Saudi Arabia severs diplomatic ties with Canada

Caught that the other day.

Ballsy move.
As I said here,
Good point, but if you want it to work, you can't make a public spectacle of it and back them into a corner. You go behind the scenes and give them a chance to save face. Here's hoping that's what's happening now. Or he may be just oblivious to the opportunity. But I doubt that's true of the entire cabinet.
Mind you, this is in reference to AB and BC's dispute over the pipeline.
It seems unlikely to me that no one in Trudeau's inner circle thought of that. Do you think they're all ignorant of this pressure point? I will wait to be proved wrong, but I would hope and I expect this approach is already being investigated via back channels.
 
Ok, so if your point is the irrational hate for the guy started before Trump, fine, I will concede that. I'm not going to agree that it's based upon much of substance, however.

So you've gone from, "People don't like Trudeau because they regret supporting Trump," to "People don't like Trudeau, just because," and you're calling other's irrational?
 

Thats cool and all, but I can't help but think that his words have more to do with his upcoming election in Burnaby than any true moral imperative. (He would have been a lock in Surrey, aka "Lil' Mumbai".) I think the dude dresses really well (sans turban, I'd love to copy that catalogue) but, he ain't no Jack Layton type of leader that excites and galvanizes. Dude always seems to be scrabbling.

But this is good tho, even though I hate the actors, I'm liking this script so far:

Been hearing about how other countries, our allies in the anglo-sphere and beyond, are looking like cowed bitches for their mealymouthery in the face of Saudi escaltion against Canada when we clearly dindu nuffin.

As for Trudeau, he needs to be like Trent Dilfer and just manage the situation and not fuck around and play heroball or get too cute. He hasn't embarassed us, which is usually a win all on it's own (like my client making it through a session without pissing himself.) Play the base offense. Stay consistent.

However strong my doubts are that this was actually by design (I'm positive that they couldn't have forseen or would have welcomed this escalation), he's making use look stout and resolute. For once.

We need to throw up more "Do we really need Saudi oil?" and "What good do they really bring to the world?" type conversations into the atmosphere like tags, and keep stirring that pot, especially while it's bubbling.

Use observable facts to goad those pussyclot Saudi's into showing the world exactly who they are as elements of their society reflexively retaliate with tweets like the one posted showing an airplane heading for the CN tower.

Document and tally every single one and publicly lay it at the feet of the Orange Emperor. This might give us the currency to buy us slack for the NAFTA negotiations or other things that are pressing us.
 
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So you've gone from, "People don't like Trudeau because they regret supporting Trump," to "People don't like Trudeau, just because," and you're calling other's irrational?
Not correct.

I have always maintained that the degree of hate for him shown in thread after thread is exaggerated and manufactured. I was apparently wrong about the cause and I conceded that point. Oh well, I've been wrong before. No doubt, may happen again. But it's a distinction without a difference. It's still painfully obvious that there is a certain group who are hellbent on trashing him at every opportunity even when it doesn't make sense, as in the current thread. Interestingly, your novel length post above includes this thread as the very first link,
http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/t...is-take-in-25-000-more-syrians.3085565/page-2
there are quite a few supportive posts in it. The discussion was fairly reasoned on the whole. Most of the other links there from later on are just full of ad hominem and little else so whether its coincidental or not, the concerted effort is apparent.
 
Thats cool and all, but I can't help but think that his words have more to do with his upcoming election in Burnaby than any true moral imperative. (He would have been a lock in Surrey, aka "Lil' Mumbai".) I think the dude dresses really well (sans turban, I'd love to copy that catalogue) but, he ain't no Jack Layton type of leader that exciteds and galvanizes. Dude always seems to be scarbbling.

He's no Layton. But then again, he's also no Mulcaire lol. He's at least electable.

But this is good tho, even though I hate the actors, I'm liking this script so far:

Been hearing about how other countries, our allies in the anglo-sphere and beyond, are looking like cowed bitches for their mealymouthery in the face of Saudi escaltion against Canada when we clearly dindu nuffin.

As for Trudeau, he needs to be like Trent Dilfer and just manage the situation and not fucl around and play heroball or get too cute. He hasn't embarassed us, which is usually a win all on it's own (like my client making it through a session without pissing himself.) Play the base offense. Stay consistent.However strong my doubts are that this was actually by design (I'm positive that they couldn't have forseen or would have welcomed this escalation), he's making use look stout and resolute. For once.

We need to throw up more "Do we really Saudi oil." and "What good do they really bring to the world?" type conversations into the atmosphere like tags, and keep stirring that pot, especially while it's bubbling.
Use observable facts to goad those pussyclot Saudi's into showing the world exactly who they are as elements of their society reflexively retaliate with tweets like the one posted showing an airplane heading for the CN tower.


Document and tally every single one and publicly lay it at the feet of the Orange Emperor. This might gives us currency to buy us slack for the NAFTA negotiations or other things that are pressing us.

By just being steady I think he's giving Singh the initiative. I like what he's done so far, but like I said I view this as a real opportunity for him that he doesn't seem to be taking advantage of. I agree with the bolded, but it does count who starts the conversation.
 
The majority of the people in the comment section are not too supportive of Singh's talk. There is one guy with a bunch of anti-Alberta posts.

There always is. But the counter argument has credibility now: it's Alberta or the Saudis. Why not bolster our own refining capacity, hire canadian engineers and tradespeople to build them, and the pipelines to service them, and the workers to run them, instead of giving Saudi Arabia 4 billion per year? It puts people who normally have moral credibility on their side on the back foot. It's easy to attack alberta, and pipelines. Not so hard when doing so means, in a way, siding with (at least being willing to fund) Saudi Arabia and all they stand for.
 
I would agree, Trudeau doesn’t seem to have the strength of his convictions. And the methodology was pretty weak. But I think your personal dislike for the man taints your view.
Even this weak “virtue signaling” as you put it is more than we’ve seen from any previous American or Canadian administration.

Personally, I'm all for aiming to stop dealing with Saudi Arabia as much as possible, and Canada taking a stand - but that's not what's happening. What has happened was that an empty utterance was put up on the internet, one that Canada could attempt to back up in some way, and what is the result of it at this point? It isn't Canada taking a stand - it's Saudi Arabia taking a stand and Canada displaying, quite clearly, that Saudi Arabia is willing to take a stand and Canada is not.

Think about it. Canada now has the opportunity to take a genuine stand and drop Saudi oil, along with any other Saudi products we buy. It wouldn't have a huge impact on SA, but it could be done and it would show we're not just all talk. Instead, we aren't doing that - we're continuing to buy their oil after our uttered platitude, putting money in Saudi pockets. Saudi Arabia on the other hand? They've ejected our diplomats, are calling back their students, have cut investments, are no longer buying products from us... They've stripped a huge portion of what we get from them away, and we've done virtually nothing to retaliate. It's all good and fine to paint this narrative of us standing up to the bully in some small way where no-one else does, but it's pure fiction. Our empty platitude without anything to back it up, paired with their quite decisive response from SA, enables them as bullies. The writing on the wall is quite clear - Canada talks but doesn't act, and Saudi will smack you around if you step out of line. This does nothing but reveal the emptiness behind Canada's moralizing.

Simply put, if we are going to talk virtuous, we need to be able to back it up in the face of a bully or we simply enable and strengthen that bully. We have done nothing at this point, in this exchange, but show that our morals are all talk, Canada will not respond in any meaningful way, and don't mess with Saudi Arabia. Honestly, it would have been simply better, in virtually every way I can conceive of, if we didn't go making moralizing statements that are ultimately empty. That being said, it will certainly buy votes, and I can't help but think that was the only real goal behind it, since it doesn't seem that there is any intent to actually back up the moralizing. I am more than a bit ashamed over this incident, if there is no decisive response taken in the near future. I'm holding out some hope so, Trudeau, prove me wrong!
 
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So you've gone from, "People don't like Trudeau because they regret supporting Trump," to "People don't like Trudeau, just because," and you're calling other's irrational?
Man, I like @Rebound59 and we see eye to eye on many issues. Trudeau isn't one. He's the flip side of the auto Trump defender coin. What can you do? After all, I have ideas and traits some people find to be curious at the least, so who am I to judge?
 
Man, I like @Rebound59 and we see eye to eye on many issues. Trudeau isn't one. He's the flip side of the auto Trump defender coin. What can you do? After all, I have ideas and traits some people find to be curious at the least, so who am I to judge?
Did you see my reply to that post? Nothing irrational about it.

Oh and gee whiz, thanks. :)

YJyNgHG.gif
 
And @Bald1 let me see legit criticisms of his policies and government actions and not his personality or some made up or overhyped molehill and I will stop calling it out as bs.
 
Did you see my reply to that post? Nothing irrational about it.
Yup, and I saw @salamander reply to you earlier as well. He raised legit grievances that you seem willing to dismiss. Just like Trumpbots when it comes to criticism of their guy.

Let's not make this a sticking point in our otherwise harmonious WR relationship. I get it, you're more on Trudeaus side than most of us here, and that's cool. But we're never going to agree on why and to what degree we mock and criticize him. At least I'm not saying I'd take Trump over him any more.
 
Canada could really take a leadership role in this situation and standout in the world as someone who stands up to Saudi Arabia. Lead by example instead of empty platitudes and virtue signalling. Canadians always seem to be clamoring to stand out on the world stage,(please notice me!) well this is our chance. Tell Saudi Arabia to go impregnate themselves, point out loudly all of there disgusting abuses of human rights and walk the fuck away.

Everyone is crying that none of our allies are "standing with us". Well man up and do the right thing, show the world that we don't have to bend the need to that shit hole. Maybe then we inspire others to do the same and spark some real change within that country. There will be some short term losses but we can more than make up for in a short period of time.

We said nothing when they were appointed to the UN human rights council, we said nothing when they were appointed to the women's rights commission. We allowed a multi billion dollar weapons deal to go through even though we knew exactly what those weapons would be used for. I have no love for Trudeau but this is his and his governments opportunity to show they more are than just empty virtue signal vessels.
 
Personally, I'm all for aiming to stop dealing with Saudi Arabia as much as possible, and Canada taking a stand - but that's not what's happening. What has happened was that an empty utterance was put up on the internet, one that Canada could attempt to back up in some way, and what is the result of it at this point? It isn't Canada taking a stand - it's Saudi Arabia taking a stand and Canada displaying, quite clearly, that Saudi Arabia is willing to take a stand and Canada is not.

Think about it. Canada now has the opportunity to take a genuine stand and drop Saudi oil, along with any other Saudi products we buy. It wouldn't have a huge impact on SA, but it could be done and it would show we're not just all talk. Instead, we aren't doing that - we're continuing to buy their oil after our uttered platitude, putting money in Saudi pockets. Saudi Arabia on the other hand? They've ejected our diplomats, are calling back their students, have cut investments, are no longer buying products from us... They've stripped a huge portion of what we get from them away, and we've done virtually nothing to retaliate. It's all good and fine to paint this narrative of us standing up to the bully in some small way where no-one else does, but it's pure fiction. Our empty platitude without anything to back it up, paired with their quite decisive response from SA, enables them as bullies. The writing on the wall is quite clear - Canada talks but doesn't act, and Saudi will smack you around if you step out of line. This does nothing but reveal the emptiness behind Canada's moralizing.

Simply put, if we are going to talk virtuous, we need to be able to back it up in the face of a bully or we simply enable and strengthen that bully. We have done nothing at this point, in this exchange, but show that our morals are all talk, Canada will not respond in any meaningful way, and don't mess with Saudi Arabia. Honestly, it would have been simply better, in virtually every way I can conceive of, if we didn't go making moralizing statements that are ultimately empty. That being said, it will certainly buy votes, and I can't help but think that was the only real goal behind it, since it doesn't seem that there is any intent to actually back up the moralizing. I am more than a bit ashamed over this incident, if there is no decisive response taken in the near future. I'm holding out some hope so, Trudeau, prove me wrong!


Kudos to you for bringing this conversation back to earth.
 
Imagine a war between Canada and Saudi Arabia?...Who you sherbros got?


Would USA side with Saudi Arabia?
 
Imagine a war between Canada and Saudi Arabia?...Who you sherbros got?


Would USA side with Saudi Arabia?
The answer to the second question decides the answer to the first. Therefore, depends on who is president, I'm afraid.
 
Imagine a war between Canada and Saudi Arabia?...Who you sherbros got?


Would USA side with Saudi Arabia?

In a world where Canada didn't ignore their army because they know the US would protect them due to proximity, Canada would probably win. (3x the GDP of Saudia Arabia)

But since Canada doesn't like spending on army and instead rather virtue signal and smell their own farts about being "peace keepers" Saudi would have Canada surrendering within 2 hours. And that's only because Saudi Arabia is a good distance from Canada. I mean, there's nothing really stopping someone from going around Ottawa recruiting a bunch of homeless people and arming them with hockey sticks and rolling up on parliament and overthrowing the government. Canada's that weak and proud of it too.
 
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