ken shamrock

[tekkenfan]

what do you think of ken shamrocks grappling ability if you were to rank him do you think he can handle most brown belts on average?

 

[Uchi Mata]

At his current age/physicality? I don't know, he seems to be pretty broken these days. I'd say in his prime he'd probably easily handle most casual brown belts without the gi just because he was so unbelievably powerful and explosive. Very few people would be able to deal with someone that big and strong jumping on submissions (especially on their legs) the way Ken did.

Unless you've spent a fair amount of time rolling with professional fighters it's hard to understand how much the gulf in physicality matters between amateurs and pro-athletes, and also how good most pros are at defending submissions and bettering their positions even if they're not doing so in a stereotypical BJJ manner. I roll with some pros who are probably around blue belt level of skill if they were to engage like a BJJ guy, but they're especially good at defending subs and getting back to their feet and they're way stronger and faster than me...makes them very hard to deal with even if I'm far better technically than they are. I'm sure prime Ken would be just way too physical for the vast majority of brown belts to handle.

 

[catchwrestle]

At his current age/physicality? I don't know, he seems to be pretty broken these days. I'd say in his prime he'd probably easily handle most casual brown belts without the gi just because he was so unbelievably powerful and explosive. Very few people would be able to deal with someone that big and strong jumping on submissions (especially on their legs) the way Ken did.

Unless you've spent a fair amount of time rolling with professional fighters it's hard to understand how much the gulf in physicality matters between amateurs and pro-athletes, and also how good most pros are at defending submissions and bettering their positions even if they're not doing so in a stereotypical BJJ manner. I roll with some pros who are probably around blue belt level of skill if they were to engage like a BJJ guy, but they're especially good at defending subs and getting back to their feet and they're way stronger and faster than me...makes them very hard to deal with even if I'm far better technically than they are. I'm sure prime Ken would be just way too physical for the vast majority of brown belts to handle.

Completely agree about the physicality of a pro athlete

 

[TheGZA]

 

[tekkenfan]

At his current age/physicality? I don't know, he seems to be pretty broken these days. I'd say in his prime he'd probably easily handle most casual brown belts without the gi just because he was so unbelievably powerful and explosive. Very few people would be able to deal with someone that big and strong jumping on submissions (especially on their legs) the way Ken did.

Unless you've spent a fair amount of time rolling with professional fighters it's hard to understand how much the gulf in physicality matters between amateurs and pro-athletes, and also how good most pros are at defending submissions and bettering their positions even if they're not doing so in a stereotypical BJJ manner. I roll with some pros who are probably around blue belt level of skill if they were to engage like a BJJ guy, but they're especially good at defending subs and getting back to their feet and they're way stronger and faster than me...makes them very hard to deal with even if I'm far better technically than they are. I'm sure prime Ken would be just way too physical for the vast majority of brown belts to handle.

yeah i know he could get away with things based off his size and power but grappling technique and skill what would you say he never seemed really technical always looked off balanced to me

 

[dsdoubled]

It seems that those fighters who came up in Japan in works AND in shoots in Pancrase and Shooto really perfected a certain style of grappling that was both technically sound , aggressive, and a ton of fun to watch. I'm not sure how prime Ken would be done in ADCC but he was a friggin animal in fights.

 

[Uchi Mata]

yeah i know he could get away with things based off his size and power but grappling technique and skill what would you say he never seemed really technical always looked off balanced to me

He was a catch wrestler, not a BJJ guy. He himself has said he was mostly 'a brawler and a leg lock man'. I don't think he was fundamentally sound by today's standards, but I still think he'd get a ton of panic taps against pretty much any non-elite brown belt just because of the ferocity with which he jumped on submissions. If you had someone who could match his physicality with the technique of a modern brown belt he'd probably lose, but you aren't going to find many people like that.

 

[Oleg Raktatov]

 

[mattemate]

what do you think of ken shamrocks grappling ability if you were to rank him do you think he can handle most brown belts on average?

In his second fight with Royce he stayed in his guard for fifteen minutes or so. I'd say prime Ken would do fine with most browns

 

[tekkenfan]

tbh roy

In his second fight with Royce he stayed in his guard for fifteen minutes or so. I'd say prime Ken would do fine with most browns

tbh that isnt a very great accomplishment royces brother and lots of others i heard said that the average purple belt is around royces level watch ufc 3 royce gets upa rolled over by kimo.

i dont even remember the last time i saw a good blue belt even get upa rolled unless the guy was over 80 pounds larger

 

[mattemate]

tbh roy


tbh that isnt a very great accomplishment royces brother and lots of others i heard said that the average purple belt is around royces level watch ufc 3 royce gets upa rolled over by kimo.

i dont even remember the last time i saw a good blue belt even get upa rolled unless the guy was over 80 pounds larger

I don't know man. Kimo WAS about 80 pounds heavier, juiced to the gills, and had been a decent high school wrestler.

Think about Royce's performance against Severn-- that was as legit as it gets.

Is he a world class black belt? Not by today's standards, but he's still a legit bb