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I'm reasonably "old" and I've been involved in martial arts most of my life, so I've often thought about what defines the greatest fighters of all time.
My conclusion is not the results, or not only the results, but rather the impact on the public imagination, the real - or incredibly at times even just anecdotal - power which remains long after their career is finished or the wins have turned to losses.
After all, fighting is an ultimate expression of human physical and mental power; that is what attracts the attention of millions and what turns into legends people who are actually doing something blatantly negative from a rational perspective ... beating each other up.
So, based on that criteria, who are the greatest fighters of all time? Some ideas...
Mohammed Ali - he was and is "the greatest ever" to billions of people, a true master of physical and mental power in and out of the ring, in victory and in defeat, with fists and with words, through health and sickness.
Mike Tyson - adore him or loath him, when people think of the "baddest man on the planet" almost everyone still has Tyson in mind, including generations who never even saw him fight and over 30 years after his prime.
Bruce Lee - incredible for an actor who actually never really fought and who's cinematic martial skills are moderate (Jackie Chan and many others are far more talented and trained), Bruce Lee with his charisma capitalised on the luck of being the first real movie martial artist and has forever cemented himself as a mythical fighter to billions of people.
Jackie Chan - in Asia, so we are talking the majority of the world's population, Jackie Chan is rightly considered an amazing martial artist and thus to many automatically also an amazing fighter, whether that connection is real or not matters little in the collective imagination of several billion people.
Fedor Emilianenko - if we include someone from the MMA world then Fedor has tremendous popularity in eastern Europe and Asia, coupled with an aura of stoic menace and calm invincibility which fascinated millions and that hasn't diminished much regardless of his athletic decline and eventual defeats.
Others - McGregor has recently gained great mainstream popularity but weather it will last and become widespread respect is to be seen and doubtful at this point; Mayweather is very USA centric and whilst he has popularity he is not readily in the public imagination as a symbol of what/who a fighter is; boxers such as Holyfield, Frazer and many other greats are indeed great champions, but their popularity is rapidly declining with the passing of time; Joshua and GSP are respectively great ambassadors of their fight sports, with the right blend of exceptional skills, excellent results, pleasant personality and nice image, but the first is still in the making whilst the second is not known outside of the MMA fan base and north America; martial arts actors such as Seagal and VanDamme did gain widespread popularity as legendary "fighters" but eventually became unwilling parodies of themselves and lost any perceived credibility.
The UFC is huge yet it's still just a huge US-centric niche ... maybe in the next decades there will be MMA athletes who truly capture the global public imagination in a lasting way and became representative of what/who a fighter is.
There has always been and there will always be a fascination with fighting as an ultimate expression of human physical and mental power, in different socially acceptable forms from combat sports to fictional movies, as a needed outlet of primal human survival instincts; the people who will somehow capture the public imagination in representing that power will be considered the greatest fighters of all time ... in a way regardless of actual fighting ability or only partially because of it.
My conclusion is not the results, or not only the results, but rather the impact on the public imagination, the real - or incredibly at times even just anecdotal - power which remains long after their career is finished or the wins have turned to losses.
After all, fighting is an ultimate expression of human physical and mental power; that is what attracts the attention of millions and what turns into legends people who are actually doing something blatantly negative from a rational perspective ... beating each other up.
So, based on that criteria, who are the greatest fighters of all time? Some ideas...
Mohammed Ali - he was and is "the greatest ever" to billions of people, a true master of physical and mental power in and out of the ring, in victory and in defeat, with fists and with words, through health and sickness.
Mike Tyson - adore him or loath him, when people think of the "baddest man on the planet" almost everyone still has Tyson in mind, including generations who never even saw him fight and over 30 years after his prime.
Bruce Lee - incredible for an actor who actually never really fought and who's cinematic martial skills are moderate (Jackie Chan and many others are far more talented and trained), Bruce Lee with his charisma capitalised on the luck of being the first real movie martial artist and has forever cemented himself as a mythical fighter to billions of people.
Jackie Chan - in Asia, so we are talking the majority of the world's population, Jackie Chan is rightly considered an amazing martial artist and thus to many automatically also an amazing fighter, whether that connection is real or not matters little in the collective imagination of several billion people.
Fedor Emilianenko - if we include someone from the MMA world then Fedor has tremendous popularity in eastern Europe and Asia, coupled with an aura of stoic menace and calm invincibility which fascinated millions and that hasn't diminished much regardless of his athletic decline and eventual defeats.
Others - McGregor has recently gained great mainstream popularity but weather it will last and become widespread respect is to be seen and doubtful at this point; Mayweather is very USA centric and whilst he has popularity he is not readily in the public imagination as a symbol of what/who a fighter is; boxers such as Holyfield, Frazer and many other greats are indeed great champions, but their popularity is rapidly declining with the passing of time; Joshua and GSP are respectively great ambassadors of their fight sports, with the right blend of exceptional skills, excellent results, pleasant personality and nice image, but the first is still in the making whilst the second is not known outside of the MMA fan base and north America; martial arts actors such as Seagal and VanDamme did gain widespread popularity as legendary "fighters" but eventually became unwilling parodies of themselves and lost any perceived credibility.
The UFC is huge yet it's still just a huge US-centric niche ... maybe in the next decades there will be MMA athletes who truly capture the global public imagination in a lasting way and became representative of what/who a fighter is.
There has always been and there will always be a fascination with fighting as an ultimate expression of human physical and mental power, in different socially acceptable forms from combat sports to fictional movies, as a needed outlet of primal human survival instincts; the people who will somehow capture the public imagination in representing that power will be considered the greatest fighters of all time ... in a way regardless of actual fighting ability or only partially because of it.
