preserving muscle while losing weight

You can’t. You can cut weight. No matter what you will lose some muscle.
 
beat...people...up? said:
Is this last dude serious or has he read too much Paleo pseudoscience woo?

"Mytheo-poetically, you could see it as a difference between things that want to be eaten (fruits), and things that would rather not be eaten, if you please (grains)."

Lmao

You know vegetables also "don't want to be eaten," right?

Also, you're still on about lectins? Come on.

Butter is not a health food. It's fine in moderation but there are lots of other foods that don't "spike insulin." Butter isn't magic.

I'm so amused.
Click to expand...


Seeds are significantly more energy dense than any other part of the plant, (and are also what it directly relies upon to reproduce), they are much more attractive to a much wider range of organisms (and the damage incurred by something eating them that much the greater). The selection pressures involved are radically different. Moreover, many of the cultivars used commonly in high output farming are specifically bred for greater resistance to consumption by pests as well, for greater yields (which of course has the side effect of making them more resistant to people consumption as well... leading some to tout 'ancient grains' as more preferable to contemporary varieties).

Even then, there are a huge number of plants out there in the world, their leaves or otherwise, that we don't eat, anyways, due to any number of reasons. The ones that we do commonly consume for other parts that are not especially involved in starch storage (like rhubarb stems) are so often 'happy accidents' with respects to their palatability, exceptions to the rule (exceptions to any rule which i took care to note wherever they existed throughout). If you were to grow some yourself, you would often unfortunately find them to be frustratingly attractive to all manners of wild creatures, in mysterious preference to any other surrounding flora.

Still on ? You seem to be carrying some residual mania from some other altercation(s) in the past with persons unknown and unrelated. Side effects apparently include belief in the utility of pointing-and-sputtering and other hysterics as if it were a rejoining of substance. Im not sure how much a PTSD clinic may help you but we can keep our options open at least.

>It's fine in moderation but there are lots of other foods that don't "spike insulin."

Oh yes, besides fat from butter, you could also use fat from lard, or fat from olives, or fat from coconuts, or fat from avocados... As well of course, there is also energy from protein sources, energy from soluble fiber sources, energy from resistant starch sources... Naturally questions of economy and availability can influence your ultimate choices as well, which makes sources like butter more attractive to people not made of money...

Indeed, it seems curious, how many examples of 'lots of other foods' happen to be things which were also noted in the very post. This is some seriously bad faith disingenuity.

As a common courtesy, it is good for the quality and enjoyability of discourses to avoid the temptation to post very strong opinions that lack actual engagement or responsiveness to, or comprehension of, the material.
 
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  1. Keep protein in the 1.8-2.2g/kg range for muscle retention when dieting
  2. Perform high intensity resistance training, you can reduce your volume by up to two thirds and still maintain your strength and muscle mass
  3. Don't fast, muscle protein synthesis is reduced during fasting
  4. Eat the majority of your daily carbs around your workouts to ensure that muscle glycogen is filled up, this will also increase whole body fat oxidation
 
FightGuyOpenMind said:
You'll need carbs for high intensity activity.

Try very light jogging or cycling in the morning for a hour and a half to two hours straight. This will burn fat. I've been doing this, and I'm losing weight, and looking far more ripped, and maintaining a good amount of strength in relation to my weight. See what it does for you. Went from hovering close to 180 to about 167.

However, you need carbs for high intensity training like grappling.
Click to expand...

No you dont
 
SPD123 said:
  1. Keep protein in the 1.8-2.2g/kg range for muscle retention when dieting
  2. Perform high intensity resistance training, you can reduce your volume by up to two thirds and still maintain your strength and muscle mass
  3. Don't fast, muscle protein synthesis is reduced during fasting
  4. Eat the majority of your daily carbs around your workouts to ensure that muscle glycogen is filled up, this will also increase whole body fat oxidation
Click to expand...

My whole Bjj squad is on intermitente fasting, I’ve seen results like never before... unless your aiming to be a bodybuilder, intermitente fasting works
 
FightGuyOpenMind said:
Carbs --> Glucose --> Cellular Respiration --> ATP --> ATP PC --> Anaerobic activity --> High intensity --> Grappling
Click to expand...

In theory...

Ever heard about ketosis?

Listen I have always believe the same, But from
My late experience, I have no problem training hard and being in a 16 hour fast... my clase mates even fast harder, for 20 hours...

Fasting works, you actually feel clearer more awake than when you consume carbs...
 
BJJ_Rage said:
In theory...

Ever heard about ketosis?

Listen I have always believe the same, But from
My late experience, I have no problem training hard and being in a 16 hour fast... my clase mates even fast harder, for 20 hours...

Fasting works, you actually feel clearer more awake than when you consume carbs...
Click to expand...

If you're confident challenge the science that is out there and prove the doctors, and researchers wrong. True ketosis is hard to achieve, and minus studying you in a lab we have no way to confirm what you're saying.

Why do you think athletes who are on a weight cut feel sluggish, and drained? A large part is the calorie restriction that is reducing carb intake which is interfering with the production of energy as I explained in my previous post.

I am presenting you principles that you can look into on your own time, and come to your own conclusion. You presented me with "no you don't". If you find my explanation is indeed backed by science, and research and still don't like it I would encourage you to contact some reputable people in the field and challenge what they're publishing. Until then, we are where we are.
 
FightGuyOpenMind said:
If you're confident challenge the science that is out there and prove the doctors, and researchers wrong. True ketosis is hard to achieve, and minus studying you in a lab we have no way to confirm what you're saying.

Why do you think athletes who are on a weight cut feel sluggish, and drained? A large part is the calorie restriction that is reducing carb intake which is interfering with the production of energy as I explained in my previous post.

I am presenting you principles that you can look into on your own time, and come to your own conclusion. You presented me with "no you don't". If you find my explanation is indeed backed by science, and research and still don't like it I would encourage you to contact some reputable people in the field and challenge what they're publishing. Until then, we are where we are.
Click to expand...

I’m not a bout to go to YouTube and post a trillón explanations on why intermitent fasting works, you can do that for your self... it works.

Fighters restricted the self of everything eating and even drinking, fasting works by making your body getting energy from fat, not carbs, in theory, I’m no expert on the issue, I’m just seeing results keeping it simple, fasting isn’t a diet, so you get your calories intake, just during a certain period of time...
 
BJJ_Rage said:
I’m not a bout to go to YouTube and post a trillón explanations on why intermitent fasting works, you can do that for your self... it works.

Fighters restricted the self of everything eating and even drinking, fasting works by making your body getting energy from fat, not carbs, in theory, I’m no expert on the issue, I’m just seeing results keeping it simple, fasting isn’t a diet, so you get your calories intake, just during a certain period of time...
Click to expand...

You made the claim you don't need carbs for high intensity activities. I explained to you why your assumption was wrong. I even provided a basic breakdown of what is happening inside of your body, and how carbs fits into that equation. You've presented me personal experience, that again we can not verify on this forum.

I got my insight from the head of the Exercise Physiology Department at the local university, a reputable PhD holder. You keep saying "theory". No it is accepted as being true. If it is not true, I again sincerely encourage you to challenge the evidence we have on hand. You may become famous for it.

Anybody can upload anything on YT, try reading a peer reviewed journal. Those are experts who are holding other experts accountable before the material gets released.
​
 
If you cut carbs, make sure to make up for it in fats. Don't make the mistake of ending up cutting carbs AND fat. Protein is slightly higher to help maintain muscle mass during a deficit, but fats will become the primary energy source, protein is a terrible energy source
 
BJJ_Rage said:
In theory...

Ever heard about ketosis?

Listen I have always believe the same, But from
My late experience, I have no problem training hard and being in a 16 hour fast... my clase mates even fast harder, for 20 hours...

Fasting works, you actually feel clearer more awake than when you consume carbs...
Click to expand...

https://www.minervamedica.it/en/jou...-fitness/article.php?cod=R40Y9999N00A18040408

The Journal of Sports Medicine and Physical Fitness 2018 Apr 04

Low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet impairs anaerobic exercise performance in exercise-trained women and men: a randomized-sequence crossover trial
 
FightGuyOpenMind said:
You made the claim you don't need carbs for high intensity activities. I explained to you why your assumption was wrong. I even provided a basic breakdown of what is happening inside of your body, and how carbs fits into that equation. You've presented me personal experience, that again we can not verify on this forum.

I got my insight from the head of the Exercise Physiology Department at the local university, a reputable PhD holder. You keep saying "theory". No it is accepted as being true. If it is not true, I again sincerely encourage you to challenge the evidence we have on hand. You may become famous for it.

Anybody can upload anything on YT, try reading a peer reviewed journal. Those are experts who are holding other experts accountable before the material gets released.
​
Click to expand...

I didn’t say you don’t need carbs, I said you could be fasting, you will eat your carbs, just in a different way...

Anyways, ketosis seems to work no low carbs but high fat. Again I’m no expert, but as far as I can see, this fasting thing works, and very well...
 
BJJ_Rage said:
Intermtent fasting is not a low carb diet, is not even a diet...
Click to expand...

I know IF isn't low carb. I'm a memebr of the forum where Martin Berkhan (the lean gains guy who popularized IF) started to theorize about IF and it's benefits.

So are you fasting with carbs around your workouts, or are you cosuming a low carb diet to be in ketosis?
 
BJJ_Rage said:
I didn’t say you don’t need carbs, I said you could be fasting, you will eat your carbs, just in a different way...

Anyways, ketosis seems to work no low carbs but high fat. Again I’m no expert, but as far as I can see, this fasting thing works, and very well...
Click to expand...

I made the claim that you need carbs for high intensity activity such as grappling, you simply replied "no you don't."

Here is an excerpt from a published book "Endurance Sports Nutrition, Third Edition" by Suzanne Girard Eberle. Eberle happens to be a RD (Registered Dietitian):

"Carbohydrate
Provides a highly efficient source of fuel—Because the body requires less oxygen to burn carbohydrate as compared to protein or fat, carbohydrate is considered the body’s most efficient fuel source. Carbohydrate is increasingly vital during high-intensity exercise when the body cannot process enough oxygen to meet its needs.

Fat
Helps fuel low- to moderate-intensity activity—At rest and during exercise performed at or below 65 percent of aerobic capacity, fat contributes 50 percent or more of the fuel that muscles need.

(http://www.humankinetics.com/excerpts/excerpts/the-bodyrsquos-fuel-sources)

My post was always about what would be needed to fuel his grappling, which is undeniably carbohydrates. ​

I have provided you with two reputable sources, one a RDN, and the other a university department head with a PhD. They are both saying the same thing.

Please review our conversation if you are not understanding what we are discussing here.
​
 
SPD123 said:
I know IF isn't low carb. I'm a memebr of the forum where Martin Berkhan (the lean gains guy who popularized IF) started to theorize about IF and it's benefits.

So are you fasting with carbs around your workouts, or are you cosuming a low carb diet to be in ketosis?
Click to expand...

No, I’m just fasting, I eat normally, your supposed to
Get in a ketosis state by fasting...
 
FightGuyOpenMind said:

I made the claim that you need carbs for high intensity activity such as grappling, you simply replied "no you don't."

Here is an excerpt from a published book "Endurance Sports Nutrition, Third Edition" by Suzanne Girard Eberle. Eberle happens to be a RD (Registered Dietitian):

"Carbohydrate
Provides a highly efficient source of fuel—Because the body requires less oxygen to burn carbohydrate as compared to protein or fat, carbohydrate is considered the body’s most efficient fuel source. Carbohydrate is increasingly vital during high-intensity exercise when the body cannot process enough oxygen to meet its needs.

Fat
Helps fuel low- to moderate-intensity activity—At rest and during exercise performed at or below 65 percent of aerobic capacity, fat contributes 50 percent or more of the fuel that muscles need.

(http://www.humankinetics.com/excerpts/excerpts/the-bodyrsquos-fuel-sources)

My post was always about what would be needed to fuel his grappling, which is undeniably carbohydrates. ​

I have provided you with two reputable sources, one a RDN, and the other a university department head with a PhD. They are both saying the same thing.

Please review our conversation if you are not understanding what we are discussing here.
​
Click to expand...

Here is one extract that I found about

On the other hand, gram for gram, fats provide more energy than carbohydrates.

The reason for this is the amount of oxidation that takes place as these compounds are converted to carbon dioxide and water. Carbon for carbon, fats require more oxidation to become CO2 and H2O than do carbohydrates. Roughly speaking, carbohydrates already have one oxygen for every carbon atom, thus, each carbon atom needs only one more oxygen and each pair of hydrogen atoms needs one more oxygen. However, almost every carbon atom in a fat molecule needs two oxygens instead of just one additional one, and each pair of hydrogen atoms still needs one more oxygen. So, just from counting the number of oxygens needed to be added, fats require about half again as much oxygen for the same number of carbon atoms. Because of this, the oxidation of fats takes longer, but it also gives off more energy.

When comparing gram to gram, instead of carbon to carbon, the effect is exaggerated. When you weigh a carbohydrate, more oxygen is included in that weight. When you weigh a fat, you get more carbon atoms per gram and therefore, gram for gram, the fats will give even more energy (over twice as much) than will the carbohydrates. Generally, fats provide about 9 kilocalories per gram and carbohydrates provide about 4 kilocalories per gram. (Using nutritional units, that is 9 Calories/gram for fats and 4 Calories/gram for carbohydrates.)
Click to expand...

http://dl.clackamas.edu/ch106-07/carbohyd1.htm

Another one
https://www.google.com.py/amp/s/fit...s/archive/2012/08/10/amp/fat-not-glucose.aspx

There’s a shit ton of articles sayign the same thing, as normally there’s different opinions on the matter, From my experience, I don’t need to load up on carbs to have enough energy to grapple if I am fasting...
 
Last edited:
BJJ_Rage said:
No, I’m just fasting, I eat normally, your supposed to
Get in a ketosis state by fasting...
Click to expand...

Very unlikely that you are in Ketosis if you are consuming a normal amount of carbs (say above 100g per day)

Your body has to deplete the reserve of glycogen (glucose) stored in your liver. Then you will enter ketosis.

Ketosis is the state you are in when your brain switches from using glucose as its fuel source to using ketone bodies, if there is glucose readily available the brain will use that as it's preferential fuel source.

This would explain why you and the rest of the BJJ squad are not seeing a performance drop off from fasting, you're still using glucose for fuel as the carbs you are consuming are getting stored in your muscles as glycogen.
 
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