How much did all the embarrassing K-1 losses to "amateurs" hurt the sport...

[Da Killa]

With Conor Mayweather coming up, I'm thinking it would hurt Boxing's reputation badly if Conor wins... then I got to think, how much did the long list of embarrassing loses in K-1 hurt kickboxing?

Goodridge KO Mike Bernardo!
Rampage beat Abidi x2!
Bob Sapp KO Hoost x2!
Hong Man Choi beat Semmy Schilt!
Gergard beat Musashi!
Overeem KO Badr Hari!
Remy Bonjansky had some decisions go his way in fights you could say he lost to Botha and that big WWE dude...

Really, the list of embarrassments is pretty long.

 

[Snubnoze707]

The only thing that hurt K-1 was corrupt businessmen. Those fights had pretty much zero impact on the demise of FEG ran K-1. You're also exaggerating the situation and ignoring details about those fights ex: Sapp clearly breaking the rules and being allowed to by the referee...

 

[Mafanofe]

bad mmaish thead coming up here again,so lets just fix up things with truths

-Goodridge KOed Mike Bernanrdo and Mike bernardo also KOed him,a long list of kickboxers made it to him in the first round like JLB(twice) ,Sefo,Feitosa,Mighty mo...


-Defeating Aibidi dont mean shit,his career is basically two good nights,one where he KOed Aerts and other when he TKOed Aerts and Sefo in the same night,and after this he got beatdown by pretty much everyone...After the Rampage fight he was KOed twice in the first round against Sefo and to a journeyman like Andrew thomson who could also do the same with no problem,so really overrated achievement,considering a guy who had two big nights as a fucking machine and taking out the fact he had kicked in the ass for the most part of his career,especially after his big wins.

-Sapp Beated Hoost twice,and it was like biggest upset suffered by the sport by far,but have to consider that he was a roided monster tha broke the rules in the two fights,so could be the only legit embarrasing moment that you wrote,but consider that after this fight he pretty much got fucked up by everyone,bring bob sapp also who gave big nog one of the hardest wins of his career...

-Hong Man Choi got a highly controversial hometown decision against Schilt,fight was shit and schilt performed bad,and you have to consider that HMC was a fucking giant and you cant take him down or submit him in a kickboxing fight,he is like a standed wall,dont give a shit if he is a horrible kickboxer,because being of his size he automatically becomes a tough opponent to beat under this rules...

-Mousasi beat Musashi?,lol who gives a fuck about Musashi?

a guy that more than a half of his best wins are totally robbery,i used to like him as a kickboxer in his early days,but when he came to fight Mousasi he was pretty much done as a kickboxer,it was the fight who made him consider retire,what he made one fight after that with his loss to JLB,Mousasi also haves a very good standup because he was always close with kickboxing with good background,so another overrated and delusional point.

-Overeem was also a guy who raised in a famous kickboxing gym,with a big background on kickboxing also,he KOed Badr and Got Koed against badr also,so another no point here

Bonjasky Wins over Botha were legit...



talking about Embarrasing,A pro wrestler was MMA champion of the biggest organization,defending the title twice and KOing two former champions and Hall of famer names and Subbing another hall of fame member,what about it?

"ooh,but he was a roided monster"

-yeah,Bob sapp the same...




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[GloryOfIran]

Try that at welterweight or lower. No dive.

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

bad mmaish thead coming up here again,so lets just fix up things with truths

talking about Embarrasing,A pro wrestler was MMA champion of the biggest organization,defending the title twice and KOing two former champions and Hall of famer names and Subbing another hall of fame member,what about it?

"ooh,but he was a roided monster"

-yeah,Bob sapp the same...




----------------------------------------------------

This is totally disingenuous.

Bob Sapp was an NFL wash out with next to no stand up background that I know of. Brock Lesnar was a two time NCAA Div 1 Finalist and one time NCAA champion in American scholastic wrestling, which is obviously an excellent base for MMA, who just happened to have been a pro wrestler. Worlds of difference.

And gtfo with Shane Carwin being a hall of fame member.

 

[AbeRudder]

I doubt the japanese cared that much... Sapp/Hoost x2 was the worst of those, the others weren't that bad. Sapp was a 350lb roided out monster so it kind of makes sense, he was very close to beating the pride heavyweight champ nogueira too.

 

[Karaev fan]

The UFC does such a great job with its structured and infrequent matchmaking that it cultivates an aura of mystique around its fighters. Fans start believing that as professional competitors, a guy who's unranked should stand no chance against real contenders.

In reality (especially at heavyweight) its just guys throwing limbs at other guys. Everyone is bound by the laws of physics and anything can happen. You know, like the greatest UFC heavyweight champion of all time getting KO'd in 9 seconds by a washed up boxer making his MMA debut.

 

[Bluesbreaker]

The nature of kickboxing, the fact that of those mentioned are huge men and some of those fights have asterisks next to them.

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

You know, like the greatest UFC heavyweight champion of all time getting KO'd in 9 seconds by a washed up boxer making his MMA debut.

Tim Sylvia is not the greatest UFC heavyweight champion of all time.

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

The UFC does such a great job with its structured and infrequent matchmaking that it cultivates an aura of mystique around its fighters. Fans start believing that as professional competitors, a guy who's unranked should stand no chance against real contenders.

How is this a UFC thing? Pretty much any combat sport with any amount of depth of talent and respect for sporting process will make their fighters work their way up the ranks gradually.

And it's actually quite rational to believe that an unranked fighter will not be able to beat a real contender, at least if the sport they are competing in has any depth. Seeing as how the vast majority of unranked fighters never do become contenders. And it's especially rational to believe that an unranked fighter will get stomped, if they're a totally unknown commodity who's thrust into fighting a contender while having no prior fights against intermediate competition in between.

 

[axion]

Defeating Aibidi dont mean shit -
he KOed Aerts and TKOed Aerts and Sefo in the same night

Doesn't mean shit, except that he KO'd Aerts, a 3 time K-1 World Champion, twice in a row! And then Sefo on the same night. Haha, I would have included Abidi in the OP.

-Mousasi beat Musashi?,lol who gives a fuck about Musashi?

A MW picks apart and KO's a HW K-1 fighter and it doesn't mean shit? lol

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

In reality (especially at heavyweight) its just guys throwing limbs at other guys. Everyone is bound by the laws of physics and anything can happen. You know, like the greatest UFC heavyweight champion of all time getting KO'd in 9 seconds by a washed up boxer making his MMA debut.

By this line of thinking I should take seriously all the UFC fighters who have claimed to fancy their odds against Floyd Mayweather or boxing's heavyweight champion of the moment? Get real. These sort of "anything can happen" scenarios matter in kickboxing, and to a lesser extent in MMA, because those sports have lousy talents pools and therefore lousy champions.

 

[Karaev fan]

How is this a UFC thing? Pretty much any combat sport with any amount of depth of talent and respect for sporting process will make their fighters work their way up the ranks gradually.

And it's actually quite rational to believe that an unranked fighter will not be able to beat a real contender, at least if the sport they are competing in has any depth. Seeing as how the vast majority of unranked fighters never do become contenders. And it's especially rational to believe that an unranked fighter will get stomped, if they're a totally unknown commodity who's thrust into fighting a contender while having no prior fights against intermediate competition in between.

This is true especially if you're looking at boxing or muay thai where people are fighting all the time and the creme does rise to the top. I think people buy too much into the UFC's rankings when people fight infrequently and even their top fighters might have less than 20 fights. Remember everyone proclaiming Machida or Chris Weidman or who have you as being destined to be the greatest of all time when they had less than 20 fights each. Or people saying it was Bisping had no chance against Rockhold.

By this line of thinking I should take seriously all the UFC fighters who have claimed to fancy their odds against Floyd Mayweather or boxing's heavyweight champion of the moment? Get real. These sort of "anything can happen" scenarios matter in kickboxing, and to a lesser extent in MMA, because those sports have lousy talents pools and therefore lousy champions.

Agreed.

 

[Mafanofe]

Doesn't mean shit, except that he KO'd Aerts, a 3 time K-1 World Champion, twice in a row! And then Sefo on the same night. Haha, I would have included Abidi in the OP.



A MW picks apart and KO's a HW K-1 fighter and it doesn't mean shit? lol

look Aibidi career after that,he got beated up by everyone,and he was a kickboxer and not any other thing

MW with huge kickboxing background training picking a washed up small HW guy on the literally his Penultimate fight of his career and had his career marked by being a mid-low lvl crusher and getting gift decisions in almost all his big fights means no shit

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

This is true especially if you're looking at boxing or muay thai where people are fighting all the time and the creme does rise to the top. I think people buy too much into the UFC's rankings when people fight infrequently and even their top fighters might have less than 20 fights. Remember everyone proclaiming Machida or Chris Weidman or who have you as being destined to be the greatest of all time when they had less than 20 fights each? Or people saying it was Bisping had no chance against Rockhold.

The UFC's fighters are over hyped because the UFC over hypes them and their fan base is totally uncritical. And the sport had no history, so maybe people just assumed that those guys would reign forever because, that's what Aldo, GSP and Silva had done and they looked the part coming up. Typical fallacious reasoning.

Or people saying it was Bisping had no chance against Rockhold.

Well, the Bisping fight wasn't a case of an unranked and totally unknown guy beating an actual contender. Bisping would have been a top 10 ranked guy and a veteran, who always fell short against the elite, so he was not an unknown commodity and he had gotten stomped by Rockhold before. So, I would view that result as more legitimately surprising than Mousasi beating Kyotaro or whatever.

 

[Mafanofe]

This is totally disingenuous.

Bob Sapp was an NFL wash out with next to no stand up background that I know of. Brock Lesnar was a two time NCAA Div 1 Finalist and one time NCAA champion in American scholastic wrestling, which is obviously an excellent base for MMA, who just happened to have been a pro wrestler. Worlds of difference.

And gtfo with Shane Carwin being a hall of fame member.

so watch the Randy Couture fight,It was a fact that Lesnar would dominate in the wrestling and GNP section,but he made it also on standup,and the fact that Couture was FAR from being a noob on the game,he was NCAA all american 3 consecutive times champ

Lesnar wobbled him twice on the standup with an right elbow and a right high knee,also dropped him with punches

 

[jtwarwagon4life]

so watch the Randy Couture fight,It was a fact that Lesnar would dominate in the wrestling and GNP section,but he made it also on standup,and the fact that Couture was FAR from being a noob on the game,he was NCAA all american 3 consecutive times champ

Lesnar wobbled him twice on the standup with an right elbow and a right high knee,also dropped him with punches

I don't see what your point is.

There is clearly no comparison to be made between the respective backgrounds of Brock Lesnar and Bob Sapp.

 

[Mafanofe]

I don't see what your point is.

There is clearly no comparison to be made between the respective backgrounds of Brock Lesnar and Bob Sapp.

except for the fact that both were two big roided gorillas,but Sapp was two inches taller and 40 lbs heavier,who breaked the rules in both hoost fights

Lesnar had a good Wrestling background,but the fact that he outstriked Couture having no stand up experience and ground and pounded with ease a BJJ black belt(mir) and choked a BJJ purble belt with good wrestling background(carwin) is also not a good look,this is my point

 

[axion]

look Aibidi career after that,he got beated up by everyone,and he was a kickboxer and not any other thing

MW with huge kickboxing background training picking a washed up small HW guy on the literally his Penultimate fight of his career and had his career marked by being a mid-low lvl crusher and getting gift decisions in almost all his big fights means no shit

So much reaching, you K-1 die hards are hilarious.

If Abidi was so awful, how did he beat Aerts twice? Finishing him both times? And Sefo on the same night? It's luck when you say so? Oh I just noticed you're in Bazil, so yeah, I guess you've got the Big Brazilian Book of Excuses cracked open.

He was always dubbed a street brawler.

If you're going to discredit Abidi by pointing out his losses, why don't you discredit Sapp by pointing out his? Ridiculous.

 

[Mafanofe]

So much reaching, you K-1 die hards are hilarious.

If Abidi was so awful, how did he beat Aerts twice? Finishing him both times? And Sefo on the same night? It's luck when you say so? Oh I just noticed you're in Bazil, so yeah, I guess you've got the Big Brazilian Book of Excuses cracked open.

He was always dubbed a street brawler.

die hard fan?

its not me who is crossing over the forum defend shitty threads on a part of the forum you dont even post

i never said it was luck,it do not exist in combat sports,fighters capitalize in other fighters errors and this is how you win

i never said he was awful,he was just hardly overrated,why?

afther his big wins on a short period of time,he got KFTO by a lot of people(Filho,Sefo,Thompson,Rampage,Ignashov,Bonjasky,Goodridge,JLB),this is not how a high level fighter career haves to be,and notice how Jackson fight happened when his tower fall decline started...

What is the problem on Being Brazilian?

i dont even watch mma and i dont care about nationality of fighters,i only see sportsman and not flags

grow up

why i would point out Sapp losses when the guy haves a negative record?

his record speak for itself