Is the armdrag useless as a takedown in mma/self-defense?

[Bigboot]

Arm drag to RNC is actually very easy to pull off on someone who doesn’t have any experience with any real grappling or fighting.

Hand fighting like Jon Jones used to do is also great for self defense and highly underrated.

 

[georgegreece]

Arm drags are most common in 'pocket' range while hand fighting, which also happens to be face punching range, so you won't really see the same jockeying for grips in mma that you see in grappling, which includes arm drags. Same reason you don't really see 'wing chun' style hand trapping either (you'll occasionally see boxing style hand trapping). 'Infighting' in mma basically equilibriates into either, not infighting, or deep clinches (the cage makes an exception since it more or less acts as a 'third limb' in providing control, opening up the use of different techniques; kinda like ground fighting, but vertical).

If all parties involved are on guard and battle already joined arm drags have slim applicability. There is however, one application very suitable for arm drags outside of both the ring and the mat. That is, as a sneak attack.

Eight times out of ten the sucker punch wins the fight; immediate preemptive escalation to percussive persuasion as a first resort however, is something of an asymptotic proposition, that can carry some thorny logistical, psychological, and legal issues. A surprise arm drag to a go behind however, provides a pathway for a workman, officer, or john q. public, to put hands on someone and proactively defuse possible issues, without having to resort to a nuclear option.

You can apply the same principle with other methods as well:



A bicep tie normally is one of the least advantageous entanglements in grappling, in terms of both offensive and defensive options (not the least of which being you basically give the other guy an elbow tie); it is however something you can go 'directly' to, like the arm drag, not requiring the other person to be engaging with you at the same time, and against someone untrained or barely trained, the formal structure is less important than the substantial balancing.

Inside ties are also 'smothering'-



-in the sense that if the other guy wants to punch you or pull something out of his pocket he'll have to strip it first, and that pushback is what gives you the opening to go behind, where you want to be to control the individual with a full nelson or put him down with a mat return.

In many ways, you could see it as simply an extension of the 'fence' concept, of keeping the other person out of your personal space with arm extension and pushing, keeping them between you and them.

You can do the same with the 2 on 1, get to the side and block the opposite hand bicep, this prevents the opponent from striking you with the free hand. Then wrap your hands around the waist and perform a side suplex or trip. Similar to this but with opposite arms and then go for a yoko guruma:






What other secret moves do you have people?

 

[MaxMMA]

What about hitting the arm drag from over/under pummeling? Over/Under is a very common MMA position and there are lots of videos on you tube showing the arm drag from over /under. Just a thought. Would be interested in what the wrestlers here think.

I'm also really surprised you don't see this technique in MMA more, specifically from the over/under. Anytime someone fishes for an undertook from an over hook the arm drag is there. Shit if you're good enough you can hit the drag off of a deep undertook with a little bit of adjustment.

 

[SummerStriker]

I'm also really surprised you don't see this technique in MMA more, specifically from the over/under. Anytime someone fishes for an undertook from an over hook the arm drag is there. Shit if you're good enough you can hit the drag off of a deep undertook with a little bit of adjustment.

Yeah man

 

[MaxMMA]

This is an arm drag from two guys who are completely disengaged upper body, from a reach. The poster claimed dragging from a standing clinch was a good option. I cannot see any way that is even possible, and I have wrestled my entire life

You've never seen the armdrag from the over/underhook position?!?!?

 

[georgegreece]

 

[dudeguyman]

Is arm-drag, as a takedown (setup), and way of getting-the-back while standing, a flawed artifact of pure grappling that won't work in real fight or mma fight? When standing in a pure grappling match, people very often keep at least one arm down, to defend their legs against takedowns- this creates the opening to do the arm drag. In a real, or mma fight, people tend to keep their hands up to at least some degree. Rarely (never) in a fight, do you see someone hunched over with their arm in front of their lead leg to defend it, as is often the case in pure (especially no-gi) grappling.
   I imagine that you turn could turn your wrist over and grab the wrist of the arm you're going to drag with your thumb pointing down. This still ties up both of your hands, leaving your head momentarily undefended and his other arm free to punch you. Directly reaching between his arms and cupping his bicep/tricep to drag it would only take one arm, but he may be able to hit you with the arm you're trying to drag, as well as his other, free arm.
   Once my neck heals I plan on trying this in light mma sparring, but I wonder if it might just not be a good idea to do armdrags from standing when the other person can strike. Has anyone successfully used an alternate grip for the arm drag that worked when the opponent had his hands up, and while you had defend his punches?

Nice thread op. I'll be lurking in this one for dat knowledge.

 

[Badger67]

I'll use it occasionally when i have a guy pinned to the wall/cage. It's a bit safer there.

 

[rmongler]

I'm also really surprised you don't see this technique in MMA more, specifically from the over/under. Anytime someone fishes for an undertook from an over hook the arm drag is there. Shit if you're good enough you can hit the drag off of a deep undertook with a little bit of adjustment.

If you're trying to clinch up with someone in mma, 8 times out of ten, they're trying to not clinch up with you.
They're not going to oblige you by playing the dance of push-pull, they're putting the gear in reverse and hitting full throttle. In such cases, breaking your lock simply gives them opening they need to disengage, so in such cases, the great majority of of throws you see from the over under will in judo terms be 'backwards' throws where you are moving forward, like the step around/polish throw.

Para exemple:

 

[georgegreece]

If you're trying to clinch up with someone in mma, 8 times out of ten, they're trying to not clinch up with you.
They're not going to oblige you by playing the dance of push-pull, they're putting the gear in reverse and hitting full throttle. In such cases, breaking your lock simply gives them opening they need to disengage, so in such cases, the great majority of of throws you see from the over under will in judo terms be 'backwards' throws where you are moving forward, like the step around/polish throw.

Para exemple:

You can transition to this from the 2 on 1.