Official Judo Thread

[Kbits]

For you guys that help coach, how well are the lower belts ( below brown) able to execute new throws in randori? Let's say they drill a osotogari varation for several weeks, do you expect them to hit that in randori against another colored belt?

I teach; I expect them to have their own games. IOW don't force anyone to hit anything they don't gravitate to.

If you're asking "how long before they can hit it, moving, against some kind of resistance?". I'd say...45 minutes I teach using 3I which is vastly superior to "let's do tons of uchikomi - now randori" method.

www.reddit.com/r/judo/comments/a4xc5j/teaching_use_of_mesocycles_and_3i_method/

How long before they weaponise it and make it truly their own? That's up to them.

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

The more I judo, the more I realise that the emphasis on classical sleeve and lapel is dentrimental to my judo.

 

[QingTian]

The more I judo, the more I realise that the emphasis on classical sleeve and lapel is dentrimental to my judo.

Going without it is easier and harder at the same time. You might have less impediments and more leverage, but you also lose some flexibility to lead uke so that you can use his own actions against him... you know, what Judo is about.

 

[QingTian]

For you guys that help coach, how well are the lower belts ( below brown) able to execute new throws in randori? Let's say they drill a osotogari varation for several weeks, do you expect them to hit that in randori against another colored belt?

Colored belts together are like rock paper scissors...and that's if they can do the technique somewhat correctly. There just won't be enough skill to cover different body types, styles, stances, etc.

 

[number9dream]

I saw on reddit that mouthguards are banned in IJF competitions... anyone know why? Also, where can I actually find that kind of stuff? I can't find it anywhere on the IJF website (but then they have like 90 documents under the document page, and the only format I was able to even find a 'rules of judo' document was in the form of 'here's what's new for 2018').

Kind of weird to me how hard it is to find this stuff.

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

Going without it is easier and harder at the same time. You might have less impediments and more leverage, but you also lose some flexibility to lead uke so that you can use his own actions against him... you know, what Judo is about.

I don't know, man.
I ve been doing this for 10 years now and it's just not for me. As in, I can't attack effectively with classic lapel and sleeve.

Let's be real here, if I was 15 y o and had just started it would be different but now I think at 38 the best use of my time is to focus on what works for me.

Also, feel free to disagree but I don't see why mastering classical would give anyone a flexibility edge over a guy who is comfortable switching between 2 lapels, russian grip, 2 sleeves, etc.

I am going to get flamed for this but my feeling is that the superiority of classical grip is just a perception.

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

Going without it is easier and harder at the same time. You might have less impediments and more leverage, but you also lose some flexibility to lead uke so that you can use his own actions against him... you know, what Judo is about.

Forgive me to insist but just as an example, from a motricity pov, how can the classical grip be more efficient than a tight grip across the back to lead your uke??

Think of the georgian grip for example. If done properly uke has his ass 2 feet away from his shoulders, which are being pressed to the bottom by tori's elbow. This is inherently a superior position if one can achieve it.

 

[QingTian]

Forgive me to insist but just as an example, from a motricity pov, how can the classical grip be more efficient than a tight grip across the back to lead your uke??

Think of the georgian grip for example. If done properly uke has his ass 2 feet away from his shoulders, which are being pressed to the bottom by tori's elbow. This is inherently a superior position if one can achieve it.

The classical grip is not more efficient per se. It's just that grips with leverage advantage often leads to a dog fight with uke, which ironically makes them often less efficient than a neutral grip where you aim to lead uke into a move. In contest or a real fight you should probably choose the power grip over classical, but if we are old men trying to do randori that's another story.

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

The classical grip is not more efficient per se. It's just that grips with leverage advantage often leads to a dog fight with uke, which ironically makes them often less efficient than a neutral grip where you aim to lead uke into a move. In contest or a real fight you should probably choose the power grip over classical, but if we are old men trying to do randori that's another story.

What do you call "the power grip"?

 

[QingTian]

What do you call "the power grip"?

Just bad grammar. I meant any grip with leverage.

 

[number9dream]

Are you allowed to do kimura-grip (ude-garami grip...?) throws in judo from standing position? I know the Japanese women's judo team use it a LOT in like these half-grounded spots (one opponent standing, one on the ground), but I'm not sure if it's allowed with both on their feet?

It's a favorite of mine ever since I was a kid so I'm secretly hoping I can still use it, but otherwise the Georgian grip looks pretty similar, functionally.

 

[Bluesbreaker]

Are you allowed to do kimura-grip (ude-garami grip...?) throws in judo from standing position? I know the Japanese women's judo team use it a LOT in like these half-grounded spots (one opponent standing, one on the ground), but I'm not sure if it's allowed with both on their feet?

It's a favorite of mine ever since I was a kid so I'm secretly hoping I can still use it, but otherwise the Georgian grip looks pretty similar, functionally.

I've never had to deal with it, but I'd imagine there are a few situations where you could get away with it, eg makikomi throws and sumi gaeshi. But, it's very important you don't do anything resembling an armlock when throwing.

 

[Zankou]

I don't know, man.
I ve been doing this for 10 years now and it's just not for me. As in, I can't attack effectively with classic lapel and sleeve.

Let's be real here, if I was 15 y o and had just started it would be different but now I think at 38 the best use of my time is to focus on what works for me.

Also, feel free to disagree but I don't see why mastering classical would give anyone a flexibility edge over a guy who is comfortable switching between 2 lapels, russian grip, 2 sleeves, etc.

I am going to get flamed for this but my feeling is that the superiority of classical grip is just a perception.

Same opinion. Collar and sleeve has some teaching advantages, but for older, less flexible, and bigger students it is a lousy setup.

It is just not a good setup for a physically strong and inflexible player. In judo they insist on teaching everyone like they are a twelve year old boy.

 

[Regal Boy]

I don't know where else to post this, so I figured the official judo thread is good.
Does anyone else think MMA artificially stunts the effectiveness of throws and such vs what their effects are on concrete? I just feel like, when I'm watching a fight, there are so many times where I'm thinking "if this were a fight on the street, that would have cracked his skull open and broken his neck". Basically the most efficient and best moves that you can do in a fight (Judo Ippons and wrestling 5 point throws, tbh even like a 3 point throw is enough) are artificially stunted via the soft mats of the octagon.
I think that a solid throw or slam, that would be an ippon or a 3-5 point throw or something, should count as a technical knockout and immediately award victory to the fighter who does it. But it has to be a good one, like it needs to land the opponent on their head/neck/back solidly.
Does anyone else agree? I want to make my own thread about this but I don't have the privileges yet. What do I need to do to get the right to post my own threads?

 

[Kbits]

You know tatami is thicker than octagon flooring, right? And that judo is done on tatami? Unless you're already practicing your throws on jigsaw matting in a roller skating rink, I don't think your idea makes much sense.

Also, judo throw are designed to land people onto their backs, not heads.

 

[Russky]

Gi makes bigger difference than floor.

 

[RJ Green]

see, the thing I think lot, a loooot of people space on about good judoka, is we don't have to throw you on your back. we're supposed to. we're supposed to do a lot of things. yeah, if I choke you, you die, but holy fuck all the different ways I can throw you on your head.

drop sode where you don't let go or rotate em over

or te guruma with half the rotation

and osotogari is just...if you fall correctly you wanna die anyway, but if Tori wants you both to land on the back of your head, that can happen too...

YAY JUDO!!!

 

[Regal Boy]

You know tatami is thicker than octagon flooring, right? And that judo is done on tatami? Unless you're already practicing your throws on jigsaw matting in a roller skating rink, I don't think your idea makes much sense.

Also, judo throw are designed to land people onto their backs, not heads.

Does an octagon flooring properly represent what being thrown on common hard surfaces is like?

The fight ends with a proper throw in a real fight. MMA doesn't properly represent that. Fighters constantly throw each other in ways that would end a fight if they didn't have the mats.

 

[Regal Boy]

To compare that video, look at the throws and such that happen in MMA that just turn into grappling when they would have ended the fight

 

[RJ Green]

MMA canvases are hard as fuck, professional fighters are hopped up on adrenaline, no grappling style on earth is contested on goddamn rocks, you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about, and this is why new accounts can't post garbage threads <3