International Missing Saudi Journalist Killed, Saudis Threaten Global Economic Repercussions if Punished

Shitpost.

Trump's base was decidedly anti-Saudi, and you'll have to remind me again: how did Obama and the Democrats handle Saudi Arabia during his tenure?

Stop being a myopic, shill, partisan hypocrite. This is on all of us.

I'm still anti-Saudi. We shouldn't fight wars for Saudi Arabia or Israel when they can take care of themselves. I don't trust Israel much more than the others. They get way too much aid for their worth. We know Saudi Arabia was responsible for 9/11, but I think the U.S. and Israeli Intel was involved as well. That's why we covered it up. Bin Salman removed those royals from power with our backing and took their money. He's too young to have been involved in the attack, and using him to remove those elements from power is one of the only realistic ideas that doesn't involve pipe dreams about democracy. That kind of action results in chaos over there.

I don't support war with Iran either. I don't care how any of these countries handle their domestic problems. It's not our fight, and you can't save people by killing them. I don't care what Israel does to the Palestinians. I don't have to pick a side. Kashnoggi is a part of the domestic problems I don't care about. I'm not going to defend the Muslin brotherhood, or any other foreign Muslim unless there's some benefit to our country. He's not our problem anymore.
 
Khashoggi wasn't an American citizen or a journalist. He was a leader in the Muslim Brotherhood. He shouldn't have been in the U.S. to begin with, and he's none of our concern now.
As editor-in-chief of a Saudi newspaper he approved articles that attacked Wahhabism and Salafist teaching. His gravest error was criticizing Trump for running a weak platform on Syria/Assad(he argued it aided Iran)- this is when MBS banned him from the country.

Trump's inaction isn't surprising- he probably ordered the hit.
 
His killing had nothing to do with Israel. But Trump and the American establishment's forthcoming defense of Bin Salman has a lot to do with Israel, though there are other factors like defense sales and continuing to keep Saudi in the US camp.

I'm actually with you on America needing to back off from Israeli support.
Unfortunately, it's just not going to happen and I don't know why.
 
Shitpost.

Trump's base was decidedly anti-Saudi, and you'll have to remind me again: how did Obama and the Democrats handle Saudi Arabia during his tenure?

Stop being a myopic, shill, partisan hypocrite. This is on all of us.

What Trump said during 2016 and what he does now is quite a bit different. In 2016 he claimed he was going to be tough on the Saudis and his base went along with it, but after the election he flipped 180. His base has done diddly to hold him accountable. What his base was thinking then and what they are doing now are 2 different things. Why are you acting like my post was about the sentiments of his grass-roots in 2016, when clearly it is about Breitbart commenters' sentiments now.

Trump's base , the sort that swears by Breitbart , Fox News, WND and all statements by Trump and Co., are now either attacking Khashoggi or siding with Trump in being blase of the whole ordeal.
They support whatever they think Trump supports. If Trump is not being hard on Bin Salman, then they will take that as a cue to also not be hard on MBS. Since Don Jnr tweeted that bullshit smear of Khashoggi, the Trumpers take it as a cue to attack Khashoggi.

You do realize that the Saudis did not like Obama. They couldn't wait to see him leave. Obama put a hold on the weapons package that the US government had approved for Saudi Arabia. Obama would not give into Saudi pressure and depose Assad. Obama criticized Wahhabism.

--
Quotes are italicized.
--

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...eign-policy-syria-jihadism-isis-a6927646.html

Commentators have missed the significance of President Barack Obama’s acerbic criticism of Saudi Arabia and Sunni states long allied to the US for fomenting sectarian hatred and seeking to lure the US into fighting regional wars on their behalf. In a series of lengthy interviews with Jeffrey Goldberg published in The Atlantic magazine, Mr Obama explains why it is not in the US’s interests to continue the tradition of the US foreign policy establishment, whose views he privately disdains, by giving automatic support to the Saudis and their allies.


President Obama is highly informed about the origins of al-Qa’ida and Islamic State, describing how Islam in Indonesia, where he spent part of his childhood, had become more intolerant and exclusive. Asked why this had occurred, Mr Obama is quoted as replying: “The Saudis and other Gulf Arabs have funnelled money, and large numbers of imams and teachers, into the country. In the 1990s, the Saudis heavily funded Wahhabist madrassas, seminaries that teach the fundamentalist version of Islam favoured by the Saudi ruling family.”

--


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...bama-saudi-arabia-trip-9-11-terrorist-attacks

The US president landed in Riyadh on Wednesday on his final trip to the region before leaving office. He will try to smooth the ruffled feathers of Saudis, Emiratis and Bahrainis who have come to resent their longstanding ally for “tilting” towards their rival Iran and pressing too hard for domestic reforms they fear will undermine the autocratic status quo.

After the Atlantic interview, Prince Turki al-Faisal, the former Saudi intelligence chief, retorted that Obama was being “petulant” and “adding insult to injury” in equating “the kingdom’s 80 years of constant friendship with America” with an irresponsible Iran.


Carnegie’s Perry Cammack said: “The end of the Obama administration can’t come quickly enough for some of these leaders.


Now as the article mentions Obama was opposed to the bill holding Saudis accountable to 9-11, but if you compare the entirety of America's relationship with Saudi under him with Bush Jnr you will notice Obama was much less favorable to Saudi.

--

https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-d...eshingly-clear-eyed-view-allies-saudi-arabia/

He is clearly irritated that foreign-policy orthodoxy compels him to treat Saudi Arabia as an ally

“Aren’t the Saudis your friends?,” Turnbull asked.

Obama smiled. “It’s complicated,” he said.

Obama’s patience with Saudi Arabia has always been limited….In the White House these days, one occasionally hears Obama’s National Security Council officials pointedly reminding visitors that the large majority of 9/11 hijackers were not Iranian, but Saudi—and Obama himself rails against Saudi Arabia’s state-sanctioned misogyny, arguing in private that “a country cannot function in the modern world when it is repressing half of its population.”

--

Saudis Welcome Trump’s Rebuff of Obama’s Mideast Views

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/20/world/middleeast/donald-trump-saudi-arabia.html

Mr. Trump announced a nearly $110 billion arms deal with Saudi Arabia as evidence of a renewed commitment by the United States to the security of the Persian Gulf region. The package includes precision weaponry that Mr. Obama had held up over concerns that it would be used to kill civilians in the war in neighboring Yemen, as well as an antimissile system.

--

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...a-saudi-arabia-visit-king-salman-relationship

The president’s recent comment that the Saudis and Iranians should “share the neighbourhood” angered officials in Riyadh, leading to sharp public criticism of an American “pivot” towards the Islamic Republic in the run up to last summer’s landmark nuclear agreement

--


https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/296029-saudis-wait-for-obamas-exit

President Obama’s departure from the White House will lead to a change in the United States’s relationship with Saudi Arabia, which the Persian Gulf nation is likely only too eager to see.

Obama has been at odds with the kingdom throughout the last eight years, most notably through his spearheading of a nuclear deal with the Saudis’ regional rival, Iran.

The estrangement was on full display earlier this year, when the royal family snubbed Obama by skipping his arrival in Riyadh for a Gulf summit.

Foreign policy experts say Saudi Arabia’s leadership is likely yearning for Obama to leave and looking forward to what may be a fuller embrace from the next president. Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, in particular, is expected to take a warmer tone with the Saudis if she becomes president.


--

So tell me again how Obama handled Saudi Arabia vs. Bush Jnr and Trump
 
As editor-in-chief of a Saudi newspaper he approved articles that attacked Wahhabism and Salafist teaching. His gravest error was criticizing Trump for running a weak platform on Syria/Assad(he argued it aided Iran)- this is when MBS banned him from the country.

Trump's inaction isn't surprising- he probably ordered the hit.

Huge accusation. Ordered what hit?
Are you talking about the arms dealer that got killed?
 
The worlds a lot more gray than it is black or white, and looking at the details of how things work in reality can make you feel sick. There are tough decision that shouldn't be made by a psychopath, or someone who's morality cripple them as leaders when tough choices have to be made. In reality you aren't given easy choices. We can't bring democracy to any country that doesn't already have a strong homegrown democracy movement to take over. The domestic struggle inside a country isn't our responsibility.

If we really depend on a country like Saudi Arabia, our best choice is to back a friendly strongman who keeps order and doesn't pose a threat to our interest. That's looks like the role of Bin Salman is playing right now, and I'm skeptical that he could be replaced with anything better at this time. I'm suspicious about the Kashnoggi situation, because it looks like a move meant to weaken Salman. Kashnoggi involvement isn't as innocent as some would like us to believe. We should avoid foreign conflict most of the time, but we must be able to accept reality when conflict is necessary. That includes working with regimes that aren't free.

If we go to war we should be willing win it at all cost, including all the brutal tactics that history has shown is how you win a war, but we like to forget when romanticizing war so it's easier to get involved in. That's why we fight so many pointless wars that never end, and achieve nothing. If we aren't willing to win at all cost, then the war isn't worth getting involved in to begin with. That's why our last total victory was in WW2 against a far more powerful enemy than any we've faced since. Nothing since has been as important. I can't stand the saying about fighting them over there, so we don't have to fight them here. We wouldn't have to fight them anywhere if we didn't allow them into our country.
 
The worlds a lot more gray than it is black or white, and looking at the details of how things work in reality can make you feel sick. There are tough decision that shouldn't be made by a psychopath, or someone who's morality cripple them as leaders when tough choices have to be made. In reality you aren't given easy choices. We can't bring democracy to any country that doesn't already have a strong homegrown democracy movement to take over. The domestic struggle inside a country isn't our responsibility.

If we really depend on a country like Saudi Arabia, our best choice is to back a friendly strongman who keeps order and doesn't pose a threat to our interest. That's looks like the role of Bin Salman is playing right now, and I'm skeptical that he could be replaced with anything better at this time. I'm suspicious about the Kashnoggi situation, because it looks like a move meant to weaken Salman. Kashnoggi involvement isn't as innocent as some would like us to believe. We should avoid foreign conflict most of the time, but we must be able to accept reality when conflict is necessary. That includes working with regimes that aren't free.

If we go to war we should be willing win it at all cost, including all the brutal tactics that history has shown is how you win a war, but we like to forget when romanticizing war so it's easier to get involved in. That's why we fight so many pointless wars that never end, and achieve nothing. If we aren't willing to win at all cost, then the war isn't worth getting involved in to begin with. That's why our last total victory was in WW2 against a far more powerful enemy than any we've faced since. Nothing since has been as important. I can't stand the saying about fighting them over there, so we don't have to fight them here. We wouldn't have to fight them anywhere if we didn't allow them into our country.
Found the bot @VivaRevolution
 
What Trump said during 2016 and what he does now is quite a bit different. In 2016 he claimed he was going to be tough on the Saudis and his base went along with it, but after the election he flipped 180. His base has done diddly to hold him accountable. What his base was thinking then and what they are doing now are 2 different things. Why are you acting like my post was about the sentiments of his grass-roots in 2016, when clearly it is about Breitbart commenters' sentiments now.

Trump's base , the sort that swears by Breitbart , Fox News, WND and all statements by Trump and Co., are now either attacking Khashoggi or siding with Trump in being blase of the whole ordeal.
They support whatever they think Trump supports. If Trump is not being hard on Bin Salman, then they will take that as a cue to also not be hard on MBS. Since Don Jnr tweeted that bullshit smear of Khashoggi, the Trumpers take it as a cue to attack Khashoggi.

You do realize that the Saudis did not like Obama. They couldn't wait to see him leave. Obama put a hold on the weapons package that the US government had approved for Saudi Arabia. Obama would not give into Saudi pressure and depose Assad. Obama criticized Wahhabism.

--
Quotes are italicized.
--

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...eign-policy-syria-jihadism-isis-a6927646.html

Commentators have missed the significance of President Barack Obama’s acerbic criticism of Saudi Arabia and Sunni states long allied to the US for fomenting sectarian hatred and seeking to lure the US into fighting regional wars on their behalf. In a series of lengthy interviews with Jeffrey Goldberg published in The Atlantic magazine, Mr Obama explains why it is not in the US’s interests to continue the tradition of the US foreign policy establishment, whose views he privately disdains, by giving automatic support to the Saudis and their allies.


President Obama is highly informed about the origins of al-Qa’ida and Islamic State, describing how Islam in Indonesia, where he spent part of his childhood, had become more intolerant and exclusive. Asked why this had occurred, Mr Obama is quoted as replying: “The Saudis and other Gulf Arabs have funnelled money, and large numbers of imams and teachers, into the country. In the 1990s, the Saudis heavily funded Wahhabist madrassas, seminaries that teach the fundamentalist version of Islam favoured by the Saudi ruling family.”

--


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...bama-saudi-arabia-trip-9-11-terrorist-attacks

The US president landed in Riyadh on Wednesday on his final trip to the region before leaving office. He will try to smooth the ruffled feathers of Saudis, Emiratis and Bahrainis who have come to resent their longstanding ally for “tilting” towards their rival Iran and pressing too hard for domestic reforms they fear will undermine the autocratic status quo.

After the Atlantic interview, Prince Turki al-Faisal, the former Saudi intelligence chief, retorted that Obama was being “petulant” and “adding insult to injury” in equating “the kingdom’s 80 years of constant friendship with America” with an irresponsible Iran.


Carnegie’s Perry Cammack said: “The end of the Obama administration can’t come quickly enough for some of these leaders.


Now as the article mentions Obama was opposed to the bill holding Saudis accountable to 9-11, but if you compare the entirety of America's relationship with Saudi under him with Bush Jnr you will notice Obama was much less favorable to Saudi.

--

https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-d...eshingly-clear-eyed-view-allies-saudi-arabia/

He is clearly irritated that foreign-policy orthodoxy compels him to treat Saudi Arabia as an ally

“Aren’t the Saudis your friends?,” Turnbull asked.

Obama smiled. “It’s complicated,” he said.

Obama’s patience with Saudi Arabia has always been limited….In the White House these days, one occasionally hears Obama’s National Security Council officials pointedly reminding visitors that the large majority of 9/11 hijackers were not Iranian, but Saudi—and Obama himself rails against Saudi Arabia’s state-sanctioned misogyny, arguing in private that “a country cannot function in the modern world when it is repressing half of its population.”

--

Saudis Welcome Trump’s Rebuff of Obama’s Mideast Views

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/20/world/middleeast/donald-trump-saudi-arabia.html

Mr. Trump announced a nearly $110 billion arms deal with Saudi Arabia as evidence of a renewed commitment by the United States to the security of the Persian Gulf region. The package includes precision weaponry that Mr. Obama had held up over concerns that it would be used to kill civilians in the war in neighboring Yemen, as well as an antimissile system.

--

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...a-saudi-arabia-visit-king-salman-relationship

The president’s recent comment that the Saudis and Iranians should “share the neighbourhood” angered officials in Riyadh, leading to sharp public criticism of an American “pivot” towards the Islamic Republic in the run up to last summer’s landmark nuclear agreement

--


https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/296029-saudis-wait-for-obamas-exit

President Obama’s departure from the White House will lead to a change in the United States’s relationship with Saudi Arabia, which the Persian Gulf nation is likely only too eager to see.

Obama has been at odds with the kingdom throughout the last eight years, most notably through his spearheading of a nuclear deal with the Saudis’ regional rival, Iran.

The estrangement was on full display earlier this year, when the royal family snubbed Obama by skipping his arrival in Riyadh for a Gulf summit.

Foreign policy experts say Saudi Arabia’s leadership is likely yearning for Obama to leave and looking forward to what may be a fuller embrace from the next president. Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, in particular, is expected to take a warmer tone with the Saudis if she becomes president.


--

So tell me again how Obama handled Saudi Arabia vs. Bush Jnr and Trump

This is what I want clarification on. Everyone says they'll change shit. Then it never happens once in office.
I want to know why.
 
As editor-in-chief of a Saudi newspaper he approved articles that attacked Wahhabism and Salafist teaching. His gravest error was criticizing Trump for running a weak platform on Syria/Assad(he argued it aided Iran)- this is when MBS banned him from the country.

Trump's inaction isn't surprising- he probably ordered the hit.

So he just wanted our country to get involved in another pointless war in Syria to fight his fight. Syria isn't our fight. Assad is better than the rebels. We shouldn't sacrifice a damn thing in the country. I don't care for a Islamic foreigners lobbying us to fight their fight. Unless there's some other reason to use the Kashnoggi situation to benefit the U.S., we shouldn't get involved in his disappearance. We definitely shouldn't make any sacrifices to defend him. He wasn't a regular western journalist the way he's being portrayed regardless of whatever he was exactly. He has a storied history with connections to several Islamic terrorist, and high level figures within Saudi Arabia. I don't like the way the story's being manipulated to make him seem like the average American journalist. It's obviously being used to push some larger agenda. I don't trust it the story for that reason.
 
No idea who that guy is or how it pertains to the thread topic.

Adnan Khashoggi was a billionaire arms dealer.
CIA is so stupid they probably saw the name in their database and the hit was on.
 
Adnan Khashoggi was a billionaire arms dealer.
CIA is so stupid they probably saw the name in their database and the hit was on.
Yeah that's Jamal's uncle. His cousin was the boyfriend who died alongside Princess Diana. His grandfather was the personal physician to King Saud- founder of KSA.

This is some deep shit. Jamal used to work for Saudi intelligence- part of his job was to try and de-radicalize Osama bin Laden.
 
This is what I want clarification on. Everyone says they'll change shit. Then it never happens once in office.
I want to know why.

Well there is this
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo...fund-inspired-by-ivanka-trump?t=1539599027778

Followed by this
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...nited-arab-emirates-100-million-a7748501.html

That leads to this
https://www.alternet.org/right-wing...is-announced-100-million-donation-ivanka-fund

With the end result being
source.gif
 
What Trump said during 2016 and what he does now is quite a bit different. In 2016 he claimed he was going to be tough on the Saudis and his base went along with it, but after the election he flipped 180. His base has done diddly to hold him accountable. What his base was thinking then and what they are doing now are 2 different things. Why are you acting like my post was about the sentiments of his grass-roots in 2016, when clearly it is about Breitbart commenters' sentiments now.

Trump's base , the sort that swears by Breitbart , Fox News, WND and all statements by Trump and Co., are now either attacking Khashoggi or siding with Trump in being blase of the whole ordeal.
They support whatever they think Trump supports. If Trump is not being hard on Bin Salman, then they will take that as a cue to also not be hard on MBS. Since Don Jnr tweeted that bullshit smear of Khashoggi, the Trumpers take it as a cue to attack Khashoggi.

You do realize that the Saudis did not like Obama. They couldn't wait to see him leave. Obama put a hold on the weapons package that the US government had approved for Saudi Arabia. Obama would not give into Saudi pressure and depose Assad. Obama criticized Wahhabism.

--
Quotes are italicized.
--

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...eign-policy-syria-jihadism-isis-a6927646.html

Commentators have missed the significance of President Barack Obama’s acerbic criticism of Saudi Arabia and Sunni states long allied to the US for fomenting sectarian hatred and seeking to lure the US into fighting regional wars on their behalf. In a series of lengthy interviews with Jeffrey Goldberg published in The Atlantic magazine, Mr Obama explains why it is not in the US’s interests to continue the tradition of the US foreign policy establishment, whose views he privately disdains, by giving automatic support to the Saudis and their allies.


President Obama is highly informed about the origins of al-Qa’ida and Islamic State, describing how Islam in Indonesia, where he spent part of his childhood, had become more intolerant and exclusive. Asked why this had occurred, Mr Obama is quoted as replying: “The Saudis and other Gulf Arabs have funnelled money, and large numbers of imams and teachers, into the country. In the 1990s, the Saudis heavily funded Wahhabist madrassas, seminaries that teach the fundamentalist version of Islam favoured by the Saudi ruling family.”

--


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...bama-saudi-arabia-trip-9-11-terrorist-attacks

The US president landed in Riyadh on Wednesday on his final trip to the region before leaving office. He will try to smooth the ruffled feathers of Saudis, Emiratis and Bahrainis who have come to resent their longstanding ally for “tilting” towards their rival Iran and pressing too hard for domestic reforms they fear will undermine the autocratic status quo.

After the Atlantic interview, Prince Turki al-Faisal, the former Saudi intelligence chief, retorted that Obama was being “petulant” and “adding insult to injury” in equating “the kingdom’s 80 years of constant friendship with America” with an irresponsible Iran.


Carnegie’s Perry Cammack said: “The end of the Obama administration can’t come quickly enough for some of these leaders.


Now as the article mentions Obama was opposed to the bill holding Saudis accountable to 9-11, but if you compare the entirety of America's relationship with Saudi under him with Bush Jnr you will notice Obama was much less favorable to Saudi.

--

https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-d...eshingly-clear-eyed-view-allies-saudi-arabia/

He is clearly irritated that foreign-policy orthodoxy compels him to treat Saudi Arabia as an ally

“Aren’t the Saudis your friends?,” Turnbull asked.

Obama smiled. “It’s complicated,” he said.

Obama’s patience with Saudi Arabia has always been limited….In the White House these days, one occasionally hears Obama’s National Security Council officials pointedly reminding visitors that the large majority of 9/11 hijackers were not Iranian, but Saudi—and Obama himself rails against Saudi Arabia’s state-sanctioned misogyny, arguing in private that “a country cannot function in the modern world when it is repressing half of its population.”

--

Saudis Welcome Trump’s Rebuff of Obama’s Mideast Views

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/20/world/middleeast/donald-trump-saudi-arabia.html

Mr. Trump announced a nearly $110 billion arms deal with Saudi Arabia as evidence of a renewed commitment by the United States to the security of the Persian Gulf region. The package includes precision weaponry that Mr. Obama had held up over concerns that it would be used to kill civilians in the war in neighboring Yemen, as well as an antimissile system.

--

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...a-saudi-arabia-visit-king-salman-relationship

The president’s recent comment that the Saudis and Iranians should “share the neighbourhood” angered officials in Riyadh, leading to sharp public criticism of an American “pivot” towards the Islamic Republic in the run up to last summer’s landmark nuclear agreement

--


https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/296029-saudis-wait-for-obamas-exit

President Obama’s departure from the White House will lead to a change in the United States’s relationship with Saudi Arabia, which the Persian Gulf nation is likely only too eager to see.

Obama has been at odds with the kingdom throughout the last eight years, most notably through his spearheading of a nuclear deal with the Saudis’ regional rival, Iran.

The estrangement was on full display earlier this year, when the royal family snubbed Obama by skipping his arrival in Riyadh for a Gulf summit.

Foreign policy experts say Saudi Arabia’s leadership is likely yearning for Obama to leave and looking forward to what may be a fuller embrace from the next president. Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, in particular, is expected to take a warmer tone with the Saudis if she becomes president.


--

So tell me again how Obama handled Saudi Arabia vs. Bush Jnr and Trump
No shit! That's Trump. That isn't what his constituents wanted from him. That doesn't characterize the "anti-establishment" backlash against Saudi Arabia that swelled on both sides.

Obama talked tough about the Saudis, too, but then what did he do? He sold them warplanes. Obama, and all the Democrats you would endorse, are skins of the same politician, and here's his true form:
p36342_v_v8_ab.jpg
So spare the thread the dishonor of shitstaining it up with partisan politics. This is a bipartisan American failure.
 
No shit! That's Trump. That isn't what his constituents wanted from him. That doesn't characterize the "anti-establishment" backlash against Saudi Arabia that swelled on both sides.

Obama talked tough about the Saudis, too, but then what did he do? He sold them warplanes. Obama, and all the Democrats you would endorse, are skins of the same politician, and here's his true form:
p36342_v_v8_ab.jpg
So spare the thread the dishonor of shitstaining it up with partisan politics. This is a bipartisan American failure.
Bu bu but Obama!


<BirdieOwn>
 
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