Strenght vs. Technique

A couple of points come to mind.

First I believe that everyone should have a strength and conditioning component to compliment their bjj. I don't think guys realize how silly their excuses sound as to why they don't lift/run with their bjj

Your belt level is about technical or artistic knowledge. If you tap someone higher, great..but sometimes those taps come from a matchup issue as opposed to technique.
 
Quebec Nick said:
Belts are not perfect but when it's based on knowledge, technique and dedication it's at least based on something solid.
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Nothing more solid than competition wins. Never met someone who doesn't compete and win that actually has solid technique.
 
If you are tapping out purple belts then your level of knowledge is at least purple belt level. If your level of knowledge is really white belt level and you are tapping purples then those are sorry ass purples.
 
No you could just have a couple of techniques that you do really well naturally.
 
Its more awkward watching a blue belt take out a bunch of brown belts and black belts. I dont think many people take into account competitive skills when assessing belt level.
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That sounds less like failing to take "competitive skills into account", and more like sandbagging. You've really seen a single blue belt go through multiple browns and blacks? I've occasionally seen it where a blue belt who is young, trains every day and competes all the time beats up on an older black belt who's more of a hobbyist and doesn't train much anymore, but I can't recall a scenario where a blue belt beats up a series of browns/blacks.
 
Dirty Holt said:
Its more awkward watching a blue belt take out a bunch of brown belts and black belts. I dont think many people take into account competitive skills when assessing belt level.
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If you get a belt just on beating people with strength not skill do you have to give it back when you get of steroids?
 
3 times a week is a good average.

Unless your the lucky few who gets to train 7 times a week, multiple times a day....3 days a week with your s & c means your learning at a good pace.

I'm lucky if I get to train 3 times a week. When I was able to I felt sharp.
 
rmongler said:
Why would you not focus on what you're good at.
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I think at some point you stall out. That works for competition to go to what your good at to win. But in the gym that sort of holds you back.

I'm just a low level blue but there is a purple at my gym who is stalling out because he does the same 3 submissions most of the time. Guys from his era just got their brown belts and new purple belts have a much more dynamic game than he does. And this guy is in good shape and has good size to him so there is no excuse for him to not expand his game more.

Even my coach said he is not in the same group as those guys who got their brown even though he trained just as long as them.
 
yetanother said:
If you get a belt just on beating people with strength not skill do you have to give it back when you get of steroids?
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No, you should have to give up your black belt if you cannot beat someone with no skill and only strength, because you have just proven the point that either weightlifting is a superior martial art than BJJ, the blue deserves a higher ranking, or you dont have black belt level skills.
 
You just have to make the decision not to rely on strength when you role. RELY being the key word.

When I roll, especially with smaller people, I try to let them over power me. This forces me to have sound technique and my game doesn't fall apart against bigger people.
 
2008 said:
I think at some point you stall out. That works for competition to go to what your good at to win. But in the gym that sort of holds you back.

I'm just a low level blue but there is a purple at my gym who is stalling out because he does the same 3 submissions most of the time. Guys from his era just got their brown belts and new purple belts have a much more dynamic game than he does. And this guy is in good shape and has good size to him so there is no excuse for him to not expand his game more.

Even my coach said he is not in the same group as those guys who got their brown even though he trained just as long as them.
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I'd give you the same answer i gave to the other guy who raised the same point (however many months ago), which is that, irrespective of ones opinion on neophyte pedagogy, guys at the highest level (particularly guys who beat other guys at the highest level and take home medals) do infact specialize in 'core competencies' they revolve their game around (ie, being really good at moving the action into their core competency).

So, the slightly more nuanced question of what is it that happens between when you start life as a grappling caterpillar and when you step onto butterfly belt worlds is something that few (in these debates) seem to really think about.
 
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rmongler said:
I'd give you the same answer i gave to the other guy who raised the same point (however many months ago), which is that, irrespective of ones opinion on neophyte pedagogy, guys at the highest level (particularly guys who beat other guys at the highest level and take home medals) do infact specialize in 'core competencies' they revolve their game around (ie, being really good at moving the action into their core competency).

So, the slightly more nuanced question of what is it that happens between when you start life as a grappling caterpillar and when you step onto butterfly belt worlds is something that few (in these debates) seem to really think about, leading to much a-talking past.
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Once you become an experienced and competent grappler you develop your own style, I get that. You end up relying on your favorite moves in a tournament setting. You don't experiment with so so moves in hopes of winning against other guys at your level. You use your 'A game'.

But an experienced purple belt with 10 years of training shouldn't rely on the same 3 moves he uses against top level competition(to him) against six months white belts who aren't world beaters.

I imagine that be the time to work on other techniques to develop a more complete game.
 
2008 said:
Once you become an experienced and competent grappler you develop your own style, I get that. You end up relying on your favorite moves in a tournament setting. You don't experiment with so so moves in hopes of winning against other guys at your level. You use your 'A game'.

But an experienced purple belt with 10 years of training shouldn't rely on the same 3 moves he uses against top level competition(to him) against six months white belts who aren't world beaters.

I imagine that be the time to work on other techniques to develop a more complete game.
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What it really tells me is that he should get a better same 3 moves.
 
2008 said:
Once you become an experienced and competent grappler you develop your own style, I get that. You end up relying on your favorite moves in a tournament setting. You don't experiment with so so moves in hopes of winning against other guys at your level. You use your 'A game'.

But an experienced purple belt with 10 years of training shouldn't rely on the same 3 moves he uses against top level competition(to him) against six months white belts who aren't world beaters.

I imagine that be the time to work on other techniques to develop a more complete game.
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In judo as a brown and even as a blue in BJJ, lower belts are great for trying out new or different techniques.

LEARN New tech with lower belts
PERFECT/PRACTICE Tech with peers
GET TOUGH with higher belts
 
Strength is important factor, such as speed,mobility, flexibility, and natural gas tank.

However these should be amplified by your technique. Your jiu jitsu should amplify your physical attributes, not rely on them.
 
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DaGenius said:
A couple of points come to mind.

First I believe that everyone should have a strength and conditioning component to compliment their bjj. I don't think guys realize how silly their excuses sound as to why they don't lift/run with their bjj

Your belt level is about technical or artistic knowledge. If you tap someone higher, great..but sometimes those taps come from a matchup issue as opposed to technique.
Click to expand...

Everybody? Most guys are doing bjj for fun and don't find weight training fun.

It's sillier to think everybody should take it as serious as that. Flat out most people don't. Hell most guys who say they are "competitors" half was it compared to people who compete in mainstream sports with the goal of being world class.
 
berimBOWLoh said:
Everybody? Most guys are doing bjj for fun and don't find weight training fun.

It's sillier to think everybody should take it as serious as that. Flat out most people don't. Hell most guys who say they are "competitors" half was it compared to people who compete in mainstream sports with the goal of being world class.
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I think you’re trying to make an argument where there isn’t one that matters. To oversimplify my point, I believe everyone should be as fit as they can be. Period. That’s all man. If you don’t feel that way, no problem
 
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