Prime Chuck vs prime Machida

Squall10 said:
Find media support for your asinine opinion. Noone will ever put Rampage above Chuck on a GOAT list. Absolutely noone. Go to bed now it's nappie time.
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I think a prime Rampage might be better than a prime Chuck, he's at least as good a striker with more offensive tools (before he stopped wrestling).
 
BigMuffler said:
I think a prime Rampage might be better than a prime Chuck, he's at least as good a striker with more offensive tools (before he stopped wrestling).
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I always thought rampage was better than chuck. Really underated striking defense...He got his own title belt,and actually beat machida,as shitty of a win that was. Bested chuck twice,and was competitve af against wandy. Seemed like he stopped wrestling as much when he got annihilated by wandy in 2nd fight and hooked up w that boxing coach guy. That explosive grappling style,most guys just cant maintain that for more than a few yrs before the injuries take their toll
 
BigMuffler said:
I think a prime Rampage might be better than a prime Chuck, he's at least as good a striker with more offensive tools (before he stopped wrestling).
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Cool beans if you are even correct. Now why didn't he accomplish as much as Chuck? It's the old Dan Marino vs Tom Brady or Joe Montana argument. I'm going with Montana and Brady.
 
prime chuck was a pretty tough guy to beat espically if you dont have solid wrestling. which machida dosent have. chucks chin lasted a bit longer and took harder punches but machida was so elusive and quick. also id pick chuck to get the finish if there was one. but id pick machida to win a boring decision.
its hard to say tho. chuck had a tendancy to get wild and sloppy, and machida was a sniper.
if chuck used his wrestling in his prime i think he pounds machida out and stops him.
 
Squall10 said:
Cool beans if you are even correct. Now why didn't he accomplish as much as Chuck? It's the old Dan Marino vs Tom Brady or Joe Montana argument. I'm going with Montana and Brady.
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Did he not accomplish as much? He beat Hendo, Arona, Igor, Machida, Wand (albeit losing twice to him), Jardine, Randleman who Chuck also beat... and Chuck. He didn't have the title defenses but I don't really count championship fights much more than non-championship fights against the same level of talent.
 
BigMuffler said:
Did he not accomplish as much? He beat Hendo, Arona, Igor, Machida, Wand (albeit losing twice to him), Jardine, Randleman who Chuck also beat... and Chuck. He didn't have the title defenses but I don't really count championship fights much more than non-championship fights against the same level of talent.
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Rampage was really good. But Chuck had a great, historic career. The fallacy of putting Rampage on the same level is that you absolutely must go one by one, down the line and undermine Chuck's wins and legacy. Especially Tito and Couture which people seem to hate for some reason.

Rampage is much more easily undermined. The Wand he beat was pretty well shot. Machida was a boring affair that even Rampage admitted to thinking he may not have deserved the win.

Chuck had higher highs and he had more of them. Bustamante lost to Chuck but fought a split with Jackson on 5 days notice. When Rampage beat Chuck, he only had Igor, Murilo, and Randleman on his resume.

Chuck had Randleman, Belfort, Bustamante, and prime Belfort, and Overeem. You can't really make the case that that loss equalized things. Chuck's earlier career was better. And then you get to the 2003 -2007 era where Rampage doesn't do much except beat Arona, and Chuck beats Tito twice and Couture twice. Beating those two LHW GOATS at the top of their game alone destroys any further highlights that Rampage had. By the time he gets around to Chuck a second time Chuck is thirty fucking seven and already far far surpassed Quinton in terms of legacy.

The best I will say about Page is that he didn't abuse his body with drugs, alcohol, and excess in the same fashion that Chuck did. But part of that maybe because his career didn't hit the same stratospheric heights.
 
Squall10 said:
Rampage was really good. But Chuck had a great, historic career. The fallacy of putting Rampage on the same level is that you absolutely must go one by one, down the line and undermine Chuck's wins and legacy. Especially Tito and Couture which people seem to hate for some reason.

Rampage is much more easily undermined. The Wand he beat was pretty well shot. Machida was a boring affair that even Rampage admitted to thinking he may not have deserved the win.

Chuck had higher highs and he had more of them. Bustamante lost to Chuck but fought a split with Jackson on 5 days notice. When Rampage beat Chuck, he only had Igor, Murilo, and Randleman on his resume.

Chuck had Randleman, Belfort, Bustamante, and prime Belfort, and Overeem. You can't really make the case that that loss equalized things. Chuck's earlier career was better. And then you get to the 2003 -2007 era where Rampage doesn't do much except beat Arona, and Chuck beats Tito twice and Couture twice. Beating those two LHW GOATS at the top of their game alone destroys any further highlights that Rampage had. By the time he gets around to Chuck a second time Chuck is thirty fucking seven and already far far surpassed Quinton in terms of legacy.

The best I will say about Page is that he didn't abuse his body with drugs, alcohol, and excess in the same fashion that Chuck did. But part of that maybe because his career didn't hit the same stratospheric heights.
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You aren't wrong that Chuck has a cleaner resume, but you have to consider that Chuck built up his resume when his most dangerous opponents were in Japan beating each other up. Chuck built his resume against two wrestlers who he was perfectly tooled to defeat. And while Chuck may have a better overall resume with the title defense streak (again, aided by the fact that so many elite 205'rs were in Pride at the time) I don't think his overall skill level surpasses Rampage's. Rampage may have had a shorter prime aided by flying off the handle after a (IMO) controversial decision loss to Forrest Griffin, but at his peak his skills surpass any version of Chuck.
 
Rampage_Jackson said:
Chuck built his resume against two wrestlers who he was perfectly tooled to defeat.
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In that case you pretty much have to acknowledge that Rampage enjoyed a perfect stylistic matchup against Chuck, and Chuck is arguably Rampage's biggest win.

Personally I think that there are a handful of LHWs from that era that were all on a pretty close and comparative level.

Shogun
Wandy
Chuck
Rampage

Then a slight slight step down to

Arona
Tito
Randy

And guys like Machida, Rashad, etc who were excellent but not entirely of the same generation..
 
Chuck would be crying from frustration by the second round and walk into a straight left kill shot.
 
Pre-belt Machida wins a UD by pot-shotting all night without ever getting hit.
Post-belt Machida gets counter KOd like vs Rua.
 
Regardless, Chuck is LHW GOAT if you consider that Jones is disqualified.
 
jeff7b9 said:
In that case you pretty much have to acknowledge that Rampage enjoyed a perfect stylistic matchup against Chuck, and Chuck is arguably Rampage's biggest win.

Personally I think that there are a handful of LHWs from that era that were all on a pretty close and comparative level.

Shogun
Wandy
Chuck
Rampage

Then a slight slight step down to

Arona
Tito
Randy

And guys like Machida, Rashad, etc who were excellent but not entirely of the same generation..
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No mention of Hendo who was Rampage's actual most impressive victory?
 
Machida's too deadly and elusive for Chuck and Chuck won't be able to land his eyepokes because Lyoto's too fast.
 
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