayski]

Truth be told I'm not really convinced that experienced veterans will beat an MMA fighter in a hand to hand fight. I knew a guy who was a royal marine and he himself admitted if he was ever in an MMA gym or BJJ gym, he got handled - and those were casuals. I think the level of hand to hand combat in the military is greatly over exaggerated. So I don't have much faith in 'reality based' martial arts.

Well it's like everything, the more things you have to learn and master the least you're an expert at all of them - especially if it's not as relevant as other things.

So of course when someone from the military also has to master weapons and not just shooting with them but also reloading them, taking them apart, cleaning them, putting them back together, as well as all the other military stuff like reading maps, tactical stuff and so on, the time spent on hand to hand combat is pretty limited - especially considering that most of the time all the fighting is done with long range weapons like guns and explosives.

 

[ironkhan57]

Well it's like everything, the more things you have to learn and master the least you're an expert at all of them - especially if it's not as relevant as other things.

So of course when someone from the military also has to master weapons and not just shooting with them but also reloading them, taking them apart, cleaning them, putting them back together, as well as all the other military stuff like reading maps, tactical stuff and so on, the time spent on hand to hand combat is pretty limited - especially considering that most of the time all the fighting is done with long range weapons like guns and explosives.

Just curious because some soldiers still compete in boxing while their in the military, do you think the ones that are really good at boxing can beat a let's say mid tier pro fighter?

 

[Tayski]

Just curious because some soldiers still compete in boxing while their in the military, do you think the ones that are really good at boxing can beat a let's say mid tier pro fighter?

They're amateur level not pro level, so it depends on the individual. But it's only a select few, not the majority of the soldiers.

 

[ironkhan57]

They're amateur level not pro level, so it depends on the individual. But it's only a select few, not the majority of the soldiers.

Oh ok. But what if the soldier was deathstroke.

 

[fighthug]

In Brazil there is a personal defense called Kombato that is much more efficient than Krav Maga

 

[fighthug]

But an MMA fighter as he has fought for 10 years must have gone through many situations of fight in training and in competitions. It should be the best.

There is a site like DATISHUAI (@datishuai) that fights many fights of MMa fighters in the street and if given well.

 

[Tayski]

In Brazil there is a personal defense called Kombato that is much more efficient than Krav Maga

How is it more efficient than Krav Maga exactly?

 

[RightToBareKnuckles]

good question. all sorts of self defense systems claim to be more efficient/brutal/devastating than the other...as if everyone else is practicing safe/gentle techniques

and because it's friday afternoon and i'm bored, this:

 

[FightGuyOpenMind]

I bet a state trooper can beat a marine in a fight, aparently in new jersey I don't know about everywhere else, state troopers are suppose to have a number a fights in boxing and mma before completing state trooper academy (that is according to a 54 year old co worker of mine who boxed with state troopers back in the day and said they needed to have some fights under their belts.

It all depends on the person. Marines fight each other all the time, whether it's for training purposes or otherwise. I've known units to conduct "field days" where they took the entire unit out onto a marked location, and had call outs for boxing, and grappling. No weight classes, just call the guy out. That's not including the barracks brawls, or fights out in town that happen almost every weekend you're there for 4 years or until your enlistment is up.

 

[FightGuyOpenMind]

Marines undergo a certain amount of unarmed combat training but wouldn't be maintaining or using those skills that much during their military career

Even when deployed in combat, and just isolating enemy engagements, it would be something like 99 percent weapons engagement and if your lucky, 1 percent hand to hand engagement

the attributes developed through round after round of hard sparring really is everything. Distancing, timing, power generation, defence reflex is all developed through sparring

If you can land a jab or a pro fighter, you can land a finger jab or most people on the street

I

That is true. The number of unarmed combat deaths in Afghanistan was next to nil the last I saw statistics on it. Marines practice hand to hand combat. Many of them are young men filled with testosterone, and ego. Of course they're going to fight. It's the nature of the beast. They train it at a basic level, and to varying degrees beyond that depending on the unit, and personalities of the troops.

Some come in as boxers, and mma fighters, and bjj purple belts or insert whatever other discipline you can think of. I've seen Marines fight in the desert with body armor on during their downtime for "training". However, they're not trying to be professional mma fighters based on needs of the USMC.

They want to build camaraderie, fighter spirit, and aggressiveness in their troops. However, if you show up to the desert, and you don't know how to properly employ your rifle you're SOL. If you go to the desert thinking it's the Octagon you're SOL. M4s, 240s, 203s, AKs, PKMs don't care about how good your left hook, side kick, or arm bar is.

 

[FightGuyOpenMind]

Has the reality based guy ever killed anyone unarmed for his line of work? The human body is a lot more fragile than people think it is. I've been everything from had my sack squeezed, to bit, to have my fingers yanked back using sound grappling techniques.

If I'm not mistaken small joint manipulation is illegal in most sporting events to include bjj, and mma. It can change the dynamic of a fight no matter how dogmatic people can be in saying that it does not. Not saying these moves can't be overcome, but if a guy has experiencing killing people with his bare hands (think mercenary, hitman----they do exist) then I would need more information to determine who I'm putting my money on in that context.

 

[ironkhan57]

It all depends on the person. Marines fight each other all the time, whether it's for training purposes or otherwise. I've known units to conduct "field days" where they took the entire unit out onto a marked location, and had call outs for boxing, and grappling. No weight classes, just call the guy out. That's not including the barracks brawls, or fights out in town that happen almost every weekend you're there for 4 years or until your enlistment is up.

That's the shit that makes me want to join the military so bad. Do other military branches do that too?

 

[FightGuyOpenMind]

That's the shit that makes me want to join the military so bad. Do other military branches do that too?

Lol. I can't speak for them. I'm pretty sure each branch experiences similar things to varying degrees. With the Marines, and probably the Army as well it is embedded into the culture (can't speak for the Army). It was just normal I guess.

When you'd have accountability formation the Monday following the weekend, First Sergeant would go around doing his inspection of the troops. Seeing if your uniform was squared away, haircuts, ID left breast pocket, dog tags that sort of thing.

He'd come across the guy with the black eye and ask "what happened to your face?"....."I was drunk and fell down the stairs in the barracks First Sergeant."...…"You fell huh? oh ok."...….fighting was not lawfully encouraged, but I guess permissible as long as property wasn't destroyed, and no one was hospitalized. If that happens then your CO has to see the General, and explain to them what happened (it gets political at that point).

Marines build a lot of camaraderie, and prove themselves to one another in training, and otherwise. That's what I like about them, largely they judge you based on who you prove yourself to be...…..not what society says you are. If you want to join the military, and have solid reasons for doing so good luck to you.

I have respect for all branches of service.