Wing Chun in MMA

My friend Mel is related to Yip Man.

But as far as the martial art is concerned, it's very limited in its scope, hasn't really evolved with the times, and if I'm not mistaken, the competition/sparring isn't very realistic compared to a real fight.

That said I have seen WC guys compare Muay Thai clinch and boxing parry techniques to the mystical Wing Chun, but then again those are simply motions with the human body that aren't limited to any style or system. I guess one could say some things could be extracted from Wing Chun, but those high-percentage techniques are few and far in between and you'd probably be better off learning from other systems.

And again, if I'm not mistaken, wasn't Wing Chun invented by a woman for self-defense?
 
Naw. No one knows how wing chun really developed. Two major schools of thought were (1) it was created by a woman and passed to her husband..so on an so forth; and (2) it was actually something developed by military powers over the course of some time.

Regardless, the system is far too limited in scope in it's tactics and training methods. I was a heavy practitioner...and presently only use some mechanical parts of it--the parts that are fairly universal that is. You guys would be surprised that some of it translates well to boxing, and some of it translates well to clinching also.

It is chinese boxing after all!
 
Idk, but I remember watching this video and dying from laughter.

 
Considering the discussion, I had to share this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUi8FCdYUPU&sns=fb

Even though the title is "Boxing beats Wing Chun", the idea of the video is not a style vs style comparison. Rather, it's more to make a point that if you claim you can handle a certain situation or system (e.g. in this case, fighting a boxer), you need to actually practice with and demonstrate with the same thing you are trying to prove. Having your students try half-assed punches or takedowns, or just lying there in the guard letting you do whatever you want, is not the way to prove it. The problem with a lot of Wing Chun is there's way more theory than application.
 
Will a Wing Chun Fight Strategy work in MMA?
I think that is a better question, because the techniques are built around the strategy. The thing that makes it effective is training method, but you can get less than efficient technique, and poor strategy to work with the right training method.
So can we just assume a high quality training method when asking this question?

What is a Wing Chun Fight Strategy?
Punch and Clutch
1. Hit
2. Seek attachment with the first hit, preferably while immobilizing the opponants lead striking tools, and disrupting their balance.
3. stay attached, keep the immobilization, get to a dominant position that allows you to continue striking.
4. if the attachment is lost, wash rinse, repeat.
Sounds kinda like how a muay thai person with a monster clinch game would fight right?

Now consider this, in modern MMA, Muay thai and boxing are the two primary striking arts. Here is the problem, they have opposing mechanics. In Boxing torquing the hips is reserved for punches. When you try and teach a good Boxer Muay Thai for MMA, your asking him to save the power he would normaly use for his punches and use them for kicks instead, this is not making the most of the Boxers specialized tools.
Solution? Dutch Muay Thai or Savate, both use the legs to set up the hands, and rotate over more on punches. To set up boxing, kicks should have the effect of closing the gap, making use of forward momentum, saving the hip rotation for the punches (Think TKD kicks, Boxing Punches VS. Muay Thai kicks, Muay Thai Punches).
Both arts evolved with boxing gloves, which eliminates most trapping.

The dirty boxing we see now is mostly from a wrestling platform, hand fighting in wrestling is to set up throws or takedowns, so when I watch them dirty boxing, it looks like they miss numerours opportunities to hit, because their hand positions are best used to set up grappling, not striking. Hand fighting in Muay Thai is to set up Knees and throws.
Where does handfighting exist for the sake of hitting? I dont think there has been a rule set that has allowed that to evolve the way the other arts have. Not that chunners would do it anyways, i am just saying we cant expect to see it, in rules sets that discourage it.

The collar tie, the neck pull, the forearm shiver, are all used in the exact same way in Wing Chun.
http://youtu.be/of0rgt1qxR4

If there is anyone on Sherdog in Arizona, hit me up and we can make some videos of the stuff I am talking about to post here.
 
BRCLRY said:
Will a Wing Chun Fight Strategy work in MMA?
I think that is a better question, because the techniques are built around the strategy. The thing that makes it effective is training method, but you can get less than efficient technique, and poor strategy to work with the right training method.
So can we just assume a high quality training method when asking this question?

What is a Wing Chun Fight Strategy?
Punch and Clutch
1. Hit
2. Seek attachment with the first hit, preferably while immobilizing the opponants lead striking tools, and disrupting their balance.
3. stay attached, keep the immobilization, get to a dominant position that allows you to continue striking.
4. if the attachment is lost, wash rinse, repeat.
Sounds kinda like how a muay thai person with a monster clinch game would fight right?

Now consider this, in modern MMA, Muay thai and boxing are the two primary striking arts. Here is the problem, they have opposing mechanics. In Boxing torquing the hips is reserved for punches. When you try and teach a good Boxer Muay Thai for MMA, your asking him to save the power he would normaly use for his punches and use them for kicks instead, this is not making the most of the Boxers specialized tools.
Solution? Dutch Muay Thai or Savate, both use the legs to set up the hands, and rotate over more on punches. To set up boxing, kicks should have the effect of closing the gap, making use of forward momentum, saving the hip rotation for the punches (Think TKD kicks, Boxing Punches VS. Muay Thai kicks, Muay Thai Punches).
Both arts evolved with boxing gloves, which eliminates most trapping.

The dirty boxing we see now is mostly from a wrestling platform, hand fighting in wrestling is to set up throws or takedowns, so when I watch them dirty boxing, it looks like they miss numerours opportunities to hit, because their hand positions are best used to set up grappling, not striking. Hand fighting in Muay Thai is to set up Knees and throws.
Where does handfighting exist for the sake of hitting? I dont think there has been a rule set that has allowed that to evolve the way the other arts have. Not that chunners would do it anyways, i am just saying we cant expect to see it, in rules sets that discourage it.

The collar tie, the neck pull, the forearm shiver, are all used in the exact same way in Wing Chun.
http://youtu.be/of0rgt1qxR4

If there is anyone on Sherdog in Arizona, hit me up and we can make some videos of the stuff I am talking about to post here.
Click to expand...

Sounds like an intelligent post
 
Thanks man. I have next to no grappling base, but practiced full body Chi Sao for 5 years. I was surprised to find in sparring that I am good in clinch positions, and my takedown defense is decent enough to base my game on striking into tie ups. It might change as I become more well rounded, but so far, the kickboxing and trapping thing works for me.
 
BRCLRY said:
Thanks man. I have next to no grappling base, but practiced full body Chi Sao for 5 years. I was surprised to find in sparring that I am good in clinch positions, and my takedown defense is decent enough to base my game on striking into tie ups. It might change as I become more well rounded, but so far, the kickboxing and trapping thing works for me.
Click to expand...

I also found that chi sao works well with the thai clinch. I think for the most part, Muay Thai and Wing Chun are congruent with each other.
 
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