So can we have an actual discussion about Shogun?

BC said:
I honestly think this Hamburgler looking ass dude Anthony Smith is a fringe top 15 guy at best.

Pride Shogun would kick his declining hairline into Bolivian
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UFC 2009 Undisputed computer generated fighter number 11 looking ass
 
Threetrees said:
Or will the mods delete an honest thread

How good was Shogun really?

When he examine his legacy, I think it's clear that he's not one of the true GOATs of this sport
He had a year of dominance, and then a mixture of injuries and bad luck robbed him of his prime

And there's nothing wrong with that
He had another flash when he beat Machida

but I think tonight we see what his limit is,
his limit is a guy like Anthony Smith, a good not great LHW
that's probably what Shogun's career will be defined as

Any version of him would have lost tonight
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I don't like your new AV. Bordain's hairline was much more solid than Joey Diaz's, he actually has a lot of diffuse thinning.
 
LouisBolanos said:
I don't like your new AV. Bordain's hairline was much more solid than Joey Diaz's, he actually has a lot of diffuse thinning.
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rate prime Joey Diaz
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Things have definitely gone downhill since he became Showgut.
 
Just another fight that shows that the UFC is much better than Pride ever was. A bunch of roided out can crushers in that org. A couple of good fighters like Hendo, but not much else.
 
Shogun was great. Then age and injuries and all the wars got to him. Happens to all.

Was a great run.
 
"Any version of him would have lost tonight."

Man, it's such a shame how MMA fans don't understand how age/injuries catch up to fighters.

Smith wouldn't have belonged in the same cage as an 05' GP Shogun, and would have gotten routed by even an 09' or 10' Shogun.

Fighters get old. It doesn't take away from their legacy, accomplishments, or abilities at their peak.

This is only Smith's fourth win against a fighter than even remotely matters, and all four were either way past their prime or totally shot.
 
Shogun I’d never going to be the first guy you want off the bus, but man he looked out of shape tonight. If he wants to continue fighting, put him on the senior’s tour and let him fight Glover or Anderson. Or let him go to Japan and get on the gear. He has no business in any fight with any title implications.
 
Cylence said:
"Any version of him would have lost tonight."

Man, it's such a shame how MMA fans don't understand how age/injuries catch up to fighters.

Smith wouldn't have belonged in the same cage as an 05' GP Shogun, and would have gotten routed by even an 09' or 10' Shogun.

Fighters get old. It doesn't take away from their legacy, accomplishments, or abilities at their peak.

This is only Smith's fourth win against a fighter than even remotely matters, and all four were either way past their prime or totally shot.
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No we understand that it was 13 years ago

What you fail to understand is that it was THIRTEEN years ago

a sport of this age evolves so quickly, 13 years ago is like 50 years in baseball terms. Training, athletes, nutrition, techniques are all better today

Shogun was good for his time, but we must evaluate him not only relative to his place in history but in an absolute sense
This is the appropriate context,
tonight MATTERS
 
Threetrees said:
hey
reality of the sport

Anthony Smith is an evolved fighter,
Shogun's highest points were back when he was beating up guys like Arona who wouldn't even be UFC fighters today
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Chael Sonnen was earning Title shots not so long ago, Arona wouldn't be a UFC fighter back in the day? lol k.
 
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