"Why should Pennsylvania, founded by the English, become Germanized ?!" - Ben Franklin

[savemgs]

I have not a shred of respect for them, nurderousl nutfucks. But comparing them to muslim or africans is a bit much. The penchant of doing what they are told can be good and bad, good that they assimilate to the new rules. Bad they genocided millions following orders like dogs.

You have to remember that's not an uncommon practice.
It still happens to this day in Africa a lot. But I digress.

 

[original doom]

Anyone with a real curiosity for this topic should check it out. It's very sad and considering German is the largest ancestry group in the US, likely plays a role in the identity crisis so many white Americans seem to be having these days. It may have been stripped from you.

English is the largest ancestry.

 

[V-2]

English is the largest ancestry.

Nah.

Fairly informative article in the second link.

http://www.worldatlas.com/articles/largest-ethnic-groups-and-nationalities-in-the-united-states.html

https://www.economist.com/news/unit...s-assimilated-so-well-people-barely-notice-it

http://www.businessinsider.com/largest-ethnic-groups-in-america-2013-8

 

[Amerikuracana]

This is wrong in almost every respect. Assimilation is not defined simply by "obeying the rules of a system outside the home." It is defined by entry into a culture, such that members of the minority group are absorbed into the dominant culture "to such a degree that the assimilating group becomes socially indistinguishable from other members of the society." https://www.britannica.com/topic/assimilation-society ; cf. multiculturalism.

German-Americans maintained a distinct culture, with schools conducted in german, religious services conducted in german, german cultural festivals, all-german army regiments, and german-language newspapers, for approximately 150 years after Franklin made his pronouncement that they would not assimilate. That's the opposite of assimilation.
(Although some of these still exist, they were mostly stamped out forcibly around WW1, as has been discussed in thread.)

Where Franklin was wrong was his idea that different cultures could not coexist, and his conclusion that the outcome would be to "Germanize us" or "our Anglifying them." That conclusion didn't occur organically, and might not have occurred at all had the government not forced the issue.

Naw.. you're wrong. I pay attention. Germans assimilate. Back that long ago it made sense to keep everybody on the same page in an area with predominately one kind of people. Everybody did it. I belong to.the German American cultural center.. We have people from all over the world as members. You don't get that at ANY other cultural center. Germans have assimilated into American culture as well as anybody, and maybe better.

 

[PolishHeadlock]

Pennsylvania seems to be doing ok.

We've seen better days

 

[ALE]

back in the day germans were the enemy of british/anglosaxon people.

they were eemies during wars with million of deaths, you know, things that would make syria looks like a disney movie

 

[Quipling]

Naw.. you're wrong. I pay attention. Germans assimilate. Back that long ago it made sense to keep everybody on the same page in an area with predominately one kind of people. Everybody did it. I belong to.the German American cultural center.. We have people from all over the world as members. You don't get that at ANY other cultural center. Germans have assimilated into American culture as well as anybody, and maybe better.

"N-no muh personal experience" isn't a meaningful response to an argument based on history from 1750-1920 on any level. It's been roughly 270 years since Franklin made his comments. German assimilation is less than a century old. The level of german assimilation you describe is scarcely older than you are.

 

[Fawlty]

This is wrong in almost every respect. Assimilation is not defined simply by "obeying the rules of a system outside the home." It is defined by entry into a culture, such that members of the minority group are absorbed into the dominant culture "to such a degree that the assimilating group becomes socially indistinguishable from other members of the society." https://www.britannica.com/topic/assimilation-society ; cf. multiculturalism.

German-Americans maintained a distinct culture, with schools conducted in german, religious services conducted in german, german cultural festivals, all-german army regiments, and german-language newspapers, for approximately 150 years after Franklin made his pronouncement that they would not assimilate. That's the opposite of assimilation.
(Although some of these still exist, they were mostly stamped out forcibly around WW1, as has been discussed in thread.)

Where Franklin was wrong was his idea that different cultures could not coexist, and his conclusion that the outcome would be to "Germanize us" or "our Anglifying them." That conclusion didn't occur organically, and might not have occurred at all had the government not forced the issue.

Franklin was a great man and too brilliant, but this reminds me that in his time, what he said amounts to giving a prophesy at the beginning of a revolutionary experiment (ed.- before the experiment)- nobody can be expected to pull off that trick.

 

[Rod1]

You should actually read that article because it points out a lot of the reasons why people want immigration to slow down in the first place. It's simply not an all-around benefit to society; the hurdles are high and not easy to get over.

And they can assimilate all they want(Latin and S. America essentially don't per your link), but the fact remains that most immigrants typically suck for at least two to three generations.

Where did you get that from the article?

 

[Amerikuracana]

"N-no muh personal experience" isn't a meaningful response to an argument based on history from 1750-1920 on any level. It's been roughly 270 years since Franklin made his comments. German assimilation is less than a century old. The level of german assimilation you describe is scarcely older than you are.

Naw.. My ancestors came from Germany in the early to mid 1800's. See, there wasn't that much to assimilate into out in small town farmland. But in the big cities? German town was American town. Chinatown? Heard of it. Little Italy? Most cities have one of those. Mexican town? Yep. German town? Hmmm.. I think that's the low crime suburbs where everybody speaks english.

 

[KILL KILL]

We've seen better days

At least the Eagles are doing well.

 

[PolishHeadlock]

At least the Eagles are doing well.

We can't get a budget passed and there are zero reserve funds.

Even with full Republican control they couldn't get it done and there is little chance the Dems could take full control. And are Dems are pretty purple.

State colleges are so underfunded many are might close and the ones that aren't have to charge private tuition prices (Temple)

 

[tramendous]

Germans living stateside were actually treated like dog shit by the US Government and larger part of the citizenry in light of the hysteria brought on by World War I. There was a concentrated effort to crush the culture and thriving 'Little Germania' enclaves prevalent all throughout the Northern/Midwest United States at the time and reduce them to tattered remnants with several lynchings even taking place. That effort largely succeeded and is a big reason why most German-Americans have no connection to their homeland of origin today, particularly if their families were in the US prior to that.

Even here in ontario canada they renamed places like berlin to kitchener which is a city.

 

[V-2]

Even here in ontario canada they renamed places like berlin to kitchener which is a city.

North Dakota at least still has Bismarck as its state capital, and both Dakotas - North and South - are packed full of German and Scandanavian ancestry (predominantly Norwegian), more so percentage-of-population wise than anywhere else in the United States.

 

[original doom]

Nah.

Fairly informative article in the second link.

http://www.worldatlas.com/articles/largest-ethnic-groups-and-nationalities-in-the-united-states.html

https://www.economist.com/news/unit...s-assimilated-so-well-people-barely-notice-it

http://www.businessinsider.com/largest-ethnic-groups-in-america-2013-8

Thats only because people dont recognise their English ancestry. You dont think the english and too a degree the Scots had a headstart. I mean have a look at your cities and their names unless you think new york, boston, stockton, houston, new england, richmond, glendale, norfolk, birmingham etc etc are german ?????

The main ethnic group that settled America in the early days, the ones that established cities and the ones who had 16 kids were not from germany or germans fleeing russia. Germans were there of course just not in huge numbers.....that came later.

 

[Possum Jenkins]

You should actually read that article because it points out a lot of the reasons why people want immigration to slow down in the first place. It's simply not an all-around benefit to society; the hurdles are high and not easy to get over.

Of course it's not an all-around benefit. Few things in society are. Immigration has NEVER been.

The point is, when comparing current immigration to past immigration, there are LOTS of commonalities. Especially on the issue of assimilation, the parallels are all over.

And they can assimilate all they want(Latin and S. America essentially don't per your link), but the fact remains that most immigrants typically suck for at least two to three generations.

No, they essentially do assimilate. Language acquisition, health, even crime where immigrants have it lower and it increases as the generations go on.

They don't reach educational levels of US natives because they arrive with much lower levels to begin with. But the article makes it clear that “progress a great deal relative to their parents.”

Again, the classic "Why can't they assimilate like MY ancestors??" excuse becomes completely invalid. Now, if they made it more honest and changed it to "Why can't they be white like my ancestors??" then they'd have a point.

 

[sub_thug]

Touche, but I was pretty clearly referring to Ben Franklin's "anglo" pennsylvania not getting destroyed just because germans immigrated.

Ironically enough, some of those Germans never integrated:

Mostly, the Pennsylvania Dutch (AKA the Amish) are generally pretty nice. But don't go into the woods while they are hunting. My buddy and I almost got shot because the Amish saw a deer, got into a line like they were part of a firing squad, and all shot straight ahead, forming a wall of lead. They really didn't care what was behind their targets, and they all used super high-powered, high-tech hunting rifles. I don't know how they were allowed to use such high-tech rifles, but they did.

 

[V-2]

Thats only because people dont recognise their English ancestry. You dont think the english and too a degree the Scots had a headstart. I mean have a look at your cities and their names unless you think new york, boston, stockton, houston, new england, richmond, glendale, norfolk, birmingham etc etc are german ?????

The main ethnic group that settled America in the early days, the ones that established cities and the ones who had 16 kids were not from germany or germans fleeing russia. Germans were there of course just not in huge numbers.....that came later.

Yeah, that's a fair. Whether German is technically the largest or not, the general point was that it's a pretty damn significant number.

I don't know how they were allowed to use such high-tech rifles, but they did.

'Murica.

 

[sub_thug]

'Murica.

“Amish using advanced technology and other things that don’t make sense” for $500, Alex