Is Ross Enamait the Holy Grail of Strength & Conditioning?

[Quadrivium]

https://www.facebook.com/KettlebellTrainingChelyabinsk/videos/957875847596913/ This fucking guy.

Yeah man, that's crazy. Watched that long cycle vid a while back and again just now... sounds like he's fuckin' dyin'!

I can't help but imagine these guys living many hundreds of years ago, chopping guys in half with swords n shit. Guys with a serious physical edge over most humans.

 

[JauntyAngle]

You mean- is he himself the paragon of physical excellence?

My answer to that is- I have absolutely no idea. Even if I knew who all the really good, well-rounded athletes were, what would be the criteria. He's obviously really impressive though.

 

[CJAdams]

His forum is great because he responds to people directly, but even his books are worth a read.

The forum used to be great but it has gone downhill in the last few years. Not many active members left and Ross hardly posts on there any more either. He hasn't posted on the forum for over a month.

 

[Sano]

His video is definitely very impressive in regards to strenght-power. Hard to say how well conditioned he is in the long distance sense. And no squats, but I'm sure his legs are incredibly strong as well.

I've heard many good things about Rosstraining, but I've never really seen any template or read that much about it. I really should, I find the subject of overall athleticism fascinating.

On that note, Max Shank seems to have the right idea as well


Some crossfitters are probably up there. The concept is good, but execution has been lacking. The top ones are very impressive though. Oh and yes gymnasts in most aspects.

Anyway, good thread. Anyone has other recommendations or suggestions? What about that Alex Viada? Was he a fraud?

 

[ripskater]

I'm pretty sure a lot of people could whip someone into shape.. but he's not really practicing what he's preaching..

Marinovich got BJ and his conditioning problems solved, and I saw what I saw for that fight with Deigo and Florian. Marinovich did some beautiful work. No other coach was able to do that for BJ. At least late in BJ's career.

 

[CJAdams]

And no squats, but I'm sure his legs are incredibly strong as well.

There is a picture of him squatting around 405lbs and he said he wasn't maxing out on it.

http://rosstraining.com/blog/2012/05/22/single-leg-training/

 

[Nuclearlandmine]

The thing about Crossfitters is that they train pretty much in tradition, barbell training and all that, with only a small amount of their training with crossfit WOD as preparation for their games. That pretty much goes in the face of Greg "i can get someone's deadlift from 500 to 700 just with crossfit alone" Glassman.

As far as Marv Marinovich are concerned, he benefit from his athletes never actually do any serious S&C training at all, so any type of training will stick (ie the novice effect). His school of S&C also thinks that Olympic lift are dangerous and a distinctive lack of weight training. At some point the progress will stop and they will stall. Same shits with crossfit.

 

[Dan O]

The thing about Crossfitters is that they train pretty much in tradition, barbell training and all that, with only a small amount of their training with crossfit WOD as preparation for their games.

This is incorrect. The majority of the successful ones use some form of periodization but I can assure you, they run what would be perceived as "a lot" of met-cons all the time with peaks and valleys just like any other training system.

And, nobody in the CF community really takes Glassman/Castro seriously, just fyi. They are way more important to non-CFers than those in it. Trust.


There was nothing in the video that I wouldn't expect my three best male CFers to be able to perform, or that I haven't seen them perform. The majority of what he does would be difficult to put a performance or competition metric on though.
And for reference those guys only rank in the top 100 of their region, which places them in the top 300 nationally, if we're lucky(we happen to be a competitive region).

The majority of what he does are just neat athletic tricks. Which is great. Dude's obviously an animal. Good for him.
But there is a reason competition exists. Otherwise you're just a you tube hero.

I'd love to see the dude go all in on CF. There's more and more money to be made doing it now. You're never going to be rich but the prize purses are growing. For an individual RX male at a local competition I've seen everything from 500-3k$. Then, you have larger regional invitationals that go above that.
And that's without even talking about the Games circuit and their sponsorships.

What I'm saying is, even if he wasn't the best, he could still put some coin in his pocket for training just as hard as he already is.


But to answer TS's question. No. Not at all.

 

[CJAdams]

This is incorrect. The majority of the successful ones use some form of periodization but I can assure you, they run what would be perceived as "a lot" of met-cons all the time with peaks and valleys just like any other training system.

And, nobody in the CF community really takes Glassman/Castro seriously, just fyi. They are way more important to non-CFers than those in it. Trust.


There was nothing in the video that I wouldn't expect my three best male CFers to be able to perform, or that I haven't seen them perform. The majority of what he does would be difficult to put a performance or competition metric on though.
And for reference those guys only rank in the top 100 of their region, which places them in the top 300 nationally, if we're lucky(we happen to be a competitive region).

The majority of what he does are just neat athletic tricks. Which is great. Dude's obviously an animal. Good for him.
But there is a reason competition exists. Otherwise you're just a you tube hero.

I'd love to see the dude go all in on CF. There's more and more money to be made doing it now. You're never going to be rich but the prize purses are growing. For an individual RX male at a local competition I've seen everything from 500-3k$. Then, you have larger regional invitationals that go above that.
And that's without even talking about the Games circuit and their sponsorships.

What I'm saying is, even if he wasn't the best, he could still put some coin in his pocket for training just as hard as he already is.


But to answer TS's question. No. Not at all.

I doubt he would have any interest in it. He is in his forties (might be late thirties) and has kids. He makes his money training other people and his own training takes a back seat.

 

[selfcritical]

This is incorrect. The majority of the successful ones use some form of periodization but I can assure you, they run what would be perceived as "a lot" of met-cons all the time with peaks and valleys just like any other training system.

And, nobody in the CF community really takes Glassman/Castro seriously, just fyi. They are way more important to non-CFers than those in it. Trust.


There was nothing in the video that I wouldn't expect my three best male CFers to be able to perform, or that I haven't seen them perform. The majority of what he does would be difficult to put a performance or competition metric on though.
And for reference those guys only rank in the top 100 of their region, which places them in the top 300 nationally, if we're lucky(we happen to be a competitive region).

The majority of what he does are just neat athletic tricks. Which is great. Dude's obviously an animal. Good for him.
But there is a reason competition exists. Otherwise you're just a you tube hero.

I'd love to see the dude go all in on CF. There's more and more money to be made doing it now. You're never going to be rich but the prize purses are growing. For an individual RX male at a local competition I've seen everything from 500-3k$. Then, you have larger regional invitationals that go above that.
And that's without even talking about the Games circuit and their sponsorships.

What I'm saying is, even if he wasn't the best, he could still put some coin in his pocket for training just as hard as he already is.


But to answer TS's question. No. Not at all.

Their approach will be different than someone just running mainpage plus. in a really good games competitor's training, WOD's are primarily skill-building, particularly learning how to pace. You should see significant accumulation of just plain ol cardio and strength volume, as well as just simple practice of olympic and gymnastic skills, but the specific skill of winning is pacing and recovery in mixed-modal WOD's, so if you don't practice the technical/tactical skills there, you're going to do dumb shit in competition.

 

[Dan O]

Their approach will be different than someone just running mainpage plus. in a really good games competitor's training, WOD's are primarily skill-building, particularly learning how to pace. You should see significant accumulation of just plain ol cardio and strength volume, as well as just simple practice of olympic and gymnastic skills, but the specific skill of winning is pacing and recovery in mixed-modal WOD's, so if you don't practice the technical/tactical skills there, you're going to do dumb shit in competition.

Source: I coach 30+ competitive Crossfitters who podium regularly at comps, run a CF gym with 200+ members, run CF events that host 800+ athletes, have spoken with numerous games and regional level athletes about their training, and currently train a CF Regional Medalist who holds a worldwide 1st place finish for a Regional workout(which means he beat every famous CF name you've ever heard). If you have a better first hand snap shot of successful competitive CF training, I'd love to hear about it.

 

[Fenderson]

Source: I coach 30+ competitive Crossfitters who podium regularly at comps, run a CF gym with 200+ members, run CF events that host 800+ athletes, have spoken with numerous games and regional level athletes about their training, and currently train a CF Regional Medalist who holds a worldwide 1st place finish for a Regional workout(which means he beat every famous CF name you've ever heard). If you have a better first hand snap shot of successful competitive CF training, I'd love to hear about it.

Well larr dee darr

 

[Dan O]

Well larr dee darr

Yeah that sounded incredibly dickish. My apologies.

I just didn't want a response citing some youtube video or magazine article/interview.

I ain't done shit, really.

 

[Eric Brown]

Their approach will be different than someone just running mainpage plus. in a really good games competitor's training, WOD's are primarily skill-building, particularly learning how to pace. You should see significant accumulation of just plain ol cardio and strength volume, as well as just simple practice of olympic and gymnastic skills, but the specific skill of winning is pacing and recovery in mixed-modal WOD's, so if you don't practice the technical/tactical skills there, you're going to do dumb shit in competition.

Isn't doing dumb shit in competition the nature of crossfit?

 

[JRT6]

Ross used to be a lot more popular around here and even posted a few times but then Joel Jamison came on the scene and everything changed. the conditioning field is a lot more crowded now.

 

[Nuclearlandmine]

This is incorrect. The majority of the successful ones use some form of periodization but I can assure you, they run what would be perceived as "a lot" of met-cons all the time with peaks and valleys just like any other training system.

And, nobody in the CF community really takes Glassman/Castro seriously, just fyi. They are way more important to non-CFers than those in it. Trust.


There was nothing in the video that I wouldn't expect my three best male CFers to be able to perform, or that I haven't seen them perform. The majority of what he does would be difficult to put a performance or competition metric on though.
And for reference those guys only rank in the top 100 of their region, which places them in the top 300 nationally, if we're lucky(we happen to be a competitive region).

The majority of what he does are just neat athletic tricks. Which is great. Dude's obviously an animal. Good for him.
But there is a reason competition exists. Otherwise you're just a you tube hero.

I'd love to see the dude go all in on CF. There's more and more money to be made doing it now. You're never going to be rich but the prize purses are growing. For an individual RX male at a local competition I've seen everything from 500-3k$. Then, you have larger regional invitationals that go above that.
And that's without even talking about the Games circuit and their sponsorships.

What I'm saying is, even if he wasn't the best, he could still put some coin in his pocket for training just as hard as he already is.


But to answer TS's question. No. Not at all.

If they are still peaking and using smart periodization, then they aren't really training crossfit anymore, are they? I'm fairly interested in how top crossfitters train though, given the amounts of skills they need to learn. I'd wager a lot of them already had major background in strength/gymnastics/whatever to help them transition into crossfit.

I will say though, crossfit is like MMA of the fitness world, only a lot more messier than it should have be. As someone who is focus on strength training, while i like what some of their athletes do in games, the rest leaves me speechless. Like 50 box jumps (great way to rupture your hamstring) or 50 clean and jerk, kipping pullup and whatever madness Greg Glassman and Dave "I can't pull 405" Castro came up with.

 

[selfcritical]

Source: I coach 30+ competitive Crossfitters who podium regularly at comps, run a CF gym with 200+ members, run CF events that host 800+ athletes, have spoken with numerous games and regional level athletes about their training, and currently train a CF Regional Medalist who holds a worldwide 1st place finish for a Regional workout(which means he beat every famous CF name you've ever heard). If you have a better first hand snap shot of successful competitive CF training, I'd love to hear about it.

Nothing that hard and fast, just having friends at a fairly good crossfit gym in Austin and making a point to learn about competitors lately instead of just shitting on the sport. I'd noticed recently in interviews that Chad Smith, Alex Viada and Rich Froning had all made a point of "just train strength all the time" wasn't really a viable strategy because of the specificity of actually learning how to pace during a WOD and working on the technical skills that come up often. I definitely don't coach though, and wouldn't advise anyone to get me to critique a template specifically for the games (which is a problem, because I might be crosstraining some people for KB sport soon who also do crossfit, and not fucking up their ability to do well in their own competitions is kind of a priority for me)

 

[Grappleboxing]

Probably one of the best conditioned and strengthened guys out there. However, there probably are guys out there better than him at everything.

The thing that separates him from everyone else is the fact he is just a nice guy and so honest in a field of salesmen.

He practices what he preaches, responds to book/dvd order questions, and is just an overall honest guy from what I've seen.

 

[Sinister]

I'm pretty sure a lot of people could whip someone into shape.. but he's not really practicing what he's preaching..

Marinovich's days as an athlete are over. And he's ancient by athletic standards. But he was a Pro athlete, has trained probably a couple hundred viable Pro athletes, and his center runs to this day. He also has one of the best injury-rehabilitation programs in existence. Guys like he and Mackie Shilstone were innovators, scientific and thorough in an industry full of voodoo and Bro-science. So there aren't youtube videos of him doing weird BW exercises, who cares?

If this thread is about who is best AT strength and conditioning-oriented exercises, that's nearly impossible to answer. But if this is about where to get the best information and get into the best shape, you don't discount a guy because he isn't walking everywhere on his hands or hanging sideways off of monkey-bars.

 

[selfcritical]

Fair enough, although if we're talking most successful trainer of all time, that's Anatoly Bondurchuk with a bullet.