Is USA the best country to live in?

[Squarechoke]

Cons with Sweden

* Lack of liberty

(The quote is strongly edited to just show the point I'm addressing, for an easier read)

That's not a good point in my view. Last year's freedom rankings based on adherence to the UN's Universal Declaration of Human rights Sweden was tied in first place together with Norway and Finland. The list was ranked with each place representing a score, and then showing the countries that achieved it, so there were 36 nations among the 10 highest scores and the US was not among them. Sweden also ranks higher than the US on the Human Freedom Index from last year.

I'd say that it makes little sense to make that a con for Sweden while not for the US.

 

[Son of Jamin]

(The quote is strongly edited to just show the point I'm addressing, for an easier read)

That's not a good point in my view. Last year's freedom rankings based on adherence to the UN's Universal Declaration of Human rights Sweden was tied in first place together with Norway and Finland. The list was ranked with each place representing a score, and then showing the countries that achieved it, so there were 36 nations among the 10 highest scores and the US was not among them. Sweden also ranks higher than the US on the Human Freedom Index from last year.

I'd say that it makes little sense to make that a con for Sweden while not for the US.

I was focusing on personal liberty, I've seen Sweden ranked 12th when it comes to personal liberty.
http://www.prosperity.com/globe/sweden

My arguments for why Sweden is far from a country with such a great personal liberty:

* Pravda (S)(V)T (State owned propaganda) that you are forced to pay for. Paying for poison.
* High marginal tax rate, makes people more dependent on the nanny state
* Laws against agitation against ethnic group (arbitrary and repressive of free speech, not to be confused with defamation or threats)
* Policing of drug use (the vast majority of drug related arrests are for personal usage)
* Gun laws (I'm a registered gun owner but they constantly want to make it tougher on us and other law abiding citizens to attain one)
* Freedom of movement, especially for women during dark hours
* Personal identity number - too easily discerned and too revealing
* Almost impossible for private citizen to sue newspapers for defamation and the trial is held behind closed doors.

Just to mention a few issues that I detest.

 

[Johnny Mac]

Middle America is the best place in the world to live! People are nice and hardworking. This is where I call home.

 

[King Joffery]

I dont have anything to measure it against. Id take America over germany though.. what little of it ive seen.

Germany get way more paid holidays though, not all bad. Before they let all the migrants in I wouldn't have minded living there.

 

[Squarechoke]

I was focusing on personal liberty, I've seen Sweden ranked 12th when it comes to personal liberty.
http://www.prosperity.com/globe/sweden

My arguments for why Sweden is far from a country with such a great personal liberty:

* Pravda (S)(V)T (State owned propaganda) that you are forced to pay for. Paying for poison.
* High marginal tax rate, makes people more dependent on the nanny state
* Laws against agitation against ethnic group (arbitrary and repressive of free speech, not to be confused with defamation or threats)
* Policing of drug use (the vast majority of drug related arrests are for personal usage)
* Gun laws (I'm a registered gun owner but they constantly want to make it tougher on us and other law abiding citizens to attain one)
* Freedom of movement, especially for women during dark hours
* Personal identity number - too easily discerned and too revealing
* Almost impossible for private citizen to sue newspapers for defamation and the trial is held behind closed doors.

Just to mention a few issues that I detest.

And the US rankes 28th in personal liberty in your own link so that didn't help your argument. The Human Freedom Index also lists personal freedom and Sweden ranks better there as well.

 

[Son of Jamin]

And the US rankes 28th in personal liberty in your own link so that didn't help your argument. The Human Freedom Index also lists personal freedom and Sweden ranks better there as well.

You are inventing arguments, you brought up some arbitrary freedom ranking and I posted another that showed a different result!

It’s rather strange to extrapolate from some arbitrary ranking and apply it on a personal level!

If freedom for me is financial mobility, homeschooling, gun rights. Then Sweden is not so free for me.

 

[Squarechoke]

You are inventing arguments, you brought up some arbitrary freedom ranking and I posted another that showed a different result!

It’s rather strange to extrapolate from some arbitrary ranking and apply it on a personal level!

If freedom for me is financial mobility, homeschooling, gun rights. Then Sweden is not so free for me.

No, you didn't. My point was that it made little sense to list it as a con for Sweden and not for the US (so I didn't even defend any of them, I just pointed out something that looked unequal). Your comeback was to show yet another ranking where Sweden beat the us in freedom.

If you think it's strange to extrapolate from some "arbitrary" (poor use of the word here) ranking then why did you go ahead and do that yourself? You tried to support your view by saying that Sweden was ranked 12th in personal freedom in that ranking, but when I showed that the US is ranked much lower you suddenly are against the entire concept. You're making little sense here and it's poor form to move the goalposts like that.

When it comes to financial mobility you're again not really hitting the mark. The US has had some of the lowest socio-economic mobility in the developed world for some time now.

So Sweden has more liberty in so many views, but you end up only giving the con to that nation because of homeschooling and gun rights. I'm sorry but that's downright funny.

 

[Neph]

There's a lot of people in this thread that know nothing about freedoms other countries enjoy.

 

[all caps]

Germany get way more paid holidays though, not all bad. Before they let all the migrants in I wouldn't have minded living there.

I also liked what seemed like a stronger sense of community. People were more open to speaking to strangers it seemed like. Where as in America we look at each other as suspects. I was in a small town though so maybe it's different in a bigger city

 

[superpunch]

nm

 

[superpunch]

Say what you want but America has always been the leader in equality.....Yes even though white privilege etc exist, America is still trying to be as fair as possible....We have a shitload of minorities too.

<{monica}>

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

The statement is too broad. I think some of the best places to live are in the US but the US has its share of cesspools.

This. The US is equivalent to at least 4 different countries really. The difference culturally from Washington State to Nevada is just as noticeable as the difference between France and Spain in my experience.

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

<{monica}>

Ironic post. What other country empowers that many black men to be as wealthy as the dudes you just posted?

 

[superpunch]

Ironic post. What other country empowers that many black men to be as wealthy as the dudes you just posted?

You said always

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

You said always

You having a stroke bruh?

 

[superpunch]

You having a stroke bruh?

I thought you were the same as the guy I was quoting that said we've always been leading country for equality.

We used to have slavery, Jim Crow, and discriminated against black people in education and employment. Today, we discriminate against men, white people, and Asians in education and employment. So, I don't think we can claim to be the world's leader in equality today either. We just can't seem to move beyond racism or sexism in either direction; for or against men, for or against women, for or against blacks, for or against whites.. The discrimination is always there, it's just the targets of it that keep changing.

 

[LogicalError]

We're still waiting for the NZ'ers to officially join us. Our Constitution lists New Zealand as a state, it's open for them to come at any time.

We already have 15% of their entire population living here already!

Isn’t Australia New Zealand’s western island? I could have swore that’s what some NZ guys told me

 

[Neph]

Isn’t Australia New Zealand’s western island? I could have swore that’s what some NZ guys told me

Only when they want our welfare!

 

[Son of Jamin]

No, you didn't. My point was that it made little sense to list it as a con for Sweden and not for the US (so I didn't even defend any of them, I just pointed out something that looked unequal). Your comeback was to show yet another ranking where Sweden beat the us in freedom.

If you think it's strange to extrapolate from some "arbitrary" (poor use of the word here) ranking then why did you go ahead and do that yourself? You tried to support your view by saying that Sweden was ranked 12th in personal freedom in that ranking, but when I showed that the US is ranked much lower you suddenly are against the entire concept. You're making little sense here and it's poor form to move the goalposts like that.

When it comes to financial mobility you're again not really hitting the mark. The US has had some of the lowest socio-economic mobility in the developed world for some time now.

So Sweden has more liberty in so many views, but you end up only giving the con to that nation because of homeschooling and gun rights. I'm sorry but that's downright funny.

So you don't find it a con for Sweden that we are forced to pay for left-wing state owned propaganda? The fact that they are currently trying to change the constitution so the likes of Aftonbladet and Expressen can receive information that the ordinary citizen can't? You don't find it troublesome that the government is giving money to news outlets that are guilty of fake news to combat fake news? Do you honestly believe that these arbitrary rankings take such assaults on our freedom into consideration? Do you believe that they measure the fact that state owned media exposes nurses for writing about the healthcare problems in Sweden in a Facebook group and accusing them of wrecking havoc in the civil discourse? Do you think they take into consideration that they hide costs for immigration? Do you think they take into consideration that they hide the over representation in crime by immigrants?

I didn't try to support anything related to the US when I posted that Sweden ranked 12th in some freedom index, it was only to showcase that these rankings seem to vary quite a lot. It was you who kept focusing on America's ranking in them, not me.

As for financial mobility, I'm not talking about it in general, I'm talking about it from a personal standpoint. The friends and colleagues that have left our company and began to work in the U.S earn far more than I could dream of here.

As for homeschooling, it was just an example that if you value some freedoms more than others, an overarching index might not be the best measure for individual preferences.

 

[Squarechoke]

So you don't find it a con for Sweden that we are forced to pay for left-wing state owned propaganda? The fact that they are currently trying to change the constitution so the likes of Aftonbladet and Expressen can receive information that the ordinary citizen can't? You don't find it troublesome that the government is giving money to news outlets that are guilty of fake news to combat fake news? Do you honestly believe that these arbitrary rankings take such assaults on our freedom into consideration? Do you believe that they measure the fact that state owned media exposes nurses for writing about the healthcare problems in Sweden in a Facebook group and accusing them of wrecking havoc in the civil discourse? Do you think they take into consideration that they hide costs for immigration? Do you think they take into consideration that they hide the over representation in crime by immigrants?

I didn't try to support anything related to the US when I posted that Sweden ranked 12th in some freedom index, it was only to showcase that these rankings seem to vary quite a lot. It was you who kept focusing on America's ranking in them, not me.

As for financial mobility, I'm not talking about it in general, I'm talking about it from a personal standpoint. The friends and colleagues that have left our company and began to work in the U.S earn far more than I could dream of here.

As for homeschooling, it was just an example that if you value some freedoms more than others, an overarching index might not be the best measure for individual preferences.

You're all over the place. I even pointed out the obvious fact that I didn't say it was wrong to have it as a con for Sweden but that it was dumb to not also have it for the US if you have it for Sweden as that's a country with less liberty (and yes, including personal liberty). If you can't even bother to read what I write then what's the point of responding?

You didn't show anything since I didn't talk about Sweden being at the top, I talked about it being ranked higher than the US. In your ignorance you just piled on.

If you're just talking about things from a personal standpoint then I understand why they make more than you since apparently you are on welfare (you talked about how welfare can't support people anymore). I also have to extend my condolences for the spike in violent crime and sexual assaults you've apparently been exposed to. That must be traumatic.