Official Women's Division Discussion #25

Discussion in 'Worldwide MMA Discussion' started by LilMountain, Oct 26, 2017.

  1. Tobago Jones

    Tobago Jones #HalaWales

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    So is this the list for TUF?

    Larissa Pacheco
    Pannie Kianzad
    Katharina Lehner
    Marciea Allen
    Leah Letson
    Julija Stoliarenko
    Macy Chiasson
    Bea Malecki

    If true:

    <{clintugh}><Huh2><{katwhu}><{hughesimpress}><{cruzshake}><30><36>
     
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  2. WingsLax9042

    WingsLax9042 Purple Belt

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    I was expecting nothing..... and thats pretty much what they served up.

    Well, Go Pannie.
     
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  3. WingsLax9042

    WingsLax9042 Purple Belt

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    I'm getting real tired of this shit.
     
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  4. leto1776

    leto1776 Sherdog Wet Shaver Platinum Member

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    At least a replacement was found in time.

     
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  5. msm1981

    msm1981 Blue Belt

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    What a difference 3 years makes because Larissa Pacheco went
    from skin and bones when she fought at UFC in Bantamweight to
    now looking like she grew in to her body thanks to putting on weight
    and muscle mass now fighting at Featherweight.
     
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  6. Dsfdandan

    Dsfdandan Green Belt

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    Well she was basically a teen in the UFC.
     
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  7. Kaybee

    Kaybee Cocaine & Rosé

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    Well at least there will be someone in the division....right? RIGHT?! lol

    I don't even know what the UFC can do with W145 at this point. It would look bad for the UFC brand to close down the division since Cyborg is somewhat of a name. They could go with the status quo and get mocked for having a two fighter division, or they can overpay to poach pedestrian non-draws from Bellator. Even if they do manage to get every relevant W145er from both Bellator and Invicta under the UFC banner they'd have to sign the likes of those that will supposedly be on this TUF season.

    IDK, I'm all for growing the sport but I just can't help but roll my eyes every time that I remember that the UFC has a W145 division.
     
  8. ions82

    ions82 Blue Belt

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    At this point, maybe all that can be hoped for is that Harrison quickly rises up and dethrones Cyborg in a crazy upset. From what everyone is saying, long shots and wishful thinking may be the only hope for W145. Personally, I don't care if the fights are ugly and don't have a high skill level. As long as they're exciting, I'm interested. to me, 145 is like a fun circus. Not so much the Cyborg beat-downs. Just all the other craziness and unpredictability (thinking back to Dandois flailing and zombie-walking into a green Anderson before locking up a sub.) Fun weigh-ins. *sigh* Perhaps I'm just sentimental and miss old school Invicta.
     
  9. teddy078

    teddy078 White Belt

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    The problem is exactly UFC isn't paying enough. Lower ranked fights from Men's HW division look like toughman contest due to the same reason.

    WNBA's minimum wage is 40k plus per year, top players can earn 7 figure payments oversea.

    MMA doesn't pay good money to big athletes, male or female.
     
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  10. Rizz

    Rizz Green Belt

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    What you said might be the case for a lot of male divisions. However, You can't blame pay for 145 being crap. The pay ceiling is way higher in MMA than female basketball. No female basketball player is getting paid Ronda, Cyborg, Joanna levels of money. A mid tier fighter like Leslie Smith was making 62k a fight and was in line for a pay bump if the UFC wanted to resign her.

    The truth is combat sports will always be niche. There are not many people percentage-wise in the world who wants to get punched in the face for a living. Factor that in with the much lower amount of women who want to get involved in combat sports. Then factor that boxing will take a good percentage of those women because its more well established. Then factor in how big of a women you must be to be lean and then cut to 145 and then you start to see why 145 is low on talent.
     
  11. teddy078

    teddy078 White Belt

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    Top female basketballers get paid 7 figure and 6 figure regularly in EU and China. And they don't have to deal with ppv bullshit, they get paid according to how well they perform.

    Only Ronda consistently earned more than top female basketball players during her biggest years. Nunes got paid 2 million including ppv cut for her fight against Ronda which sold over 1 million ppv. Joanna could earn that much at 205, Cyborg haven't been on monster ppv card like that.

    Female mma fighters have to be on monster ppv cards to make bank except Ronda, they don't earn that much for regular ppv cards which sold 200k-300k.

    Not to mention that female tennis players dominate the Forbes list of top female athletes.

    Please google a little before sugarcoating UFC's payments to athletes.

    The problem now is that even top female combate sport athletes aren't making much moves to mma. How many top female judokas come to mma? Top female wrestlers outside of US aren't making moves to mma either. Only female pro boxers who are desperate for paycheck are making lots of moves to mma.

    They aren't making moves because they could be trapped in 10k/10k contract unless they can reach top of the division, and they have to show their skin & speak good english to have a chance to be a ppv drawl.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  12. Rizz

    Rizz Green Belt

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    First of all, I see you ignored the main parts of my argument on why WMMA talent pool is as shallow as it is. If you equal all the pay for both sports WMMA talent pool will still only be a fraction of what the WNBA's is for those reasons that I stated before.

    I was clearly comparing top fighters vs top Basketball players. Since you want to bring in the minimum salary of the UFC we can compare that to the WNBA.

    Min UFC Salary = 10k/10k per 3.5k Reebok per = 40.5k with potential to be 82.5k with wins(counted 2k salary bumps if you win)
    Depending on how shallow your division if you can debut with a 130k minimum

    Min WNBA Salary = 38k

    Now with dealing with the top of both respective sports. I clearly said "The pay ceiling is way higher in MMA than female basketball." You have stated nothing to disprove what i said.

    Max Salary for WNBA player in China is about 600k.
    Max Salary for WNBA players in Europe is about 600k with only 2 or 3 legends making 1mil.

    Ronda herself blows all those away and its not even close.

    Cyborg makes 500k guaranteed and PPV points. She fights 3 times a year and has somehow turned into a draw. So not even taking into account PPV points she has make 1.5mil purse and 120k Reebok pay.

    Amanda made over 2mil for UFC 207
    Jonna made over 2mil for UFC 193 and 205

    Interesting you said "Female mma fighters have to be on monster ppv cards to make bank except Ronda, they don't earn that much for regular ppv cards which sold 200k-300k."

    Joanna made 210k purse and 40k Reebok money for her fight at TUF23 Finale. She fights 3 timer a year which means not taking into account PPV points she made more than most WNBA players. So according to you for WNBA players 600k = paid well, but over 600k for MMA fighters = "They don't earn that much". Also remember that they chose the PPV Points route instead of a higher base pay route and no PPV Points.

    Sources:
    https://mmajunkie.com/2016/07/tuf-2...czyk-clears-210000-for-title-win-over-gadelha

    http://www.businessinsider.com/brittney-griner-basketball-china-2014-4

    http://www.courant.com/sports/baske...nba-players-overseas-0807-20140809-story.html

    http://www.espn.com/espnw/news-commentary/article/7538075/wnba-players-cash-overseas
     
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  13. teddy078

    teddy078 White Belt

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    I already adressed that.


    Now you are bullshitting, most female UFC only get 2 fights per year if they aren't injured. They have to win both fight to reach 40k, they have to pay training camp & corner out their own pocket.

    WNBA's minimum wage is 41k this year, you get paid even you are injured under contract. Training camp & coaching both are free.

    UFC's 10k/10k contract is shity as hell, no other around this.

    https://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Daily/Issues/2018/05/07/Leagues-and-Governing-Bodies/WNBA.aspx

    Stop bullshitting please. Cyborg only got 500k contract end of last year. And she isn't going to fight three time this year.

    Then Amanda made little money last year. And JJ didn't make much ppv money this year.

    Female basketballers' earnings are much more stable, it's not all about peak number. See above Amanda got paid more than 2 million in 2016 then perhaps less than 500k in 2017.

    You completely ignored top tennis female players are making millions of money each year.UFC's payments is shity for elite athletes, face this truth.
     
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  14. Dr John Smith

    Dr John Smith Blue Belt

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    So Cat Zingano is fighting Marion Reneau this weekend, the first time since 2010 that Cat has fought more than once in a year. Can Cat break her skid or has the game passed her by?
     
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  15. teddy078

    teddy078 White Belt

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    Old Cat would wrestle-fuck Reneau easily. But I'm afraid that Cat's atheleticism has declined too far gone. I'm leaning towards Reneau UD or later round stoppage.

    Maia vs Liz Carmouche is another fight which is hard to pick a winner.

    Maia is a good fighter, but I think her record is a bit weaker than her win-loss number suggests. Carmouche is a very good athlete who often fights with a bad gameplan.

    I think this matchup would favor Carmouche's atheleticism and grappling heavy style. Carmouche via UD.
     
  16. thatdude21601

    thatdude21601 Bananarama Belt

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  17. julmma

    julmma Blue Belt

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    Hope not! Cat needs this win so much, she seems to be in a better personal place now. Her last fight was with a superior fighter and she even lost a decision. I think Cat has a chance here!!!
     
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  18. Askafan

    Askafan Brown Belt

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    Most UFC contracts offer 3 fights a year - obviously not a calendar year but the anniversary of signing - if you turn down a fight that's on you, but if they don't offer 3 fights you get paid show money for the missed fight, that's what I understand anyway. If someone is on a 10/10 contract and lose all three they'll take home 40k (including Reebok money) and end up being cut. Win alĺ three you''ll get 10/10, 12/12, 15/15 ... so 80k with Reebok. These are the lowest rung of fighters of course.

    I've forgotten, why are we talking about tennis and basketball anyway? Is this the A1 athletes b.s. that turns up in heavies every now and then?
     
  19. Rizz

    Rizz Green Belt

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    Jessica Penne should be cleared of her suspenion in a month or two. I can't wait to see her fight. I love watching her grapple. She always gets crazy reversals due to her long flexible legs. I still remember that crazy one she got on Randa Markos. I think she was mounted and somehow got a reversal.
     
  20. Dsfdandan

    Dsfdandan Green Belt

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    Do olympians get paid a lot? Because there are many women in boxing, judo,wrestling and taekwondo that are around Kayla’s size.
     
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