NHL Offseason Discussion: Live From the KHL

[Makani]

PK is clowning the whole Canadiens organisation and it's hilarious. Let's go through the list of all the people that were rumoured to have issues with PK

1.) Michel Therrien - Fired mid-way through last season, didn't even make it 1 year without PK
2.) Tomas Plekanec - Has been a plug since signing his contract extension. Will likely be dealt at the trade deadline.
3.) Max Pacioretty - No showed in the playoffs last year yet again. Only has 33 points this year (10 points less than Subban). Might be traded.
4.) Brendan Gallagher - Actually having a good season by his standards, but it is really telling when a good season for him is still 11 points less than Subban.

Meanwhile PK makes it to the cup finals in his first season with the Preds, and is on pace for another Norris trophy this season. In the process he has exposed virtually all of his former teammates, coaches, and GMs as a group of pathetic losers.

I feel like my favorite part of PK is how angry he gets some people. I was just looking through his Twitter and there are guys who will comment on pictures of him with cancer kids and call him a showboating asshole who doesn't play real hockey. I bet they think Shea Weber plays "real hockey."

 

[INeedARemedy]

It's crazy how the Bruins and Habs have this bitter rivalry, yet in the past handful of years, both have traded a young superstar for horseshit reasons and completely tanked their chances at cups with a seemingly solid core

Ohh yeah and a coach was swapped too

 

[Makani]

It's crazy how the Bruins and Habs have this bitter rivalry, yet in the past handful of years, both have traded a young superstar for horseshit reasons and completely tanked their chances at cups with a seemingly solid core

Ohh yeah and a coach was swapped too

At least Boston kind of has an identity, if they can find a good replacement for Chara they'll be in business. The Habs are just in some terrifying purgatory where they spent too much on a declining goalie who is still just good enough to carry them out of the good draft pick spots. I don't think anyone is chomping at the bit to wear bleu blanc et rouge this off-season.

 

[NewbZor]

It's crazy how the Bruins and Habs have this bitter rivalry, yet in the past handful of years, both have traded a young superstar for horseshit reasons and completely tanked their chances at cups with a seemingly solid core

Ohh yeah and a coach was swapped too

Somehow trading Jumbo worked out though, they must have been trying to replicate that trade lol.

 

[auger38]

Man that was a disappointing game on Saturday. Habs dominating Nashville, PK playing like shit, Montreal getting a point. The shit storm that ensued afterwards was funny though.

 

[ChillyPalmer]

HAHAHA, these dudes never want to leave the 80's. Fucking Lost Boys over there.

 

[Graves The Elder]

ha, anything to light a fire I guess.
that loss to SJ last night had to be demoralizing

 

[ChillyPalmer]

It was a fucking fan poll though!

lmao, you have the best player in the league, and you're still trying to live in the past. Shit is so sad.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Was at the Leafs / Sens game sat night -- Karlsson is either hurt or completely fed up with playing in Ottawa. Never seen him look like such a pylon in his own end. Dion is borderline 2nd pairing AHL quality at this point.


Question, what should the leafs do with JVR? I guarantee he gets more than Pacioretty, Nash, or Kane on trade deadline day...but do you trade him and hurt your chances playoff time, or keep him and see how far you go, but lose him in the off season? I don't think the leafs can last against a healthy TB / BOS in the playoffs this year, and are a year or two away from real contention. Trading JVR for a first and a prospect(s) gives the leafs a shit load of trade bait to go after a true top pairing d-man and cap room to go after a big fish in free agency. Unless JVR agrees to come back for 6 mill AAV (he wont) i say get what you can for him now.

 

[Prokofievian]

lol, JvR returning more than Pacioretty.

The leafs are done building. Now it's time to start going for it. At the very least they have a puncher's chance.

 

[Workaholic]

Leafs are too far along to be attacking prospects and picks

If you're moving JVR it has to be for someone going into the lineup today. It can be a young player (and should be tbh), but not an 18 year old or a pick. Striking while your stars are still on entry level deals is important. It's what the Blackhawks did, it's what the Pens did and it's what the Leafs should try and do. That 10/11 million Matthews contract is coming down the pipe pretty soon and Nylander is going to be getting 7ish this summer himself. The handcuffing is going to start sooner than people think, gotta start getting things in motion now

Don't mortgage the future or anything but the returns if you're moving JVR can't be a guy who isn't in the lineup until 2021

 

[Makani]

Poor Gaborik, spending the rest of the season as a Senator. I didn't think anyone would be willing to take Phaneuf's contract, but here we are.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

lol, JvR returning more than Pacioretty.

The leafs are done building. Now it's time to start going for it. At the very least they have a puncher's chance.

go for what, they are not going to win the cup this year with that defense -- and they lose him for nothing in July. That seems like a very steep step back. He's a annual 30 goal scorer who is a 4.5 cap hit. Hes going to return big time -- rather have the 1st rounder and prospect he brings back and use that + a JL and see what Arizona wants for OEL

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Poor Gaborik, spending the rest of the season as a Senator. I didn't think anyone would be willing to take Phaneuf's contract, but here we are.

Ottawa still has to take on 25% of it -- for a team that hates spending, thats gotta hurt.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Leafs are too far along to be attacking prospects and picks

If you're moving JVR it has to be for someone going into the lineup today. It can be a young player (and should be tbh), but not an 18 year old or a pick. Striking while your stars are still on entry level deals is important. It's what the Blackhawks did, it's what the Pens did and it's what the Leafs should try and do. That 10/11 million Matthews contract is coming down the pipe pretty soon and Nylander is going to be getting 7ish this summer himself. The handcuffing is going to start sooner than people think, gotta start getting things in motion now

Don't mortgage the future or anything but the returns if you're moving JVR can't be a guy who isn't in the lineup until 2021

Id move him simply for the picks / prospect and use that (along with the myriad of bait they have) and go hard after OEL or a tanev during the off season. You risk losing him for nothing, and you're not getting a parade this year with him. His value is in what you can sell his return for.

 

[Makani]

Ottawa still has to take on 25% of it -- for a team that hates spending, thats gotta hurt.

They save about 4 million in cash in the long run thanks to not paying Phaneuf's signing bonus each year, and Gaborik is easier to buyout because of that if they go that route. Now they just have to put that money to proper use.

 

[Prokofievian]

go for what, they are not going to win the cup this year with that defense -- and they lose him for nothing in July. That seems like a very steep step back. He's a annual 30 goal scorer who is a 4.5 cap hit. Hes going to return big time -- rather have the 1st rounder and prospect he brings back and use that + a JL and see what Arizona wants for OEL

Couple things:

Contrary to popular belief, defence doesn't win championships. Offence does. Toronto are capable of scoring the ~3 GPG needed to be dangerous to any opponent in the playoffs. Even if you're overmatched in the playoffs, you'll basically never be even a 2:1 underdog to win a series because you can score so much.

And why aren't you going to keep Dreamsdyk? Your team is starting to be competitive now. The only reason we want to trade Patches is because we're not even close. Are you really going to get capped out with the cap rumoured to be going up 5 million next season? Worse comes to worse you can just let a couple people walk from the ass end of your depth chart and promote from within their bloated farm system.

Lastly, he's just a rental. His cap doesn't matter at the deadline, since most teams can fit Kanye West on their roster. His value also depends on Pacioretty and Nash so, you can't ask for too much. It's actually a bit of a shitty market for the habs for the same reason, even though we have the most valuable chip.

I mean, if he's walking no matter what, why not get a return on him. I get that. But like, which first and which prospect would you target?

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Couple things:

Contrary to popular belief, defence doesn't win championships. Offence does. Toronto are capable of scoring the ~3 GPG needed to be dangerous to any opponent in the playoffs. Even if you're overmatched in the playoffs, you'll basically never be even a 2:1 underdog to win a series because you can score so much.

And why aren't you going to keep Dreamsdyk? Your team is starting to be competitive now. The only reason we want to trade Patches is because we're not even close. Are you really going to get capped out with the cap rumoured to be going up 5 million next season? Worse comes to worse you can just let a couple people walk from the ass end of your depth chart and promote from within their bloated farm system.

Lastly, he's just a rental. His cap doesn't matter at the deadline, since most teams can fit Kanye West on their roster. His value also depends on Pacioretty and Nash so, you can't ask for too much. It's actually a bit of a shitty market for the habs for the same reason, even though we have the most valuable chip.

I mean, if he's walking no matter what, why not get a return on him. I get that. But like, which first and which prospect would you target?

1. Offense doesn't win games if your defense is prone to letting in 4-5 as much as your offense is able to score 4-5. How flaws are as prevalent as our feats and riding Andersen as the most over worked goalie in the league doesn't bode well for longevity going into the playoffs.

2. If JVR sticks around for 6, sure, keep him. But he is going to ask and in all likelihood get 7-8 -- with Matthews get a max and Nylander and Marner getting 7-8 on Bridge deal, doesn't make sense to keep JVR and just remain static with where you're at now. Parlay that space + returns and go after something that fixes your needs.

3. Leafs are loaded with bait players now -- any 1st round pick and prospect is going to look great to teams to offload near expiring contracts in shit markets. His value will be as comparable to Max (better imo due to this season) and higher than Nash (who is reportedly a 1st rounder + ready player)

Leafs are not getting past Boston or a TB in the first round, imo and signing JVR for 7-8 makes no sense if you're going to keep glaring holes.

Flip him in at the deadline and cash it in july 1st.

 

[Prokofievian]

It is much better to have an EGF of 3 and EGA of 3.5 than it is to have an EGF of 2 and an EGA of 2.5. Like, by a lot. Your win percentage is significantly increased in a 7 game series. Like, from 2:1 to 1.5:1 underdog, and that situation is pretty extreme. Not even Montreal is 3.5 EGA bad.

Why on earth would Matthews get max? We've come down from candy cane forest wherein Matthews was even comparable with McDavid, and not even the McJuice got a max contract. 'Member early in the season when people would jk about that? They don't so much anymore.

And JvR's value is not higher than Max's. Not even close. Max gives a team 2 chances. JvR gives a team one. Player control is king. And let's not get crazy and start saying things like ''JvR is a perennial 30 goal scorer'' and ''Max's value is negatively affected by his season'' when Pacioretty actually is a perennial 30 goal scorer (JvR isn't), and their total offensive output this year is basically the same despite vastly different circumstances. Like, how confident are you that there's no way that Patches will make it 5 years in a row in which he's scored more goals than JvR, even with the 7 goal gap?

But here's why I asked my question: what first and what prospect? There isn't some central first and prospect reserve that can quantitatively ease firsts and prospects. There has to be an actual match. The actual names are quite important especially since you're trying to parlay them into OEL.

 

[KrazyKanadian]

Well, for the first time in fucking years, I'm actually excited about the Canucks prospects and kids, even if the team won't be good for like 3 years (if they pan out).

But man, Boeser, Demko, Petterson, Gaudette, Dahlen, Juolevi, and even Kole Lind. Even Virtanen is actually getting minutes this year and looking less like a bust