Wing Chun or Muay Thai? Which is Truly More Effective for Self Defense?

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Johnny100

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The questions below are directed only to people who have learned both Muay Thai and Wing Chun completely, learned both of them for at least over a year, and at the least have learned either Wing Chun or Muay Thai for over a year and have sparred and/or fought with quite a few people of the other martial art who had about as much experience and skill as them or more. Before I ask my questions I quickly want to state I'm aware that (and if you personally think disagree please give your opinion on the matter) for the most part it's the individual and not the style that determines how good of a martial artist/fighter he/she will be.

My questions are:

1. Which martial art is truly more effective for self defense, Muay Thai or Wing Chun? And self defense in that one can effectively defend himself and others if need be from both unskilled and very skilled opponents. Which martial art has the edge over the other even if not by much? which is more effective and why is it?

2. If Wing Chun's training method was practiced with a lot more resistance and with more sparring like sport martial arts such a Muay Thai, Boxing, or MMA, do you you think this would make Wing Chun any more effective and if so by how much? Or do you think it's possible a few/quite a lot of Wing Chun techniques would be discarded or new techniques added thus making Wing Chun into a technically different martial art?

3. If Muay Thai's training method was practiced with it's only emphasis being self defense like Wing Chun or K'rav Maga (but Muay Thai still kept it's good resistance and sparring it already has), do you think this would make Muay Thai any more effective and if yes, how much more? Or do you think it's possible a few/quite a lot of Muay Thai's techniques would be discarded or a few/many new techniques would be added that it would become a different martial art (or basically be very similar to K'rav Maga just without the ground/knife fighting & stereotypical emphasis of striking the groin K'rav Maga has)?

Thank you for reading.
 
Wing Chun, Muay Thai is just a ring sport and is rubbish in the real world
 
The greatest flaw of combat sports is the lack of education you get from your coach on how to have a fist fight with someone much larger than yourself.

The way you fight in WC - standing right in front of your opponent and standing there, countering clinch and hit attempts, is basically the worst way to go about fighting a larger person.

My vote is for MT, because it makes you stronger, faster, and give you more punch so that a small person can hurt a larger, less trained person.
 
My overall vote is ancient boxing but wing chun. Weapons, no gloves etc.
 
I haven't learned WC for a year, and it's tough to fulfill your requirements for answering your question.

Anyways, I have friends who effectively defended themselves against multiple people with both arts. Most people on the street swing wild, and wing chun counters that really well.

In my opinion, the stance WC employs is just not very practical (against trained opponents) for full contact combat, when effective attacks are also coming from arced angles. WC protects the face really well, but neglect to think about the lower parts of the body. It works particularly well in street fights because most people just hit the head.

There are elements of WC that I think are amazing. Their blocks and parries are very cool to play with. That said, from what I know and have seen from WC, without a major change it won't be very effective.

I'd choose MT to begin with based on this reason: WC trains really short strikes (half committed). This makes it hard to transition into other martial arts. Full contact practitioners would take a half-commitment shot for a full-commitment shot any day.

IMO, WC can be more effective based on 2 principles:

1. Be more open minded in choosing stance
2. Be more willing to commit
 
Wing Chun, because that is where you learn techniques too dangerous for the ring.
 
SummerStriker said:
The greatest flaw of combat sports is the lack of education you get from your coach on how to have a fist fight with someone much larger than yourself.

The way you fight in WC - standing right in front of your opponent and standing there, countering clinch and hit attempts, is basically the worst way to go about fighting a larger person.

My vote is for MT, because it makes you stronger, faster, and give you more punch so that a small person can hurt a larger, less trained person.
Click to expand...

Thank you for answering my 1st question. Do you feel that's a big or rather litle flaw of combat sports?

Also what would you say your answers are for questions 2 & 3?
 
Johnny100 said:
Did you train in both Muay Thai & Wing Chun or learn one of them and have sparred with others of the opposite martial art?
Click to expand...

Only Muay Thai and have only sparred with Muay Thai/kickboxing and a few MMA guys.

Never sparrd with a wing chun guy before, never even met one before
 
LawrenceKenshin said:
I haven't learned WC for a year, and it's tough to fulfill your requirements for answering your question.

Anyways, I have friends who effectively defended themselves against multiple people with both arts. Most people on the street swing wild, and wing chun counters that really well.

In my opinion, the stance WC employs is just not very practical (against trained opponents) for full contact combat, when effective attacks are also coming from arced angles. WC protects the face really well, but neglect to think about the lower parts of the body. It works particularly well in street fights because most people just hit the head.

There are elements of WC that I think are amazing. Their blocks and parries are very cool to play with. That said, from what I know and have seen from WC, without a major change it won't be very effective.

I'd choose MT to begin with based on this reason: WC trains really short strikes (half committed). This makes it hard to transition into other martial arts. Full contact practitioners would take a half-commitment shot for a full-commitment shot any day.

IMO, WC can be more effective based on 2 principles:

1. Be more open minded in choosing stance
2. Be more willing to commit
Click to expand...

Even though you don't meet the requirements I listed, I do still appreciate your taking the time to respond.

Which parries and deflections of Wing Chun do you find amazing and do you think there are any that should be discarded to become more effective? For example, I wonder if Bong Sau truly is ever effective to use against non-Wing Chun practitioners who are skillful in other martial arts.

Lastly, what are your answers for 2 and 3? Though you did sort of answer #2 already.
 
Bang Rachan said:
Only Muay Thai and have only sparred with Muay Thai/kickboxing and a few MMA guys.

Never sparrd with a wing chun guy before, never even met one before
Click to expand...

I see. So then you were joking in your previous answers?
 
Johnny100 said:
Thank you for answering my 1st question. Do you feel that's a big or rather litle flaw of combat sports?

Also what would you say your answers are for questions 2 & 3?
Click to expand...

WC degenerates into nerd slap fighting if you try to fight with it. If it was trained hard, and integrated basic fighting structure with like, footwork, a probing attack and a hand or defensive position to survive straight punches and round kicks, it would look nothing like WC.

The flaw of combat sports is a minor flaw, because if you are small in a real altercation, hopefully you are smart enough not to stand in front of them or take a bad fight. Even small MMA fighters are usually more 'powerful' than large, untrained people.

Muay Thai trained for street fighting includes defensive footwork for hiding behind a jab and avoiding a clinch, not giving up the clinch because you are throwing round kicks, and maybe power punching. All that is naturally a part of some peoples' MT, so it is hard to say.
 
Go for the no nonsense approach and go with Muay Thai. IMO.

Not disputing that things in Wing Chun work - especially against untrained people, but if you want consistency and practice under pressure - do Muay Thai.

MT will train conditioning, strength, technique but most importantly, you will get you used to someone hitting you in sparring and you will get used to it, and be able to react. It evolves round it's effectiveness in a full contact setting. You can't practice the same way in Wing Chun. Sparring is FUNDAMENTAL to getting used to defending yourself.

Wing Chun is actually pretty open to one of the biggest weapons someone in the street will bring. A potential spam of looping power. If you're guard is chest height and in front of you - you're way more likely to get clocked by that big shot. I haven't seen Wing Chun utilize much bobbing or head movement either. I know the whole philosophy is center line and interception etc but no one is perfect and if you're going to get hit, you'd rather it be on your hands or arms and not your chin.

MT protects the chin and will keep your guard up. Even one hard low kick could be enough for someone to realize it was a bad move.
 
Johnny100 said:
I see. So then you were joking in your previous answers?
Click to expand...

Not at all. Muay Thai is a ring sport where you learn to fight people who do Muay Thai nothing else. Wing Chun has lethal techniques plus they prepare you for weapons and other stuff that you will expect in a street fight. Muay Thai has too much rules.
Muay Boran is the way to go.
 
I fear not the man who has practiced 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times.

Bruce Lee.
 
Polynomial_C said:
Go for the no nonsense approach and go with Muay Thai. IMO.

Not disputing that things in Wing Chun work - especially against untrained people, but if you want consistency and practice under pressure - do Muay Thai.

MT will train conditioning, strength, technique but most importantly, you will get you used to someone hitting you in sparring and you will get used to it, and be able to react. It evolves round it's effectiveness in a full contact setting. You can't practice the same way in Wing Chun. Sparring is FUNDAMENTAL to getting used to defending yourself.

Wing Chun is actually pretty open to one of the biggest weapons someone in the street will bring. A potential spam of looping power. If you're guard is chest height and in front of you - you're way more likely to get clocked by that big shot. I haven't seen Wing Chun utilize much bobbing or head movement either. I know the whole philosophy is center line and interception etc but no one is perfect and if you're going to get hit, you'd rather it be on your hands or arms and not your chin.

MT protects the chin and will keep your guard up. Even one hard low kick could be enough for someone to realize it was a bad move.
Click to expand...

Thank you for answering my 1st question :)

I also think Wing Chun doesn't protect one's head very well with the hands being at chest level and from what I've seen many Wing Chun practitioners don't tuck their chin down either which is important because it helps prevent clean shots from uppercuts and throat strikes.

Would your answer remain the same if Wing Chun was taught with resistance and sparring?

Lastly, what are your opinions on questions 2 & 3?
 
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