Just saw this on FB today. 10th Planet drama.

[2008]

Loads of people who suck have black belts and the black belt just makes them feel legit.

Even if you find a BB who 'sucks' or an ego maniac, greedy jerk your still free to leave with your wallet to train somewhere else. Respect and common sense work both ways. I definitely don't suggest staying at gym that sucks or your not uncomfortable in.

 

[2008]

Eddie has created one of the unhealthiest and cult like atmospheres in the BJJ community. If not for EBI, most of their better known grapplers would still be obscure to anyone not from the West Coast. Eddie created an echo chamber where idiots believe the earth is flat. That’s all you need to know really.

With so many top talent gyms in Cali I don't see the appeal of training at 10th Planet tbh.

 

[trustdoesntrust]

With so many top talent gyms in Cali I don't see the appeal of training at 10th Planet tbh.

Most of the top gyms are in Southern California. The Bay Area has some big schools to be sure, such as Caio Terra and Ralph Gracie, but it's nothing like what you find in LA or even San Diego.

 

[kying418]

With so many top talent gyms in Cali I don't see the appeal of training at 10th Planet tbh.

It's because for whatever reason (I don't think it is clever marketing), 10th planet appeals to a certain niche, and they could care less what other schools are there.

I used to frequent the 10th planet forums- every month, you would get posters complaining how there wasn't a 10th planet school in Manhattan- the same place that Marcelo, Renzo, and Shaolin are located. It would blow my mind.

 

[chubbman]

Good job bjj isn’t cultish like other martial arts

 

[JustTheTip]

With so many top talent gyms in Cali I don't see the appeal of training at 10th Planet tbh.

I don't get it either.
Because of 10th P's overall marketing I can see where a potential BJJ student would try and sign up, but I don't get why anyone that has been into BJJ for over a year would stay.

 

[lechien]

Good job bjj isn’t cultish like other martial arts

Judo is pretty cool.

The national federation or kodokan issue the black belt after so many wins..etc

An instructor cannot claim to own your BB.

They have 2 level of competition so noone of that bs blue belt world champion. ..

I just went to a 10 dollars judo seminar and the same dude charged 50 dollars for a seminar of bjj and MMA in the morning at a different location.

 

[cjd]

I don't get it either.
Because of 10th P's overall marketing I can see where a potential BJJ student would try and sign up, but I don't get why anyone that has been into BJJ for over a year would stay.

10th planet does a "good" job of having a very inward facing culture - most 10th planet guys are much more aware of the 10th planet community than they are of the broader jiu jitsu community. They are also taught from day one that people on the outside are "point fighters" who don't "go for kills" which tends to make them very dismissive of anything that contradicts what they view as their place in the hierarchy of jiu jitsu.

The other thing I'd say is that the longer people train without putting on a gi, the more loathe they are too ever do so. Can't be losing to white belts! They will go to great lengths to rationalize this avoidance.

That having been said, I've come across plenty of very good grapplers (and nice guys) at 10th planet schools. Not necessarily world-class, but how many of us can say that we are?

 

[yetanother]

They have 2 level of competition so noone of that bs blue belt world champion. ..

The multiple levels of competitions are a good thing, how else are you going to fight guys near your level in competition when starting as an adult?

 

[Aed]

I used to frequent the 10th planet forums- every month, you would get posters complaining how there wasn't a 10th planet school in Manhattan- the same place that Marcelo, Renzo, and Shaolin are located. It would blow my mind.

I work with a couple people like this. They claim they trained at a 10th Planet school before they transferred here (I just take their word for it and they came from different parts of the country) and both state that they want to get back into grappling. I've tried to get them to come train with me, but they both say they only want to do no-gi and don't want to "start over" in a new system. I know they've both seen the schedule for Marcelo's and Unity and know that they could train no-gi for a couple hours a day at either place, but they're locked into only training at 10th Planet.

To be clear, I'm pretty sure neither of these guys think the Earth is flat and I they both seem like pretty decent guys. There's definitely something about the marketing that keeps people hooked.

 

[Dirty Holt]

I would like to chime in. I am not a fan of Prokopos, just based on his attitude from what I have heard in interviews. IMO someone so young doesnt have the experience to pontificate about the meaning of life growing up as a rich kid in the bay area. Add to the fact that as one poster described earlier, I was one of the guys who competed against Canders and had to listen to Denny coach with the "yes, explore there, dominate there, I like your thought process." I didnt have a coach with me so I could hear everything the guy was saying. I was pretty amused listening to this and I knew the position would eventually end with me getting the submission. Reading how he comes off in his social media, Im just not a fan of that persona. Nothing wrong with it, just not for me.

That being said, I think there are some very inaccurate assumptions about 10th Planet. I have trained there for about the last 10 months or so. The culture isnt what is being described. No one thinks everyone is a point fighter. MAny practices are simply passing and going for points. Many practices, athletes who are relevant in the IBJJF system are analyzed, broken down, and trained with intent to improve position. Where I train, outside of Geo Martinez, many of the top black and brown belts were wrestlers to start. I came from Checkmat, and I can genuinely say a lot of the 10th Planet guys I train with are every bit as tough as those guys, at least at the lighter weights.

I think maybe 10th Planet had certain prominent figures in the past where these stereotypes were formed, but speaking from experience, most of the practices are just like a wrestling practice, and most of the top guys are just hard nosed athletes who use the basics and specialize in a few less used positions. I think if most people came in for a practice or two in the SD 10th Planets, you would immediately change your mind on what its like. Its hard for me to come in here and read this when I see what these guys are doing for the BJJ community and the neighborhoods in which they are located.

 

[genecop]

Just keep wearing the B.B. and move on..if Eddie asks for it back, tell him aliens took it...just saying..

 

[Ice 9 Cobra]

Holt, I have visited SD and agree with your points. I think the majority of the stereotypes occur from the gyms that are outside the SoCal area, where the instructors aren't as close to Eddie and there's some loss in ability/message (especially with blue and purple belt head instructors). I think Eddie saw this and that's why he instituted the warm ups to try and standardize across his affiliates.

 

[SidRon]

I spent a week training at 10th Planet San Diego over Christmas Break (Boogeyman’s location). I didn’t sense any type of negative vibe. Everybody was great and the training sessions were awesome. I actually liked how they run classes. We spent lots of time going live from specific positions in addition to normal rolling. Two of the nights of the four I was there Boogeyman was teaching guard passes so I know they spend time teaching traditional BJJ strategies as well. Everybody was as friendly or more friendly than any of the many places I have visited. I Don’t think it is fair to take the experience of one guy at one affiliate and use it to make general assumptions about all of the 10th Planet gyms.

 

[Zankou]

I agree that the 10th planet guys I have trained with are (a) cool and (b) open minded. In Los Angeles it’s impossible to be insular. Everybody drops by other schools and trains at seminars and such with each other ... everybody is at the same comps. 10th planet guys admire tons of grapplers from other schools, and don’t think their main systems are unbeatable or the only way to do things.

Some of the regional affiliates, I sense, are more into hard marketing the distinction and culty feel.

 

[lechien]

The multiple levels of competitions are a good thing, how else are you going to fight guys near your level in competition when starting as an adult?

It does not matter because it would the same in bjj in a few years time .

As almost every bjj gyms are now offering kids bjj, a person starting completing only at adult level in blue belt level would have to compete against people that have been competing since they were very young and seasoned competitor over 5 to ten years.

The only chance would be colored belt masters.

 

[trustdoesntrust]

I would like to chime in. I am not a fan of Prokopos, just based on his attitude from what I have heard in interviews. IMO someone so young doesnt have the experience to pontificate about the meaning of life growing up as a rich kid in the bay area. Add to the fact that as one poster described earlier, I was one of the guys who competed against Canders and had to listen to Denny coach with the "yes, explore there, dominate there, I like your thought process." I didnt have a coach with me so I could hear everything the guy was saying. I was pretty amused listening to this and I knew the position would eventually end with me getting the submission. Reading how he comes off in his social media, Im just not a fan of that persona. Nothing wrong with it, just not for me.

That being said, I think there are some very inaccurate assumptions about 10th Planet. I have trained there for about the last 10 months or so. The culture isnt what is being described. No one thinks everyone is a point fighter. MAny practices are simply passing and going for points. Many practices, athletes who are relevant in the IBJJF system are analyzed, broken down, and trained with intent to improve position. Where I train, outside of Geo Martinez, many of the top black and brown belts were wrestlers to start. I came from Checkmat, and I can genuinely say a lot of the 10th Planet guys I train with are every bit as tough as those guys, at least at the lighter weights.

I think maybe 10th Planet had certain prominent figures in the past where these stereotypes were formed, but speaking from experience, most of the practices are just like a wrestling practice, and most of the top guys are just hard nosed athletes who use the basics and specialize in a few less used positions. I think if most people came in for a practice or two in the SD 10th Planets, you would immediately change your mind on what its like. Its hard for me to come in here and read this when I see what these guys are doing for the BJJ community and the neighborhoods in which they are located.

yeah, if you question the legitimacy or appeal of 10thPlanet then you're just not paying enough attention. i think there's some fatal flaws in their approach that hinder them at higher levels, but if there's one thing they've discovered it's that they will beat you if you come from a school that doesn't take no-gi seriously.

 

[cjd]

That being said, I think there are some very inaccurate assumptions about 10th Planet. I have trained there for about the last 10 months or so. The culture isnt what is being described. No one thinks everyone is a point fighter. MAny practices are simply passing and going for points. Many practices, athletes who are relevant in the IBJJF system are analyzed, broken down, and trained with intent to improve position. Where I train, outside of Geo Martinez, many of the top black and brown belts were wrestlers to start. I came from Checkmat, and I can genuinely say a lot of the 10th Planet guys I train with are every bit as tough as those guys, at least at the lighter weights.

I think maybe 10th Planet had certain p

Point taken. My experience has largely been with some of the further-flung affiliates. I guess I shouldn't be surprised with your experience with the SD gyms, given the high caliber of guys they've put out.

 

[yetanother]

It does not matter because it would the same in bjj in a few years time .

As almost every bjj gyms are now offering kids bjj, a person starting completing only at adult level in blue belt level would have to compete against people that have been competing since they were very young and seasoned competitor over 5 to ten years.
.

Maybe that gets fixed somehow. Having kids like the Ruotolo twins who are already way beyond what most black belts will ever be compete at blue belt seems silly. Hell I know an old pothead who took silver at adult black belt in 1999 who sucks compared to them.

 

[mataleaos]

It's because for whatever reason (I don't think it is clever marketing), 10th planet appeals to a certain niche, and they could care less what other schools are there.

I used to frequent the 10th planet forums- every month, you would get posters complaining how there wasn't a 10th planet school in Manhattan- the same place that Marcelo, Renzo, and Shaolin are located. It would blow my mind.

Yes!

I used to post there too (I remember your quality posts too) and you'd see people post a new no-gi rolling video of Marcelo Garcia or something and it would get 2 or 3 replies and you'd see a post about whether or not the moon landing was fake and it would be 6 pages deep.

It's definitely an interesting crowd. I think the typical 10th Planet hobbyist is less competitive by nature than the average hobbyist from other schools. They just seem to care a little bit more about the social aspects of training? For lack of a better phrase. I honestly think there are people that get into enjoy 10p more for the social scene and tribal aspect of it rather than the actual training. Whereas I think a lot of other affiliations have people that are primarily interested in the training first and then we also enjoy the social and tribal benefits of having friends at the gym, etc. But with 10th Planet I think that dynamic is flip-flopped.

That was just my impression from also frequenting their message boards regularly.

I also noticed they typically would not care about stuff until Eddie Bravo did. There was little interest in competitive jiu-jitsu over there compared to MMA. So you'd see threrads about MMA fights but from from 2010-2013 there were tons of awesome Rafa Mendes no-gi stuff posted there for example and NO ONE cared...until Eddie Bravo had that popular Stuart Cooper video after he went to ADCC in 2013 and talked with Joe Rogan about Rafa and Cobrinha, and Garry Tonon and Kron Gracie. Then all of a sudden people would reply to the Rafa Mendes video posts.

So there's also a big culture of people needing an Eddie Bravo cosign before they care about a grappler.

I guarantee if EBI was run by another person with the exact same rules and had the same amount of viewers that if people posted about it on their message board that no one over there would give a fuck about it.

All of this could be different now but in the early 2010's this was just my perception.

edit - @Dirty Holt it seems a lot of this isn't the case anymore or is a misconception based on a small sample size. That's cool to hear.