Serious Movie Discussion

Discussion in 'Mayberry Lounge' started by Bullitt68, Dec 21, 2017.

  1. Bullitt68

    Bullitt68 Senior Moderator Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Haven't been in here for a while so I thought that I'd play a bit of catch-up. All I have to contribute on the movie watching front is that Mute sucked nuts. If Skarsgård wasn't the lead, I would've tapped out inside the first half-hour; instead, I muscled my way through to the end. Terrible script first of all. I've seen more superior murder mysteries on Lifetime than I can count. In this day and age, with all the movies and all the TV procedurals that have been made (to say nothing of the gazillion awesome murder mystery novels out there), how someone can write such a shitty murder mystery is beyond me. And then the direction was so contrived. He was so obviously going for Blade Runner but he didn't have the grit. Nor did he have the light touch of a Total Recall. It was just a mess of past crap done much worse. Sadly, it seems as if Duncan Jones ran out of steam after Source Code.

    One of the most underrated movies out there.

    I'd say so. The Wrestler has a lot of extratextual impact with his life story, but Angel Heart is his best pure acting work IMO. He crushes that ending revelation scene so hard.

    With my ex, we actually watched Angel Heart and then I ended up asking her out on a Wednesday and told her that it was only fitting since it was anything can happen day :D

    I think my favorite of those little moments, though, at least with respect to Rourke, is the way (and simply the fact that) he laughs when he's asked if he speaks French (another great opportunity for the "I'm from Brooklyn" line, too).



    He's insulting himself, yet he can't help but find it funny that someone would think that he'd know how to speak any other language, much less a romance language.

    [​IMG]

    Whoa. You thought he was that good in Lincoln? I'm with you on Bill topping the list, but I'm surprised to see Lincoln that high. And what about John Proctor? For me, it's Bill, then Proctor, then Plainview. Initially, I was far less enamored with Bill and Proctor, but over time, his work as both of those characters continues to increase in my esteem whereas his work with Plainview is more of a what-you-see-is-what-you-get performance that I don't see as having as many layers.

    Is this what we're calling porn addicts now? If so, I'm on board.

    [​IMG]

    Did I miss the post with your review?

    Yeah, I watched it around when it premiered. I didn't love it but I think that it's worth watching for Cameron Britton's portrayal of Ed Kemper alone. Every scene with him is fucking gold.

    Have you seen it?
     
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  2. moreorless87

    moreorless87 First In The Phone Book

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    Yeah "anything can happen day" is a line I'v quioted to people in the past that's uniformly not been picked up on. ;)

    Generally I tend to view Angel Heart as Alan Parker looking to "do an Alien/Blade runner" like film. You could argue he's the closest contemporary to Ridley Scott and whilst the genres a bit different I think that combination of genre pick with atmosphere and subtle drama is there. Just how characterful and likable Rouke makes Harry Angel is I think a massive part of the films success along of course with the atmosphere of 50's Newyork and New Orleans.

    To get a little spoilery...

    I think its an interesting choice for the film(and maybe the book? haven't read it) NOT to introduce the idea of Harry Angels evil background slowly revealing itself in his character. Whilst he's obviously not whiter and white morally the film I'd say very much pushes you to root for him as he goes further down the rabbit hole. Seems like a bit of a comment on Christian ideas of original sin and long term moral judgement on criminals(decades after an offence) to me that he's carrying an undeserved but inescapable burden

    Honestly though I was never a massive viewer of films with more sexual content in the past beyond the likes of David Lynch, the odd French drama and of course the above because most of it simply wasn't very good, most obviously those endless cheesey sex thrillers in the 80's and 90's who's only existence seemed to be as a stand in for porn dispite rarely being very sexy. The last decade or so though I'd say your in a position were alot of the best cinema has had a strong sexual content to it, all of Lanthimos films, Aronofsky's more personal dramas(his best work IMHO) like the Wrestler and especially Black Swan, Under the Skin, Shame, Peter Strickland's last couple of films, Blue Is The Warmest Colour, Ex Machina, Nocturnal Animals, The Master, Blue Valentine, The Handmaiden, etc.

    Lets hope Warcraft hasn't ruined him as a director for good, Moon for me remains one of the best recent sci fi's and Source Code was very well done to from a concept that could have been rather hokey and sappy,

    You could argue I spose he's following Ridley Scott's career a little too closely with an excellent start follower by a vastly longer period as more of a hired hand.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2018
  3. theskza

    theskza Silver Belt

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    Damn lol I love that movie. It's probably in my top 10 for this decade. What part did you doze off and for how long?

    Maaaaan I wish I'd fallen asleep for the majority of TASM2. Still can't believe how terrible that movie was.
     
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  4. ufcfan4

    ufcfan4 Can't Andle The Riddum

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    Hahah. I fell asleep for about a fifteen minute stretch of Tintin. I think it was around the time they went into haddocks family backstory- if that’s even a thing maybe I’m making it up because I was dozing off after all.

    But even though it was a short stint I had that awful feeling during about a forty-five minute portion of the film where you’re trying to stay alert but it’s a losing battle. It was a very fun movie from what i saw though. Great chase scene in there. Had a very Indiana Jones-ish vibe to it.

    Amazing Spider-Man 2 was not just physical tiredness at play though. Had gone to a Kentucky derby party earlier that day at a friend’s place and she had some bushmills on hand lol. It’s not like I drank much but I’ve certainly learned that if I have even some alcohol before going into a dark theater on an already busy day, I’m going to sleep.

    Also I went back to see it for real a few days later. You’re going to hate me for this man but I actually enjoyed that movie. Which is more than I can say for its predecessor which I thought was redundant junk.
     
  5. PEB

    PEB Atomic Butt Drop Champ :)

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    SPACE THE FINAL FRONTIER :)
  6. Sigh GunRanger

    Sigh GunRanger You think anybody will notice?

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    Havent seen The Crucible



    Yesh i binged it in a couple days. Kemprr waas terrific. I couldnt get enough of him.


    I liked the show quite a bit. The highs were obviously with them dealing with the serial killers, and cops, and I hope theres more of that in the second season. I couldnt stand the relationship with the robotic actress, or the bitchy boss lady but the show was still overall really interesting.

    Ive never seen Hannibal but good news, it's on Prime, so thatll be next



    You need to get on Phantom Thread though
     
  7. Rimbaud82

    Rimbaud82 Brown Belt

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    Been slacking with my film watching these past few weeks. Went to see a 4K restoration of A Fistful of Dollars which was great, obviously, and which looked fantastic. Also saw:

    Western
    [​IMG]

    Despite the title it is in fact a a sparse, realist drama about German construction workers in rural Bulgaria. But it does use some western tropes - sweeping vistas, stranger arriving in town, posses driving around town, horse riding etc. as part of a look at industrialisation vs. pastoralism, masculinity, alienation, longing and the separation between different cultures. I really enjoyed, quite slow and ambiguous but really interesting.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2018
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  8. chickenluver

    chickenluver Bookmobile Driver

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    ^ is that you in the AV?
     
  9. Spawned_Fighter

    Spawned_Fighter nobody but me

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    brown and Rosenblum are my favorites.

    I don't like Hackman or Spacey, even worse was eisenberg. Really tough, get a charismatic presemce, but be cutthroat.

    Just finished my month-long binge of 10 seasons of Smallville
     
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  10. Trotsky

    Trotsky Social Capitalist / Capitalistic Communist

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    Yeah, Luther was butchered by both Spacey and Eisenberg.

    I always thought Billy Zane would be a good Lex Luther. You need to have a certain physical presence.

    [​IMG]
     
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  11. Rimbaud82

    Rimbaud82 Brown Belt

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    Oh nah I am a pasty white guy lol
     
  12. Dreaming Dead

    Dreaming Dead Black Belt

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    Can someone recommend me a good "financial" thriller?

    I love Margin Call, and would like to see more material in the same vein. The more tense, the better. Thanks in advance!
     
  13. europe1

    europe1 It´s a nice peninsula to Asia

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    Thought I'd gab about four classical films I saw.


    Watched The Bad and The Beautiful. Great movie with a real sleek wit and energy to the filmmaking. Perhaps Kirk Douglas best performance. Interesting way to make what is basically an anthology movie.

    As for the central moral question of the film (should Kirk be forgiven, with the arguments presented being that -- even though he betrayed, hurt and stole from them -- they owe their success to him) I'm firmly in the "screw him" camp. Yeah they may (partially) owe their success to him, but they would be even more successful -- no to mention happier -- if he didn't bury them to advance his own career. Except Dick Powell's character, I suppose, but he didn't want a career to begin with.

    Character-wise, some things seem odd about this movie. It feels weird that Lana Turner's character would be so psychologically stable after Kirk betrayed her -- especially considering it was him who saved her from the state of being constantly on the brink of suicide. For her to stay on the right path after a lifetime of depression after having experiencing such a trauma seems downright unrealistic.

    Her meltdown in the car was superb btw. Best scene in the movie. Like a viszualization of an emotional trauma.



    I also really liked how Dick Powell's storyline seemed to play with the censorship restriction of the day. On the surface level it seems like Powell's feud with Kirk is due to his wife dying in the planecrash -- but under the surface there is the specter of Kirk ordering his latin wingman to seduce her. "Squire a genuine virginian dame" is just a perfect euphemism, you know?:cool: Gloria Grahame was great btw, really impeccable comedic performance (and how often do you see a woman win an Oscar for a comedic performance anyways?)

    Another interesting dynamic was Kirk seeing himself as a self-made man, but a lot of his opportunities to stardome actually arose from his daddy-connections. No out-of-towner would have lost a high-stake card game and then received a producer-job at a studio, is all I'm saying.

    Lastly, I love the fact that when Kirk sets out to make a great and intelligent B-movie, he essentially ends up making Cat People.:D

    [​IMG]

    Moving on, I also watched A Walk in the Sun. Don't think I've ever seen a film entirely like this one before. Its just a story about one band of soldiers during WW2 and their mission to conquer a German-held farmhouse. What's special is that it's delivered with total realism and an absolute focus on the soldiers themselves (no cut-aways to high command, no suprise importance to what they're doing, no out-of-the-ordinary heroics, no nothing filmic like that, the camera barely leaves the soldiers at all). Hell, most of the movie is just the soldiers marching and bantering with one-another. I've heard that war has been described as "a lot of waiting around, being bored, with sudden outbursts of horrific violence". This movie really captures that.

    I think the closest movie I would relate A Walk in the Sun to would be the Sam Fuller WW2-piece, The Big Red One. But a Walk in the Sun is a lot less epic and episodic. Big Red One was like a "greatest-hits" rememberance of WW2, while A Walk in the Sun is just a snapshot.


    The Big Combo just oozed noir. Really sleek, striking, shadowy visuals. Richard Conte did a really good job portraying the villians cool, off-kiltered, go-getter menace. I especially love the part where he lies to his Mistress concerning the whereabouts of his actual wife. He says that she ran off with a bigger man, which -- you'd think -- just has to be the truth since something like that occuring is completely antithetical to everything he stands for as a character. It's so contridictory to everything you've seen of him that is has to be the truth. You feel like you're getting a window into the personal trauma that made him develop such an extreme personality. But nope! Its all a clever rouse! Conte is just such a manipulative sociopath that he knows saying something which so fundamentally goes against his principles is bound to be interpreted as the truth by those around him.:D


    In the Heat of the Night may have the GOAT slapping scene.

    [​IMG]

    Poitier doesn't even hesitate for a second -- he just slaps him right back!:D

    Also a very good-looking movie.

    Rod Steiger goes all method on his performance (as always). I also think its interesting that, as a movie about racism, Steiger's character is really quite racist (not to mention corrupt and unscrupulous as a police officer), However he is still clearly an improvement in comparison to the rest of the town. A lot of films that deal with racism is about making characters becoming less racist, this one seemed to be more about observing that some people may be less racists than others, and that such changes are more generational rather than personal.
     
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  14. Sigh GunRanger

    Sigh GunRanger You think anybody will notice?

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    Rush was interesting. Visually incredible, but I never connected with the characters. I was never bored but it always felts the movie was missing something until the last act. It would have been better to just excise everything but the race rivalry, and just keep it a visceral sports movie. The first half hour or so wasnt very good, and the narration was awful. Then the movie just focuses more on the racing and shines.



    @Bullitt68 Im loving Hannibal so far, but the network tv format forcing them to do serial killer of the week is slightly bugging me already
     
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  15. Bullitt68

    Bullitt68 Senior Moderator Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    I think it's more coincidental/zeitgeisty than Parker truly looking to do a Ridley Scott-like film. From Midnight Express through Birdy, Parker was already into really dark, slightly odd, and uncomfortable psychological character studies. Combine that with the return of noir throughout the '80s and you get stuff like Blade Runner and Angel Heart, two very different movies with a couple of thematic parallels and a shared noir atmosphere.

    In any case, I'm not a big Scott fan, so it's not difficult for me to say that Angel Heart is head-and-shoulders above anything Scott's ever done in that vein.

    Well, there's definitely some religious commentary in there. It's hard to avoid that in a movie about Satan. That said, I think the main thematic thread - which is the link to Blade Runner - is the examination of identity and memory ("I know who I am!"), which is bigger than religion. The two questions "Who am I?/How do I know?" anchor both films and both protagonists. And, speaking to the noir sensibility of both films, the two answers to those questions turn out to be "Not who you think/You don't."

    Again, though, I think Angel Heart is the more powerful examination of the two. The main reason for that is, as you said, Harry Angel is such a sympathetic character who you spend the whole movie rooting for, even up to - and after - the reveal. The reason I emphasize the "after" is because, unlike you, I wouldn't describe it as Harry's "evil background," and the reason is simple: Because it's not his evil background. The reason he's so sympathetic is because he's innocent. Sure, he's a Bogart-type who skirts common decency and is a bit sleazy, but he didn't commit any sins. Some asshole stole his soul and then Satan pulled that guy's "soul strings" and made a killer puppet out of him. That's where the original sin thing comes in: He didn't actually do anything, yet he accepts his unearned/undeserved guilt and rides that elevator down to Hell - smoking a cigarette like the doomed noir protagonist he is.

    Ayn Rand called original sin a "monstrous absurdity." If there exists a film that proves that, it's Angel Heart. In Atlas Shrugged, she wrote the following:

    "[Christianity] begins by damning man as evil, then demands that he practice a good which it defines as impossible for him to practice [...] It demands that he start, not with a standard of value, but with a standard of evil, which is himself, by means of which he is then to define the good: the good is that which he is not [...] A sin without volition is a slap at morality."

    She was describing the plight of Harry Angel three decades before Angel Heart :cool:

    BTW: europe, since you couldn't get the SMC in line to vote for Angel Heart, you can feel free to jump in here and get your Angel Heart rocks off in the SMD ;)

    QFT.

    [​IMG]

    You're in for a treat when you get around to that one. Superb script, top-notch cast, and a heart-wrenching performance from DDL.

    If you still haven't gotten enough, you should check out the real dude if you haven't already. Arguably the most fascinating yet relatively unknown serial killer of the 20th Century.




    It's up there with Dunkirk and Molly's Game now at the top of my to-do list for once I get back into the swing of watching new stuff.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Amazing movie, and yes, IMO that's Douglas' best work. I've always thought Champion was a tremendous, underrated performance of his, and then of course there's Lust for Life, but The Bad and the Beautiful is on another level.

    And it's also another reason to love True Blood:



    You're right about this, you're just wrong about which part makes it the best. Douglas' meltdown is where it's at. Similar to the way I relate to De Niro's Jake La Motta, there's definitely a justifiable "screw him" attitude given all the shit he pulled, but, for me, it's a sympathetic "screw him" in the sense that it's awful to watch someone act as their own destroyer. The way that Douglas barks "Get out!" is some of the most intense acting I've ever seen. Those barks are coming straight up from his blackened, tortured soul.

    Judy Holliday says you better recognize.

    [​IMG]

    (Granted, she shouldn't have taken the 1950 Best Actress Oscar for Born Yesterday from Bette Davis for All About Eve, but she should've gotten the 1949 Best Supporting Actress Oscar for Adam's Rib)

    Yep. Old-school intertextuality FTW.

    It's like you're asking for a Steve McQueen slap whooping.

    [​IMG]

    I'm glad you're digging it, but FYI, NBC didn't force Bryan Fuller to do anything. He had quite the free hand through all three seasons, and I think you'll see as you progress how different each season is and how the killer of the week format at the start is really just a springboard - and an incredibly inspired and endlessly nuanced springboard at that - and not a grudgingly-worn straitjacket.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2018
  16. KOQ24

    KOQ24 Gold Belt

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    I'm a big Fan of The Big Combo as well.

    In the Heat of the Night
    almost feels like an early Exploitation Film with Poitier & especially Steiger.
    I refused to watch it because i feared that it aged as badly as Guess who's coming to Dinner?, but i catched it n tv one day and it's a great Film.Poitier just has some great lines throughout the Film.

    I'm currently watching the whole Friday the 13th Series.
    I'm up to Part 8 now and Part 6 is head and shoulders above the rest with some quality Humor.
    Part 4 has to be watched just for Crispin Glover's dance.
     
  17. europe1

    europe1 It´s a nice peninsula to Asia

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    This sentence just reads like a clever rouse to make me admit that I haven't seen it (at least completely):oops:

    Hence why I was gunning so hard for it in the SMC.

    Well they do synergize nicely.

    N-e-e-d... t-o... w-a-t-c-h... The Getaway... now...

    Doubt it will beat the slapping scene in Heat though.

    You mean with the southern redneck vibes? Maybe so.

    Yeah the discussions about racism just feels so toothless in that movie when watched today.

    It's still good for it's "Spencer Tracy is dying" stick though. Those where some sad faces.

    Jason vs Carrie > Jason vs Tommy Jarvis: The Rematch.

    I was never really a fan of the Friday series though.
     
  18. moreorless87

    moreorless87 First In The Phone Book

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    Got around to watching Annihilation on netflicks, good performance by Portman and some interesting visuals in places but I must admit it came across rather as weirdness/creepiness for its own sake by the end rather than playing into the more human drama it seemed to be setting up.

    Is there some kind of government scheme where by production companys get a grant for casting Benedict Wong in sci fi films? not complaining really but he seems almost universal.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2018
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  19. KOQ24

    KOQ24 Gold Belt

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    He's Asian.
    Asians are good at Math
    Math is an important part of Science

    It's certainly more believable than 50 Cent as a Rocket Scientist
     
  20. moreorless87

    moreorless87 First In The Phone Book

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    I mean he's generally good in them but how many is that now? Sunshine, Moon, Prometheus, Blade Runner(well that promo film anyway), this and I notice his next film Gemini Man is sci fi as well plus indeed he was in those Channel 4 Philip K DIck TV adaptations recently, I spose you could argue he's good at delivering exposition when needed, the same with Doctor Strange. It is a little strange to see though as to a UK audience he was previously known mostly for TV comedy like 15 Stories High.



    I would still have Annihilation down as a little disappointing after Ex Machina, to me it felt like a higher budget X-files monster of the week episode, I mean Portman works with that selling scared/mess up very well but again I felt like it was laying the groundwork for there to be some kind of link between her background and the aliens that never really seemed to lead to anything beyond strangeness/bodyhorror for its own sake. The obvious comparison seems to be Under The Skin which I think managed to carry more depth and I think superior visuals/soundtrack, Annihilation in compriason does at points feel rather like unintentional parody for me with the same self importance falling short.

    I must admit I was surprised by Ex Machina's depth/intelligence, I'm certainly a fan of Garlands writing in 28 days Latter and Sunshine but they did always feel like rather pulpy genre pictures in the end. Annihlation to me felt like it might have been better off with Danny Boyles direction style playing it up more as a horror and less as such a serious sci fi.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2018

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