Two police officers shot after serving warrant on wrong address

[InternetHero]

LOL, this case is amazing. No more of this horseshit about not being able to shoot cops making a mistake without facing charges.

I'm really happy the cops didn't die as a result of their mistake, but I'm even happier they didn't injure the homeowner. This guy sounds like an amazing American, btw:

What a stud. Defended his life, family, and property, but didn't hold a grudge, and immediately identified the mistake. That's what gave him the best chance to survive. His behavior couldn't have been more perfect.

This is the demeanor to adopt in these situations. Pay attention, cop-haters.

He does sound like a really good man.

Capable to defend himself and his family, but caring enough to help those who made a sad mistake.

Calm in the face of something that most of us would falter over, I'm sure I would, and yet hope we can all learn to have that kind of foresight, courage, and kindness.

 

[Fawlty]

We should be careful praising what the guy did as exceptional, if we're going to expect others to equal his response.

After all, it's exceptional. The normal case is a dead father (blameless victim), or a dead kid (blameless victim), or a dead cop.

 

[My2Cents]

Don’t they yell that they are police??

 

[7437]

Don’t they yell that they are police??

do criminals not yell that?

 

[cincymma79]

LoL

In before someone says what a dangerous job cops have, which after some research I found out not to be true. Hell your local garbage man's job is much more dangerous than that of a cop

They aren’t getting killed more because of these policies and procedures. Why do you think they put them in place? Shark bite suits keep you from getting killed by sharks. Is that shit safe now?

 

[nac386]

LOL, this case is amazing. No more of this horseshit about not being able to shoot cops making a mistake without facing charges.

I'm really happy the cops didn't die as a result of their mistake, but I'm even happier they didn't injure the homeowner. This guy sounds like an amazing American, btw:

What a stud. Defended his life, family, and property, but didn't hold a grudge, and immediately identified the mistake. That's what gave him the best chance to survive. His behavior couldn't have been more perfect.

This is the demeanor to adopt in these situations. Pay attention, cop-haters.

This just sounds like a normal reaction to me. Who wouldn't defend their home, and who wouldn't feel bad when they realize they made a mistake? He seems to have responded how the vast majority of people would. The real story here to me is that the police department handled it well afterwards.

 

[CauseImbetta]

Bullshit. That's exactly what they want you to think.. But there is no evidence !!

Give me a cop-free day any day.

Look at all the riots and looting when cops didn't enter certain areas in Los Angeles. Also gangs take a stronger foot hold.

 

[Prefect]

Oh, here we go again with this stupid list of dangerous jobs. Garbage men are injured at a rate of 53 injuries per 100 workers; and killed at 55/100,000 workers. The majority of injuries are back and muscle strains from lifting heavy bags and cuts from broken glass. The deaths are almost exclusively from accidents. The garbage truck involved in an accident and the guys on the back are thrown from the vehicle, or a vehicle tries to go around the garbage truck and hits one of the guys loading trash. There are around 110,000 garbage collectors in the US.

This is in no way comparable to the danger of someone purposely trying to kill police officers. The rate of injury for officers is 458 per 10,000 workers, or about 45 per 100, close to the 52/100 for garbage workers. The death rate for officers is about 15 per 100,000, but there are ten times as many police officers which would drive that rate way down.

The causes of the majority of police officers killed in the line of duty can vary from year to year. One year; the highest deaths are due to traffic accidents, same as garbage men; but there are other years where accidents only account for 40% and 55% is due To murder and animal attacks; with usually less than 5% due to heart attacks or other health causes, such as fire.

Either way, there is an enormous difference between fearing that you may strain a muscle lifting stuff, get cut, or the worst injuries are due to moving motor vehicle accidents. How is that comparable to having people attack officerwn. No way is waiting for a possible accident worse than someone trying to kill you.

There are a lot of jobs that have higher death rates on the job than cops. Law enforement is 14th on the list of most fatal jobs.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1002500001

 

[Prefect]

Bullshit. That's exactly what they want you to think.. But there is no evidence !!

Give me a cop-free day any day.

Cops show up after something has happened almost everytime. There really isn't much to stop someone from doing something. 99% of the population just does the right thing.

 

[freakroor]

Look at all the riots and looting when cops didn't enter certain areas in Los Angeles. Also gangs take a stronger foot hold.

Bad example. The riots were a reaction to over-policing. the police caused that crime spree.

I currently live about 30minutes from the nearest police station, but there is very little crime at all in my area.

Once again there is no evidence to support the idea that cops prevent crime. ... we certainly still have rampant crime in america, despite there being at least a million LEO's

 

[Greoric]

@nhbbear is a sensible guy, and in a pretty elevated leadership position within his Dept, so I want his .02 on calling out "Police! Search Warrant," as carte blanche to incriminate any reaction from a homeowner.

Like a few other posters have already mentioned @7437 @dormammu , any given asshole can yell "Police!" before busting down your door. It seems like there should be at minimum a requirement that you have to have eyes on that they're actually cops before you're required to disarm yourself if you're already in a defensive position with a firearm.

Better yet, let's just stop trying to make dynamic entries into structures? Or even better than that, how about not making dynamic entries into households for people having no-no plants? (The last two might to much to ask, so @nhbbear how about the first?)

@Madmick jump in here as well with your thoughts please.

 

[ultramanhyata]

Was this a vetted informant?

Hell yes. Owns a '65 Stingray.

Vetted enough for you?

 

[Islam Imamate]

Oh, here we go again with this stupid list of dangerous jobs. Garbage men are injured at a rate of 53 injuries per 100 workers; and killed at 55/100,000 workers. The majority of injuries are back and muscle strains from lifting heavy bags and cuts from broken glass. The deaths are almost exclusively from accidents. The garbage truck involved in an accident and the guys on the back are thrown from the vehicle, or a vehicle tries to go around the garbage truck and hits one of the guys loading trash. There are around 110,000 garbage collectors in the US.

This is in no way comparable to the danger of someone purposely trying to kill police officers. The rate of injury for officers is 458 per 10,000 workers, or about 45 per 100, close to the 52/100 for garbage workers. The death rate for officers is about 15 per 100,000, but there are ten times as many police officers which would drive that rate way down.

The causes of the majority of police officers killed in the line of duty can vary from year to year. One year; the highest deaths are due to traffic accidents, same as garbage men; but there are other years where accidents only account for 40% and 55% is due To murder and animal attacks; with usually less than 5% due to heart attacks or other health causes, such as fire.

Either way, there is an enormous difference between fearing that you may strain a muscle lifting stuff, get cut, or the worst injuries are due to moving motor vehicle accidents. How is that comparable to having people attack officerwn. No way is waiting for a possible accident worse than someone trying to kill you.

No offense but I don't think you made a good argument at all. All that matters to me is how likely I am to die because when you're dead you're dead. And tbh honest a construction or garbage collection accident sounds like a fucking terrible way to go. Imagine your family couldn't even have an open casket because you got leveled by a garbage truck.

And at least cops have some way to control the potentially fatal situations they find themselves in. When a perp shoots at you, its not like you are helpless. You can shoot right back at the cunt. On the other hand, when @lifelessheap fell 20 feet from a scaffolding all he could do in that moment is pray to YHWH that he doesn't die or get permanently injured.

Not saying we shouldn't praise cops but we should also praise the more mundane heroes of our society, especially if the metric you're using is their importance to the normal functioning of society and the threat they bear in carrying out their job. From that POV garbage collectors are no less worthy of the praise.

@nhbbear is a sensible guy, and in a pretty elevated leadership position within his Dept, so I want his .02 on calling out "Police! Search Warrant," as carte blanche to incriminate any reaction from a homeowner.

Like a few other posters have already mentioned @7437 @dormammu , any given asshole can yell "Police!" before busting down your door. It seems like there should be at minimum a requirement that you have to have eyes on that they're actually cops before you're required to disarm yourself if you're already in a defensive position with a firearm.

Better yet, let's just stop trying to make dynamic entries into structures? Or even better than that, how about not making dynamic entries into households for people having no-no plants? (The last two might to much to ask, so @nhbbear how about the first?)

@Madmick jump in here as well with your thoughts please.

In high school a teacher of mine once suggested that if cops are at your door asking to get in you should tell them that you're going to verify their warrant with the PD and ask for their warrant number. Not sure if that would work in practice but I'd try it.

 

[Soul Crusher]

Should I really ban guns and disarm black people too? Can disarming black people be racist? Oh boy....

 

[nhbbear]

No offense but I don't think you made a good argument at all. All that matters to me is how likely I am to die because when you're dead you're dead. And tbh honest a construction or garbage collection accident sounds like a fucking terrible way to go. Imagine your family couldn't even have an open casket because you got leveled by a garbage truck.

And at least cops have some way to control the potentially fatal situations they find themselves in. When a perp shoots at you, its not like you are helpless. You can shoot right back at the cunt. On the other hand, when @lifelessheap fell 20 feet from a scaffolding all he could do in that moment is pray to YHWH that he doesn't die or get permanently injured.

Not saying we shouldn't praise cops but we should also praise the more mundane heroes of our society, especially if the metric you're using is their importance to the normal functioning of society and the threat they bear in carrying out their job. From that POV garbage collectors are no less worthy of the praise.

In high school a teacher of mine once suggested that if cops are at your door asking to get in you should tell them that you're going to verify their warrant with the PD and ask for their warrant number. Not sure if that would work in practice but I'd try it.

Just opinions. Those lists are constantly thrown in my face as an insult-oh, garbage collecting is more dangerous than police work. I have been a cop for 16 years, and I have been through some harrowing stuff. I guess my point is that I believe that knowing that someone is trying to kill you is more terrifying than many of those other jobs. It’s not that death does not equal death, or injury for injury, but having a person with the ability to form thought and intent, is what makes the difference to me.

I sure as hell would not want to be on a boat in a big storm-talk about helpless, but those other jobs, they don’t know they are in danger until it’s too late. Chasing after a man with a gun that just robbed a bank is just not as fun as it once was, but three kids will do that to a man.

 

[nhbbear]

There are a lot of jobs that have higher death rates on the job than cops. Law enforement is 14th on the list of most fatal jobs.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1002500001

I don’t care for that list. Firemen are like 20th, if I remember correctly, and they go into burning building when not saving cats from trees. Look, as I explained to Kafir, I am not saying that the jobs that top those lists are not dangerous, I am saying that they arrived at the list almost entirely using empirical/quantifiable data.

There are X amount of workers where X amount of injuries and deaths occur. It’s not looking at the reasons why the injuries and death are occurring, or how. I am just of the opinion that the human factor involved in the dangers of law enforcement is a more unpredictable factor, and knowing that there are people that will purposely try to kill you makes law enforcement not only a dangerous job, but also one that fucks with your head. You never really know what is in store for you each day you go to work

 

[nhbbear]

Wow I have a whole new hespect for garbage collectors. Never realized how dangerous the job is.

I wouldn’t want to do it. I hate going to take garbage out at the end of the week because the garbage that has been out and here all week smells awful. Now imagine having to pick up everyone’s awful smelling trash, with stuff leaking on you-i would gag-repeatedly. I have been told that they don’t even notice it anymore, but I will stick to human garbage as opposed to actual garbage

 

[nhbbear]

Nope, check the stats from the bureau of labor statistics I posted a page back.



Also "Most policemen killed on the job die in accidents (mostly auto), not from firearm assault, according to the FBI.
According to FBI figures (which are slightly different than other tabulations), 14 of the 76 police deaths in 2013, nation-wide, were due to auto accidents —- when the officer wasn’t wearing a seatbelt. Tragic for sure. <Lmaoo>"

There’s no excuse to die for lack of wearing a seatbelt. That’s where the “under 100” training, to try and keep Leo on duty deaths to under 100, has focused their efforts. But do you find that funny and amusing?

And the last two years, firearm deaths have been up-64 in 2016/2017.

 

[nhbbear]

Do you die twice if some criminal kills you as opposed to being crushed by a machiene?


Seems like you are just as dead either way

Dead is dead. But getting crushed by a machine is not something those workers wake up and say “boy, I hope i am not crushed today” where as going on bad calls, the anxiety from wondering what is on the other side of a door is not fun.

And I am not putting down the other jobs, but douchebags use that list to try and insult law enforcement like it’s not a tough or dangerous job. It has potential to be an extremely dangerous job very frequently, but thankfully, the really bad stuff does not happen as often as it could.

I know when i am blocking off traffic on the highway, I am at much greater risk of dying than from being shot or stabbed, but it’s not the traffic dangers that truly worry me Lt my family. That’s where the difference is, imo

 

[dormammu]

Dead is dead. But getting crushed by a machine is not something those workers wake up and say “boy, I hope i am not crushed today” where as going on bad calls, the anxiety from wondering what is on the other side of a door is not fun.

And I am not putting down the other jobs, but douchebags use that list to try and insult law enforcement like it’s not a tough or dangerous job. It has potential to be an extremely dangerous job very frequently, but thankfully, the really bad stuff does not happen as often as it could.

I know when i am blocking off traffic on the highway, I am at much greater risk of dying than from being shot or stabbed, but it’s not the traffic dangers that truly worry me Lt my family. That’s where the difference is, imo

That's a little silly, you have two jobs, garbagemen are more likely to die doing their job than a police officer, but apparently even though it's a more dangerous job, they shouldn't worry about death. Come on!!!!

I have done jobs more dangerous than being a police officer, death is death, quit trying to make the cops job something it isn't! It's a dangerous job, still not as dangerous as a trash man or farmer or many other day to day jobs. I think cop apologists try to play up the danger of the job, which again isn't supported by facts.
Somehow garbage collectors shouldn't worry about their jobs, but cops should be scared to death in a field where they don't die as much as the garbagemen per 100,000 people.

That's not logical in my opinion

Also, you kinda just made up a bunch of stats in your last post responding to me, where I on the other hand brought stats from a variety of sources with citations, one I corrected you just kinda ignored your previous comments?

@Madmick
No comment on those stats you asked for?