Is Tito a legend?

[Aegon Spengler]

Well losing to Frank Shamrock, Chuck, Couture doesn’t help his case but yeah he’s a legend in the sport.

 

[Voltron]

-The guy had the look and the charisma, he came out with the American and Mexican flag and I thought that was pretty cool back in the day.
-He did literally saved the ufc from the dark ages.
-He was an excellent fight promoter and new how to hype fights way before McNugget.
-First guy to actually invest his fighting money wisely (clothing companie,gym, etc)
-Probably the greatest ground and pown fighter ever.
He is a legend for sure in my eyes......not GOAT but a legend for sure

 

[Shamrockftw]

He was never even top 3 in his own weight class. Sorry, but that's a fact.

he was ranked #1 light heavyweight on the planet between 2000 and late 2001 and rightfully so.

 

[BoD 2.0]

he was ranked #1 light heavyweight on the planet between 2000 and late 2001 and rightfully so.

Right around the time Chuck Liddell was knocking everyone out and the UFC refused to put him agains the Golden Egghead Tito. Yeah, if you think Tito was the best in the world in 2001, you need to lay off the drugs.

 

[Shamrockftw]

Right around the time Chuck Liddell was knocking everyone out and the UFC refused to put him agains the Golden Egghead Tito. Yeah, if you think Tito was the best in the world in 2001, you need to lay off the drugs.

you said he was never even top 3 in his weightclass, Besides Chuck (debatable) who else was ahead of him in 2000-2001?

 

[Dbreiden83080]

A fighter fights

A duck ducks

Money don't make up for that.

People patting you on the back on websites and social media doesn’t pay the bills. Money does. Chuck used to fight for nickels and dimes. He should be thankful Tito came along. That wasn’t going to change.

 

[eiyuu]

People patting you on the back on websites and social media doesn’t pay the bills. Money does. Chuck used to fight for nickels and dimes. He should be thankful Tito came along. That wasn’t going to change.

Chuck going on the 1st season of TUF is what made him a millionaire.

Tito had nothing to do with that.

And personal attacks don't help your argument.

Facts, like I just posted do.

 

[BoD 2.0]

you said he was never even top 3 in his weightclass, Besides Chuck (debatable) who else was ahead of him in 2000-2001?

Ok fine. 2001 and prior he was maybe the 2nd best LHW. Randy hadn't moved down yet, Rampage was still coming up, he had beaten Wandy (although Wandy then went on to win 8 fights in 2000 and 2001 after the Tito fight), Shogun wasn't around yet, he ended up beating Vitor later on. So I'd say at that time, there's an argument he was the 2nd best LHW in the world for a little while.

 

[JoeRoganade]

I happen to think he did a lot for the UFC when it was in dire need of stars and was a torchbearer for the sport on the early days. Definitely a UFC Hall of Fame type guy.

But forget what I think, here’s what The Damn President thinks:


..also Tito never tapped to strikes so there’s that.

A legend no doubt.

 

[Dbreiden83080]

Chuck going on the 1st season of TUF is what made him a millionaire.

Tito had nothing to do with that.

And personal attacks don't help your argument.

Facts, like I just posted do.

Tito was the rival that he needed to get people interested in watching him fight. If you were watching the sport back then this is something you would be aware of. Tito holding out and coming back when he did created a big interest in him as a fighter. That rematch did over 1 million buys.. Look up Chucks numbers with every other fighter. Tell me what they are? Did you know when Tito fought Ken the first time it broke all the records at that time? Yep I have my facts. Tito was the first true superstar of the sport. He handle his career correctly because he made a lot more money than Dana was ever going to pay him. Dana was paying Chuck nickels and dimes. He offered Tito the same. Tito said no.

 

[blkdynamite]

I don’t think you know the difference between the Hendo that DC fought and the Hendo from Pride. Hendo still used his wrestling back then. He was much younger and effective. Tito was not slamming him lol. If anything, Hendo would do to Tito what Randy did.

And Tito was never close to the wrestler that DC is. The guy literally got spanked by Randy in the octagon.

Randy spanked Mark Coleman too. Im not sure Randy wouldnt have had something for DC either. Randy was that good bro.

 

[eiyuu]

Tito was the rival that he needed to get people interested in watching him fight. If you were watching the sport back then this is something you would be aware of. Tito holding out and coming back when he did created a big interest in him as a fighter. That rematch did over 1 million buys.. Look up Chucks numbers with every other fighter. Tell me what they are? Did you know when Tito fought Ken the first time it broke all the records at that time? Yep I have my facts. Tito was the first true superstar of the sport. He handle his career correctly because he made a lot more money than Dana was ever going to pay him. Dana was paying Chuck nickels and dimes. He offered Tito the same. Tito said no.

Yes, I know all that. Please don't question my history with the sport.

Tito vs Ken did around 100k. That was a lot considering how floundering the UFC was doing at the time.

How many PPVs did Liddell vs Tito I do? 105k

How many PPVs did Liddell vs Couture II do (their fight after TUF)? 280k

I stand by my statement about TUF helping Liddell more than Tito did.

Tito ducking Chuck is still BS and shouldn't have happened since it was all about Tito not wanting to lose his title to a guy HE KNEW he couldn't beat.

 

[Dbreiden83080]

Yes, I know all that. Please don't question my history with the sport.

Tito vs Ken did around 100k. That was a lot considering how floundering the UFC was doing at the time.

How many PPVs did Liddell vs Tito I do? 105k

How many PPVs did Liddell vs Couture II do (their fight after TUF)? 280k

I stand by my statement about TUF helping Liddell more than Tito did.

Tito ducking Chuck is still BS and shouldn't have happened since it was all about Tito not wanting to lose his title to a guy HE KNEW he couldn't beat.

Tito did not want to fight the toughest fight of his career for pennies on the dollar. Would you? And what were the numbers of the Chuck and rampage fight? 675 which is basically half of what he did with Tito. Half!!! If Tito does not hold out and hype that up for over one year it never sells like it did. Ever. He was a lot smarter than Dana ever gave him credit for.

 

[BoD 2.0]

Randy spanked Mark Coleman too. Im not sure Randy wouldnt have had something for DC either. Randy was that good bro.

Yeah, but Big Nog pretty much whooped randy on the ground. I doubt he'd have success with DC.

 

[eiyuu]

Tito did not want to fight the toughest fight of his career for pennies on the dollar. Would you? And what were the numbers of the Chuck and rampage fight? 675 which is basically half of what he did with Tito. Half!!! If Tito does not hold out and hype that up for over one year it never sells like it did. Ever. He was a lot smarter than Dana ever gave him credit for.

He held out because he didn't want to lose.

You and he are not going to get around that fact.

Sure it made him money, but still make him look cowardly.

But hey, money can buy happiness I suppose.

 

[tucan89]

Of course he's a legend in the sport, legend doesn't necessarily mean goat status tho.

 

[Aslan]

Tito ducking Chuck is still BS and shouldn't have happened since it was all about Tito not wanting to lose his title to a guy HE KNEW he couldn't beat.

I don’t disagree with this sentiment but it’s just like gsp quitting so he didn’t have to rematch Hendricks so as not to lose the belt. Or cherrypicking bisping and then quitting so as not to have to defend against the real monsters at 185 and yet people still consider gsp very favorably.

Tito was the guy the ufc needed in the early days and without him we probably don’t have the sport we have today.

 

[blkdynamite]

Yeah, but Big Nog pretty much whooped randy on the ground. I doubt he'd have success with DC.

Yes but Nog was a natural HWY whereas Randy was best at 205 lb. DC and Randy are simalarly decorated. I just think a prepared Randy would be no one's pushover. He would have a plan.

 

[blkdynamite]

Tito did not want to fight the toughest fight of his career for pennies on the dollar. Would you? And what were the numbers of the Chuck and rampage fight? 675 which is basically half of what he did with Tito. Half!!! If Tito does not hold out and hype that up for over one year it never sells like it did. Ever. He was a lot smarter than Dana ever gave him credit for.[/WHITE]
That is Dana's MO with every fighter who wants more money. Tito ducks Chuck but fights the guy who BEATS Chuck. Right. Tito wanted to get paid.

 

[eiyuu]

I don’t disagree with this sentiment but it’s just like gsp quitting so he didn’t have to rematch Hendricks so as not to lose the belt. Or cherrypicking bisping and then quitting so as not to have to defend against the real monsters at 185 and yet people still consider gsp very favorably.

Tito was the guy the ufc needed in the early days and without him we probably don’t have the sport we have today.

Difference is, GSP was already retired and then came back to fight Bisping. Was it a moneygrab for GSP? Yes, but it's not like GSP was still champ and refused to fight the next contender.

If GSP could be accused of ducking it would probably be more for not doing the Superfight with Anderson Silva back when they were at the height of their talents and popularity.

Ortiz on the other hand, was all set to fight Liddell back in the day. He even said so after Liddell beat Vitor Belfort ("Looks like Chuck and I are next! I just have to take care of some unfinished business with Ken Shamrock first.") Then he changed his tune after he beat Shamrock, claiming that their friendship was too important.

The reality is, he knew he couldn't beat Liddell since he owned Tito in training.

And if friendship was so important to Ortiz, why was he willing to fight Rampage Jackson while they were training together after Rampage got the UFC LHW title when Rampage was saying he didn't want to fight Tito since they were friends?

Ortiz is just so full of shit and himself.