SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: Week 110: Zodiac

[minute bull]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but wasn't Allen excluded due to DNA evidence? Something about the DNA found on the envelope of one the Zodiac letters? Do I have that right?

If that's the case, I don't understand how that works. Okay, maybe Allen's DNA wasn't on the envelope, but isn't there a big difference between a letter and a dead body? Okay, if they said, "We ran the victim's body for saliva -- she's covered in it! Head to toe spackled. But get this: it's not Arthur Leigh Allen's saliva. We don't know whose it is."

"But did you check the envelope?"

"This could change everything."

 

[the muntjac]

It all goes back to his hatred of his mother. Ed Kemper was the same way, he hated his mother and she was one of the fist victims.

His mom and her friend were the last people he killed, and then he turned himself into the police. Experts, and even Kemper himself, theorize that all of his killings were leading up to his true desire, which was to kill his mother. And without having to go into the details about Ed Kemper, I'll just say that this guy makes Zodiac look like a saint.

Speaking of killers with mothers that screwed them up, look at Ed Gein. His mother was a strict, heavy-handed religious woman who chastised every thing Gein showed interest in. You know the Adam Sandler movie The Water Boy, and how his mother told him that everything was the Devil? This was Ed Gein's life. After his mom died is when he started digging up corpses and wearing them because he was naturally curious about sex, but he had no healthy understanding about it due to the way his mother raised him. Eventually, he wanted to know what it was like to be with a more alive woman, so that's when he set out and killed a couple women to become his play things. Sick shit.

 

[MusterX]

His mom and her friend were the last people he killed, and then he turned himself into the police. Experts, and even Kemper himself, theorize that all of his killings were leading up to his true desire, which was to kill his mother. And without having to go into the details about Ed Kemper, I'll just say that this guy makes Zodiac look like a saint.

Speaking of killers with mothers that screwed them up, look at Ed Gein. His mother was a strict, heavy-handed religious woman who chastised every thing Gein showed interest in. You know the Adam Sandler movie The Water Boy, and how his mother told him that everything was the Devil? This was Ed Gein's life. After his mom died is when he started digging up corpses and wearing them because he was naturally curious about sex, but he had no healthy understanding about it due to the way his mother raised him. Eventually, he wanted to know what it was like to be with a more alive woman, so that's when he set out and killed a couple women to become his play things. Sick shit.

Yea Kemper cut his mother head off, I remember he was really hateful toward her. It seems a good number of killers trace back to the relationship they had with their mother. Weird stuff. Kemper was crazy in the way that he would go to a bar that police frequented just to see if they talked about the murders. He was known by the local police as a nice guy. If you want to see evil face to face watch some of the interviews with Tommy Lynn Sells. That guy felt nothing, no fear, no remorse, no guilt, he says when you look at me, you are looking at hatred.

I was thinking about the number of serial killers active today, which as I said is kept quiet by the authorities these days. Check this out.

John Douglas, a former Chief of the FBI’s Elite Serial Crime Unit and author of “Mind Hunter” says, “A very conservative estimate is that there are between 35-50 active serial killers in the United States” at any given time.

35-50 is a conservative estimate.....conservative. Its more like 50-100 that are active and killing right now. If you are in a major city, trust me, there is a killer like Bundy active and killing near you. The local police won't say a word to the public though.

 

[MusterX]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but wasn't Allen excluded due to DNA evidence? Something about the DNA found on the envelope of one the Zodiac letters? Do I have that right?

If that's the case, I don't understand how that works. Okay, maybe Allen's DNA wasn't on the envelope, but isn't there a big difference between a letter and a dead body? Okay, if they said, "We ran the victim's body for saliva -- she's covered in it! Head to toe spackled. But get this: it's not Arthur Leigh Allen's saliva. We don't know whose it is."

"But did you check the envelope?"

"This could change everything."

Yes DNA from the letter was not Allen's, but we don't know whose DNA that is and it was taken long before DNA testing was ever used. There is a dump truck full of evidence against Allen but it could all be deemed coincidental shit. Either he was the Zodiac or the unluckiest guy ever.

 

[Kingz]

One of my favorite movies of all time. I’ve seen it countless times and I’m not usually a fan of procedure movies but it’s amazing how they kept the suspense for 2 hours 45 minutes. I had a prior interest in the Zodiac killer and American true crime before so this film was like the holy grail. It’s also amazing how I never hear people call it boring. Even people who normally crap on long and deliberately paced movies. People tend to like Zodiac if they watch it.


I was a bit disappointed to learn how heavily Fincher relied on digital. I heard something like 90 percent of the movie had digital sets. Not saying that’s all bad. The TransAmerica building time lapse is amazing but I had originally thought some of the older crime scenes(Washington and Cherry) were legit shot on location. It’s a beautiful movie otherwise. It was definetly one of the shining examples of digital.

The companion documentary “This is the Zodiac speaking” is also pure gold.

Would you say this film resurrected Robert Downey Jr’s career?

It’s good when a real movie is made about true crime. The other serial killer movies are alright but too half hearted. I thought Gein and Dahmer were good ones with good lead performances but as far as true crime nothing touches Zodiac. Probably because of the mystery.

 

[MusterX]

@Secret Agent check this out, its a list of "circumstantial" evidence for Arthur Leigh Allen being the Zodiac. As I said, he is either the Zodiac, or the unluckiest MF'er ever.

• Allen communicated to his friend Don Cheney (through the premise of writing a novel) the following ideas:
  • He would like to kill couples at random.
  • He would taunt the police with letters detailing his crimes.
  • He would sign the letters with the cross-circle symbol from his watch.
  • He would call himself "Zodiac."
  • He would wear make-up to change his appearance.
  • He would attach a flashlight to the barrel of his gun in order to shoot at night.
  • He would fool women into stopping their cars in rural areas by claiming they had problems with their tires, then loosen their lug nuts and eventually take them captive.[1]
• In 1992, surviving victim Mike Mageau picked Allen out of a police lineup.
• Surviving victim Bryan Hartnell identified his voice and physical appearance as being similar to the Zodiac.
• Allen lived in Vallejo near the Blue Rock Springs and Lake Herman Road murders.
• Allen was allegedly in Riverside on the weekend when Cheri Jo Bates was murdered. He later claimed to be in Pomona when he heard of Bates' murder.
• Allen took his only sick day of the year on Nov.1, 1966 (Bates was murdered on Oct. 30, 1966).
• The Vallejo Police Department seized a Royal typewriter with Elite type from Allen's home, which is the brand of typewriter used to write the Bates' letters.
  • Note: To date, the typewriter has not been compared to the Bates letters.
• Received a Zodiac watch from his mother for Christmas in 1967, according to his brother. Allen estimated receiving the watch in 1969.
• Allen communicated to his friend Philip that he was fascinated with the idea of killing people. He believed that people were more challenging to kill than animals since they were more intelligent. Similar sentiments were communicated during the three-part cipher mailed to newspapers. Allen also mentioned to the police that his favorite book was The Most Dangerous Game, a book about killing humans and possibly alluded to in a Zodiac correspondence.
• Mageau described a brown Corvair at the Blue Rock Springs scene. Allen's friend, Philip, owned a brown Corvair that Allen was allowed to use.
• Allen told friend Don Cheney that he was fond of a waitress at the International House of Pancakes in Vallejo, the place where Darlene Ferrin worked as a waitress.
• An unidentified man named "Lee" was known to associate with Ferrin, and Allen frequently went by his middle name.
• Told police he was going up to Berryessa on the day of the Hartnell/Shepard attack, but decided to go up the coast instead.
• Allen admitted to possessing bloody knives on the day of the Berryessa attack, claiming that he used them to kill chickens.
• Cheney mentioned to Ron Allen that Arthur had two .22 caliber weapons.
• Zodiac is frequently theorized as having military ties, and Allen was at one time a sail maker in the navy.
• Allen wore size 10.5 shoes, similar to those left at the crime scene.
• In 1991, a nemesis of Allen's named Ralph Spinelli told police that Allen admitted to being the Zodiac and that he would prove it by going to San Francisco and "killing a cabbie."
• In 1991, the search warrant for Allen's house found bomb diagrams and the same ingredients for bombs that were mentioned in a previous Zodiac letter.
• Karen Allen, his sister-in-law, stated that Allen would use the shortened "trigger mech" in place of "trigger mechanism," as well as spelling Christmas with two S's. Both idiocyncracies appear in the Zodiac letter to Melvin Belli.
• Karen also stated that he was taught to write right-handed as a child, even though he was left-handed.
• Allen claimed to have consulted with Melvin Belli, an attorney mentioned by name in the Zodiac letters.

http://zodiackiller.wikia.com/wiki/Arthur_Leigh_Allen

 

[minute bull]

DNA envelope is such #1 bullshit guy.

 

[the muntjac]

Manhunter is good, I'm looking forward to Season 2. You are correct that the profilers didn't come along until the late 70's but there are as many serial killers now if not more than then. One main difference is that in the 60's, 70's, and even 80's, the authorities would tell the public there was a serial killer on the loose but then at some point they decided that they didn't want to alarm the public anymore so they keep it quiet most of the time. The only time you hear about one most of the time is after they are captured. Current estimates are that there is at least 1 active serial killer in every major city in America, meaning that right now, in your city there is one or more serial killers killing, you just don't hear about it bro. Right now there are probably 50-100 serial killers that are active in America alone. People don't want to think about that but its true. They are still around and there are a lot of them. Its likely there is a serial killer within 50 miles of you right now.

There was some wild theory going around here in Pittsburgh a couple years back, it's probably still going today, that there was a serial killer throwing people off bridges late at night and drowning them. There are two separate instances that happened a few years apart where a early 20's male was walking home after being at a bar, and while crossing a bridge, somehow they wound up over the side, and their bodies were found later washed up months later. Somehow, people have gotten it into their heads that it was the work of a serial killer. I don't buy it. I think it was the result of being intoxicated, doing something against better judgement, like say trying to lean too far over the railing, or even sitting on it, and then accidentally falling into the river and drowning. I'd actually be real surprised if there was any kind of serial killer at large in the city of Pittsburgh.

I remember the latest serial killer story that I remember that was gaining traction from the media was this guy going around in Tampa and shooting random people. He worked at a McDonald's and got caught after handing a co-worker a bag with the gun in it and told her to hang on to it. Naturally, she opened it, and then called the police.

http://abc7chicago.com/tampa-serial...rged;-finding-gun-was-key-police-say/2711485/

 

[the muntjac]

Yea Kemper cut his mother head off, I remember he was really hateful toward her. It seems a good number of killers trace back to the relationship they had with their mother. Weird stuff. Kemper was crazy in the way that he would go to a bar that police frequented just to see if they talked about the murders. He was known by the local police as a nice guy. If you want to see evil face to face watch some of the interviews with Tommy Lynn Sells. That guy felt nothing, no fear, no remorse, no guilt, he says when you look at me, you are looking at hatred.

I was thinking about the number of serial killers active today, which as I said is kept quiet by the authorities these days. Check this out.

John Douglas, a former Chief of the FBI’s Elite Serial Crime Unit and author of “Mind Hunter” says, “A very conservative estimate is that there are between 35-50 active serial killers in the United States” at any given time.

35-50 is a conservative estimate.....conservative. Its more like 50-100 that are active and killing right now. If you are in a major city, trust me, there is a killer like Bundy active and killing near you. The local police won't say a word to the public though.

Ya know, I've probably gone to a sporting event or concert where there are thousands of people in attendance, and at least one person there has to have at least murdered or raped somebody. Those are some big sample sizes to not have at least one sicko mixed in with the rest of us.

 

[MusterX]

I'd actually be real surprised if there was any kind of serial killer at large in the city of Pittsburgh.

The F.B.I. disagrees. The authorities keep it quiet now. There is one or more active serial killers in every major city in America. Pittsburgh is not exempt. Your local nightly news keeps their mouth shut now, that is if they even catch on to it. So unless you were a witness to it, you would never know one was in your city. They will NOT tell you.

Check out some of these numbers from some of the states taken from the FBI.

Oklahoma
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 5.86
Total no. of serial killings: 174

Texas
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 6.11
Total no. of serial killings: 793

Louisiana
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.35
Total no. of serial killings: 276

Oregon
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.36
Total no. of serial killings: 162

Washington
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.44
Total no. of serial killings: 277

California
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.81
Total no. of serial killings: 1507

Florida
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 9.92
Total no. of serial killings: 778

They are everywhere. The numbers for those states above are only the ones confirmed, there are certainly more that have not been caught yet and confirmed.

 

[the muntjac]

@Secret Agent check this out, its a list of "circumstantial" evidence for Arthur Leigh Allen being the Zodiac. As I said, he is either the Zodiac, or the unluckiest MF'er ever.

• He would fool women into stopping their cars in rural areas by claiming they had problems with their tires, then loosen their lug nuts and eventually take them captive.[1]

Now this is intriguing. Hmm, this kinda turns what I was saying earlier upside down on its head. However, the fact still remains that Johns changed her story many times and made it more sinister. It's hard to say who she really got into a car with that night.

 

[MusterX]

Now this is intriguing. Hmm, this kinda turns what I was saying earlier upside down on its head. However, the fact still remains that Johns changed her story many times and made it more sinister. It's hard to say who she really got into a car with that night.

Could have just been exaggeration or an outright fabrication. There is a mental illness where people seek attention in bizarre ways. Its kinda like how many serial killers will have say 20 confirmed killed but will claim to kill 70. They want to make it bigger than it actually is.

 

[the muntjac]

The F.B.I. disagrees. The authorities keep it quiet now. There is one or more active serial killers in every major city in America. Pittsburgh is not exempt. Your local nightly news keeps their mouth shut now, that is if they even catch on to it. So unless you were a witness to it, you would never know one was in your city. They will NOT tell you.

Check out some of these numbers from some of the states taken from the FBI.

Oklahoma
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 5.86
Total no. of serial killings: 174

Texas
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 6.11
Total no. of serial killings: 793

Louisiana
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.35
Total no. of serial killings: 276

Oregon
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.36
Total no. of serial killings: 162

Washington
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.44
Total no. of serial killings: 277

California
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 7.81
Total no. of serial killings: 1507

Florida
Adjusted number of serial killings per 1 million: 9.92
Total no. of serial killings: 778

They are everywhere. The numbers for those states above are only the ones confirmed, there are certainly more that have not been caught yet and confirmed.

Okay, now you just made me go look up the homicide rate of Pittsburgh so far this year, which is at 43. There's a website ran by the Post Gazette, which is the biggest newspaper here, that provides links to all of the homicides, and now I'm almost tempted to go through them all to see if I can notice a pattern.

 

[MusterX]

Okay, now you just made me go look up the homicide rate of Pittsburgh so far this year, which is at 43. There's a website ran by the Post Gazette, which is the biggest newspaper here, that provides links to all of the homicides, and now I'm almost tempted to go through them all to see if I can notice a pattern.

Bro, if there is 43 just for this year then there is almost definitely a serial killer on the loose, or two. And the number 43 would be a conservative estimate because there will be more that are not known about.

 

[minute bull]

​

 

[Kingz]

I remember seeing the poster for this at the movie theater and being like, "Whoa! What is this? This looks cool," but then I saw the trailer and was like, "Ah, nevermind."



I'm ready for 'em.

Indeed. This movie does do a great job at informing somebody who might know nothing about the Zodiac Killer story. It might be a little difficult to keep up with all of the names and locations thrown around, but I think the movies serves as a good jumping off point to then go and read up about the case. Compare this movie with say Spike Lee's Summer of Sam movie about David Berkowitz, and David Fincher's Zodiac blows it out of the water. I remember watching Summer of Sam when it came out, and I hated it. It deals little with the story of Berkowitz and instead follows around the troubled sex-lives of a couple, and something to do with thinking one of their friends is the killer. I honestly don't remember much about it, and maybe I should revisit it to give it a second shot, but I thought the movie sucked.



Yeah, I didn't really care for Social Network either. I actually laughed at the thought of there being a movie about Facebook. I guess I should reiterate that I was more praising David Fincher's techniques of pacing. Just imagine if that movie played out in a linear fashion. People would quickly realize how boring that story really is.



I think he wanted them to be solved, and I don't think any of them would have exposed who he was. It was just a way to taunt police and the media while being a nuisance at the same time by making them sit around and try to solve his dumb riddles. I think his unsolved codes would have been just more of, "I like to kill/me so scary/derp derp derp."



I like how she notices there is somebody approaching before the audience even sees him. In most scary movies, the audience is clued in that there is a evil presence lurking around before the victim characters know of it, but here, we see her face react to seeing him and saying, "There's somebody else here." The boyfriend cracks wise, and they continue their little getaway. Then the audience sees the Zodiac approaching in a hood, and she freaks out and says, "He has a gun!" Like I said earlier, there's no music cues, no annoying ramped up jump-scare effects, the scene just lets the terror of the situation carry the load. Even when Zodiac abruptly starts stabbing them, there's still no music cues. It's just the stabbing sounds, and the screams of the victims. This scene is so good that it's scary.

But it's also dreadful to think about how this happened to two random people who happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time. There's times when my wife and I go camping and then this scene will pop into my head, and I get the chills.



If I can find it, I'll share it on here. The police report the surviving guy gives is very detailed, and he acts very calm throughout the entire ordeal. Later, the Zodiac sends a taunting letter to the police about how he stabbed this couple at a lake, and that the guy was crying and begging for his life. I tend to believe the survivor's tale of his own demeanor because I think Zodiac was just trying to come off as macho.



The part with the guy stopping her, "fixing" her wheel, and then luring her into his car are all true. Her car was later found torched, so whoever this guy was, he was up to something nefarious. People speculate that he lost his nerve to attack her when he realized she had a baby with her, and that's why he just drove around for over an hour. The part of this story that comes into contention is whether it was really the Zodiac Killer or not. I tend to believe it wasn't just because of the way she ramped up her story in later renditions after she saw the picture of the Zodiac sketch hanging on the police wall.



Yeah, I would have been fine if they would have shown the detectives being more skeptical of her story, or just added in the information that she constantly changed her story. The movie does show us how the Zodiac most likely took credit for it by comparing his letter to a newspaper article, but then they just drop it right there. That still doesn't change the fact that the movie just showed us a scene where a guy says to a woman he just picked up after sabotaging her car, "After I kill you, I'm going to throw your baby out of the window." Now the audience is going to believe that this really happened, and it was definitely the Zodiac.

The movie omits a murder scene that happened seven months before the scene we see in the beginning where he shoots the teenagers in the car. They referred to this omitted scene in the movie as the "Christmas" couple. These people were also a couple of young teenage lovers who also get shot in their car in much the same fashion as the Fourth of July couple. However, both of the Christmas couple died, so there wasn't a survivor to give any details. This is why Fincher omits this scene because he wanted the movie to be as factual as possible. Yet, then we get the hitchhiker/baby-window scene which is most likely fabricated and has nothing to do with Zodiac. Like you said, I would have rather they omitted this scene altogether. Or redo it in a way that reflected her first telling of the story, and then later showed how she changed her story. It just bugs me because the reason the scene was put in was completely for the shock/movie-entertainment factor. So much for sticking to the facts, eh?



Manhunter is such a damn good movie.



I'm so bad at puzzles that this guy could be stabbing me in the chest while I was trying to solve his codes, and I'd still fail.



Do you watch Mindhunter at all on Netflix? That pretty much gives you your answer. There wasn't a thorough national crime database, an understanding of how serial killers think, or even the term "serial killer" until a couple of FBI agents made it all possible in the late 70s. Once the FBI were able to track serial killers better, it became harder for these types to exist. Plus with the developments of DNA testing, it's harder and harder to get away with crimes. Nowadays, it's all mass murders with guns. Well, at least in America. It's crazy to think that some asshole student in Florida killed the same amount of people as the Zodiac, Son of Sam, and the Manson Family combined in probably the span of 10-15 minutes.

In regards to Summer of Sam, it’s a good movie. It’s almost impossible to do a Son of Sam movie without including everything else going on in NYC at the time. Heat wave, World Series, power outage and ensuing riots, studio 54 and disco, the rise of the punk scene. It’s considered a fairly landmark year in New York. Son of Sam was just another big apple story. The series Bronx Is Burning(about Reggie Jackson and Billy Martin) took a similar approach to Summer of Sam and Son of Sam was a side story in that.

When I first saw Summer of Sam I was disappointed that it wasn’t really about the Son of Sam anymore than it was about any of those other things.

However, you realize it tells basically all there is to tell about Berkowitz. For a guy who has been captured fir decades, authored books(I believe) and supposedly reformed there is really not that much known about Berkowitz. The main reason is that he’s completely full of shit and was never straight with anybody about his story or motivations. So for all we know, Berkowitz was just a slob in a grungy apartment who just rocked back and forth complaining about a barking dog. Summer of Sam covers just about all there is to cover.

For a more comprehensive Berkowitz film you would likely have to get into theory. Because the big thing that hovered over the Son of Sam killings was Satanism and if Berkowitz was part of a cult. That’s not really Spike Lees style though.

I think Summer of Sam is probably the best narrative for a Son of Sam adaption.

The big problem with it is of course Spike Lees obsession with stereotyping Italian Americans as stupid clowns and his obvious lack of knowledge of scenes such as CBGBs.

Other than that, Summer of Sam has a great atmosphere.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Loved this book way back in the day and was psyched to see it become a film. Really didn't like it much upon first viewing when it came out. That's why I voted for it here. Hoping to enjoy it more, since the book is one of the scariest things I've ever read. Happy to say I did enjoy it quite a bit more. I still don't think it approaches the creepiness and intensity of the book and think I have a better idea why. The movie seems more about Graysmith than Zodiac. The film also glosses over the taunting letters and ciphers to an extent that I think it somewhat robs the film of what should be the central character. Overall though it's a very faithful adaptation.

The scariest scenes from the book were three. Two of which made the film (Graysmith in the guy's basement and when he visits Allen at the hardware store). There was another scene where Graysmith was at one of the locations and noticed a vehicle on the other side of the park (or whatever it was) facing him. He went over to that side and the same vehicle was then in his previous spot. Still gives me the willies.

Graysmith sure liked Allen and the film pretty much leaves you convinced it's him. Obviously that's up for debate. Part of me wonders if the mountain of circumstantial evidence is partly from ALA following the case and sort of draping himself in it. Sure, the one witness/victim ID's him. But if you watch an interview with that guy he comes off as somewhere between not-credible and retarded. Hartnell (the stabbing survivor) said it wasn't him. The cops that supposedly saw Z after the Stein murder says it wasn't him. Physical descriptions don't match. And there's other suspects where you can add up circumstance and coincidence that also look pretty good in a vacuum.

http://zodiackillersite.com/viewforum.php?f=38

Personally I've been hoping it was Ted Kazynski. There's quit a bit of stuff that adds up in his case. I wouldn't put money on any of the main suspects being the guy, but if I had to pick one it's Ted. His Unabomber crimes can easily be seen as a continuation/evolution of the same disturbed mind. Handwriting looks pretty close too.

 

[europe1]

Hitler was able to mesmerize a nation with his oration skills

With Hitler, I think it had more to do with his audience than some inherent persuasion skill on his part. People were primed for the message.

Let's remember, plenty of people during his rise to power mocked his speeches, partly due to his wonky Austrian accent (which is kind of werird to have when you're talking about German ultra-nationalism).

People were desperate for easy-answers. Germany was a fertile breeding-ground for fascism at that time period. The communists and other extremist groups where having their boom-period just as the Nazis were, highlighting this. Hitler was a symptom of the problem, not the cause of it, which was societal in nature.

Not saying he wasn't persuasive though, just that the impetus laid more on his surroundings.

I remember seeing the poster for this at the movie theater and being like, "Whoa! What is this? This looks cool," but then I saw the trailer and was like, "Ah, nevermind."

That movie is hysterically bad. I had so many laughs watching it. Like... the movie doesn't even understand how ice works!

On the top side, it does display how weird and idiosyncratic Norwegian interior decorating is. Huge, HUGE windows everywhere -- and they even have windows INSIDE the building, on walls that don't even face the outside. I don't even know if that's accurate or not.

There's times when my wife and I go camping and then this scene will pop into my head, and I get the chills.

This just seems like ripe material for a prank.

Do you watch Mindhunter at all on Netflix?

Don't watch series. They take up time that I could spend watching movies.

The F.B.I. disagrees. The authorities keep it quiet now. There is one or more active serial killers in every major city in America. Pittsburgh is not exempt. Your local nightly news keeps their mouth shut now, that is if they even catch on to it. So unless you were a witness to it, you would never know one was in your city. They will NOT tell you.

Interesting. Sensational serial killers are TV-rating darlings. The media would have to work against its natural instincts pretty thoroughly to not report on that.

 

[MusterX]

Interesting. Sensational serial killers are TV-rating darlings. The media would have to work against its natural instincts pretty thoroughly to not report on that.

There was a change in ideology somewhere along the line and the F.B.I. and local police stopped talking about them. The only time you really hear about one is if he's captured. The original Night Stalker most recently, who was killing from 1974-86, and before him BTK who did most of his killing in the 70's and 80's, both captured. We knew about them because they were killing back when this stuff was on the nightly news. Now, not so much. Either the police are telling them not to run stories on serial killers for certain cases or the murders are being kept under the rug so that the local news isn't fast enough to catch up to a crime scene. There are most certainly dozens of active serial killers in America alone, this according to the F.B.I., but I can't tell you the last time I heard a public warning about one.

 

[MusterX]

There was another scene where Graysmith was at one of the locations and noticed a vehicle on the other side of the park (or whatever it was) facing him. He went over to that side and the same vehicle was then in his previous spot.

I was zoning out or something while reading that and had to go back and start the sentence over. Then I realized what you were saying...

Personally I've been hoping it was Ted Kazynski. There's quit a bit of stuff that adds up in his case. I wouldn't put money on any of the main suspects being the guy, but if I had to pick one it's Ted. His Unabomber crimes can easily be seen as a continuation/evolution of the same disturbed mind. Handwriting looks pretty close too.

If that were true it would make Ted the GOAT for having not one but two serial killer careers under two different names. The "thank you" at the end really bothers me somewhat. The T's in both intersect the h's, the a's are formed in a similar way, as are the k's and y's.