How do you figure Im confusing the 2? . Certainly Im aware that there is more to Bjj than subs but subs are also (obviously) a huge part of it. Are you suggesting that Aoki subbing guys is not a display of bjj? Aoki has been a bjj black belt for many many years and aside from all of his many high level submission wins over very good opponents, he has completely out-grappled guys like Shaolin Ribeiro, Marcus Aurelio, Satoru Kitaoka, JZ, etc.
Marcus Jones. He has ridiculous long and obviously very strong legs. I remember he armored the shit out of that Frank Trigg lookalike guy.
I think Jacare deserves a nod somewhere on there. I think he's had a pretty underrated career in terms of what he did with BJJ in MMA despite not getting a title shot in the UFC.
mhm log legs or not though just goes to show he was a blue belt u dont see blue belts in other weight classes below 205 close guard armbar guys right off the bat in ufc tbh today its even hard for amateur fighters today to catch armbars
He was the top bjj guy in the ufc though in the early days just by default that he was basically the only one.
Ya know, I can't argue w that. And I did think of him. But Jacare's MMA career has always seemed like a bit of an oddity to me. Back in the day when MMA really started picking up momentum with the TUF/Zuffa boom (about 2005-07), we all knew who Jacare was bc of his incredible grappling accomplishments and bc he was already dabbling in MMA. He was always regarded as a sort of what if. He didn't really make it to the high level MMA scene until 2008-09 or so and by then a few other top bjjers from his era of bjj/sub grappling had already kind solidified themselves as the top bjj/sub grappling flag-flyers in top level MMA. And then it took him a while to really solidify himself as a tippy top level MMA fighter. Maybe that's just the way I experienced his career but I feel Maia and Werdum out-shined him a bit.
I agree and I sort of think he got fucked over just a little bit. My recall isn't top shelf so I can't pinpoint the moment but I think there were a couple moments where they could have given him a push but didn't. I think he fought a few more fights than he should have had to fight. I know the fight game isn't fair though. If he spoke English and had the same skill set I think he would've either had a title shot or been given an easier 'contender' fight along the way.
Yes absolutely. Usually when a rising prospect with a big-time background in another combat sport is climbing the ranks, a win over an established, respected vet is what puts them over. Jacare should had this after the 1st Mayhem fight or the Joey Vilasenior win. It didn't exactly work out. I also think fighting in Japan post-PRIDE was a mistake for any fighter with aspirations of UFC gold. This wasn't as obvious back then and with hindsight always being 20/20 I can't blame him too much for signing with Dream, but Jacare probably wouldve been better off signing with early Strikeforce, EliteXC, WEC, or even the IFL if he couldn't get into the UFC back then. To your other point, it is a shame that a highly aggressive, well-rounded, finisher didn't receive a bigger push earlier on.
Yes there is much more to bjj than just subs but my point is, submissions are just as much a part of bjj as ground control. Aoki is a submission based finisher, Maia tends to control guys on the ground, you can't tell me Maia is the better proponent of bjj. Just like you can't say a great top control guy is a better proponent of wrestling than a great takedown artist bc there is so much more to wrestling than just takedowns.
