Bizarro world - white guy is world indoor 60m sprint champion

[Madmick]

I respectfully disagree. The analogy is relevant because:

If you can run 26.2mi, you can run 50mi. The distance might be different but the training wouldn't be very different at all. It's not like changing from the 800m (a sprint in terms of track and field) to the 5000m (a distance race). Also, if an elite marathoner chose to start competing in 50mi races, he would instantly dominate. Don't agree. Look up Alberto Salazar.
If you can run 100m, you can run 60m. The distance might be different but the training wouldn't be very different at all. Again, it's not like changing from the 100m to the 200m (where you have to deal with a curve) or the 400m (where stamina becomes an issue). If an elite 100m runner decided to dedicate himself to the 60m, he would instantly dominate.

This is also a very good point. These races are nearly pure measurements of aerobic capacity. Hell, the aerobic system is responsible for like 99% of energy regeneration after the first hour, I think. Don't quote me on that. I know it becomes the predominant energy system after 3 minutes of continuous activity. Of that stat I'm sure.

 

[therealdope]

I respectfully disagree. The analogy is relevant because:

If you can run 26.2mi, you can run 50mi. The distance might be different but the training wouldn't be very different at all. It's not like changing from the 800m (a sprint in terms of track and field) to the 5000m (a distance race). Also, if an elite marathoner chose to start competing in 50mi races, he would instantly dominate.

Clearly you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground with regard to running.

I don't know of any ultra-marathon runners that do a 10 repeats of a mile at 4:40. World class marathoners do that.

OTOH, 5000m and 800m workouts are a lot more similar. Sure 800m do more speed work and less distance work BUT they both do distance work and speed work. Modern 5000m running demands that you can finish in 55. That takes speed work, not just a bunch of long runs that progressively increase speed.

Don't agree. Look up Alberto Salazar.

Salazar could have been riddled with injuries (god knows he was riddled with being an asshole and part of Nike's 'doping' West club). If you were a competitive middle or distance runner you would have known many great runners who were limited by injuries. Mechanics are only part of it, genetics are another.

If there was big money in ultra-marathoning you'd see some of the top high volume work African marathoners doing them.


A better example is the Race Across America (RAAM) bicycle race. Cycling is not limited by injuries like running often is. The RAAM is 3,000miles and sleeping counts towards your time. In 1984 European based American pro Jonathan Boyer mocked the RAAM and declared he could easily win it.

In 1985 he trained specifically for the RAAM for one month and beat the record by a full day. This included him getting arrested, and having to spend a few hours in jail, for not having a light on his bike while riding through West Virginia.

The race was as much a sleep deprivation contest as it was a bike race but Boyer still prevailed.

If an elite 100m runner decided to dedicate himself to the 60m, he would instantly dominate.

LOL - that is far from a certainty. Just stop, you are embarrassing yourself.

Senri - get your ass in here and set this guy straight.

 

[ColonelAngus1]

Clearly you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground with regard to running.

I don't know of any ultra-marathon runners that do a 10 repeats of a mile at 4:40. World class marathoners do that.

OTOH, 5000m and 800m workouts are a lot more similar. Sure 800m do more speed work and less distance work BUT they both do distance work and speed work. Modern 5000m running demands that you can finish in 55. That takes speed work, not just a bunch of long runs that progressively increase speed.



Salazar could have been riddled with injuries (god knows he was riddled with being an asshole and part of Nike's 'doping' West club). If you were a competitive middle or distance runner you would have known many great runners who were limited by injuries. Mechanics are only part of it, genetics are another.

If there was big money in ultra-marathoning you'd see some of the top high volume work African marathoners doing them.


A better example is the Race Across America (RAAM) bicycle race. Cycling is not limited by injuries like running often is. The RAAM is 3,000miles and sleeping counts towards your time. In 1984 European based American pro Jonathan Boyer mocked the RAAM and declared he could easily win it.

In 1985 he trained specifically for the RAAM for one month and beat the record by a full day. This included him getting arrested, and having to spend a few hours in jail, for not having a light on his bike while riding through West Virginia.

The race was as much a sleep deprivation contest as it was a bike race but Boyer still prevailed.





LOL - that is far from a certainty. Just stop, you are embarrassing yourself.

Senri - get your ass in here and set this guy straight.

The point with Salazar is that he was a well-past-his-prime former elite marathoner who started running again and at 46 won the Comrades ultramarathon; the oldest ultramarathon in the world.

But let's move on to the highlighted portions. These are the two points that are most important. The rest of your post is pretty much crap. To say that the 800m and 5000m are similar because both involve training with speed work is beyond foolish. Every distance involves speed work! You think you don't have to have a kick to win a 10,000m race?! I would bet my life that if you went to the Boston Marathon and picked out the top ranked marathoner and dropped him in the Squaw Peak 50 miler or the Western States 100 miler (with a good crew that knew how to keep him fed), he would do a hell of a lot better than if you took the top ranked 800m guy in the world and dropped him into the 5000m final at the Olympics.

World class marathoners are on a completely different level of training than ultra-marathoners. Ultra-marathoning isn't about sleep deprivation at all. An elite ultra runner can cover 100m in 15 1/2 hours. There's no loss of sleep involved there. It's much more about diet than anything else (except the actual running of course). That's why your cycling example is such crap.

The 2nd point is the most important one though. There is absolutely no money in 60m races, so the elite of track and field don't participate in them, and they sure as hell don't specifically train for them. Which is why a 6.49 is, even though it is the 28th fastest time every run, nothing special. Which is what I said in my original post.

 

[therealdope]

I have no idea whether you are coming or going.

There is absolutely no money in 60m races,

Uhmmm. You don't think there is any money in indoor track? Really?

Which is why a 6.49 is, even though it is the 28th fastest time every run, nothing special. Which is what I said in my original post.

Given that the 6.49 was run in a year where drug testing is much more advanced and includes OOC testing, compared to the years when the 27 faster times were run - it might be a lot more special than you represent.

 

[ColonelAngus1]

I have no idea whether you are coming or going.





Uhmmm. You don't think there is any money in indoor track? Really?




Given that the 6.49 was run in a year where drug testing is much more advanced and includes OOC testing, compared to the years when the 27 faster times were run - it might be a lot more special than you represent.

http://speedendurance.com/2012/01/30/indoor-60-meters-where-are-the-fast-times/

Going to stick with it not being special... all of the top guys would easily run faster than a 6.49. And it's not that I think there's no money in indoor track. It's that there's no money in the 60m indoor race. It's not my opinion, it's a fact. I hate to go all Adam Smith on you, but the fact that none of the top guys compete in the 60m pretty much proves that there's not enough money in it. The invisible hand of the market has spoken.

 

[Uptown Swinger]

here is the woman who ran the second fastest 100m in history.

Really?
What was her time? 10.89?

#1-3= Flo Jo 10.49
#4 = C.Jeter 10.64
#188= Katrin Krabbe 10.89

Oh you mean Katrin Krabbe ran the second fastest at one point but her fastest record has been broken many times since?
I'm not trying to be a jerk I'm just confused.

#29 Irina Privalova 10.77

 

[therealdope]

Really?
What was her time? 10.89?

#1-3= Flo Jo 10.49
#4 = C.Jeter 10.64
#188= Katrin Krabbe 10.89

I thought she ran 10.55 at one point. I wonder if it was stricken after the doping positive.

Although I see Marion Jones' name all over all-time place - I guess mj never actually tested positive but she did return (some of) her medals.

 

[ColonelAngus1]

Really?
What was her time? 10.89?

#1-3= Flo Jo 10.49
#4 = C.Jeter 10.64
#188= Katrin Krabbe 10.89

Oh you mean Katrin Krabbe ran the second fastest at one point but her fastest record has been broken many times since?
I'm not trying to be a jerk I'm just confused.

#29 Irina Privalova 10.77

Women's track and field was just a complete drug orgy from the late 1970s to the early 1990s. So many of the records from the 1980s are still standing and will, most likely, stand for some time due to all the performance enhancing drugs those women were on.

 

[therealdope]

Women's track and field was just a complete drug orgy from the late 1970s to the early 1990s. So many of the records from the 1980s are still standing and will, most likely, stand for some time due to all the performance enhancing drugs those women were on.

The 21.34 (200m) is just ludicrous. It's not going down for a long, long time.

there is nothing to suggest that the 100m, 200m, 400m, and 800m records will be broken in the next 10yrs.

Look at the dates (years) of the women's records (100m -> 3000m).

1988
1988
1985
1983
1996
1993
1996
1994
1993

If you take out Mastrakova's 18 yr old records, they are all 20 - 30yrs old. think about how much track surface technology, training, measurement techniques, stride analysis, medical care and nutrition have advanced and that should tell you how much of a factor drugs are.

Looking at men's 1500m -> 10,000m it's obvious that blood manipulation during that era ('90s -> mid 2000s) will leave those records standing for a long time.

 

[bcordova]

Was he from Bako too?

No I think he was from somewhere south. Although the winners in the 110 hurdles 300 hurdles and 400m were all from Bakersfield High. I think they won the team competition that year.

 

[DangDaGawd]

It's crazy what an athletically oppressed class of people like whites can accomplish when they put their mind to something.

 

[Lord Commander Palis]

The 21.34 (200m) is just ludicrous. It's not going down for a long, long time.

there is nothing to suggest that the 100m, 200m, 400m, and 800m records will be broken in the next 10yrs.

Look at the dates (years) of the women's records (100m -> 3000m).

1988
1988
1985
1983
1996
1993
1996
1994
1993

If you take out Mastrakova's 18 yr old records, they are all 20 - 30yrs old. think about how much track surface technology, training, measurement techniques, stride analysis, medical care and nutrition have advanced and that should tell you how much of a factor drugs are.

Looking at men's 1500m -> 10,000m it's obvious that blood manipulation during that era ('90s -> mid 2000s) will leave those records standing for a long time.

Damn that's pretty insane stuff there... good read

 

[Groundswell]

For people ('tards)that think NCAA football players are A-level athletes who would crush real sprinters, consider that Jeff Demps (Florida) won the NCAA's 60m with 6.56sec and was the alternate to the US 4x100m that didn't even win at 2012 olympics.

Demps is almost certainly the fastest NCAA/NFL player in recent history.

I'm puzzled by this statement. Maybe not so much anymore, but there are loads of sprinters who played football - many at the college and NFL levels who went on to run in the Olympics.

You mentioned Houston McTear in a different post. Awesome factoid: He averaged 14.4 yards/carry one season in HS.

 

[therealdope]

I'm puzzled by this statement. Maybe not so much anymore, but there are loads of sprinters who played football - many at the college and NFL levels who went on to run in the Olympics.

What is puzzling you? I responded to a guy who claimed any group of top level NCAA (LOL) football players would destroy a field of 60m runners at the Worlds. I pointed out that Jeff Demps (Florida returner/RB) was the fastest CFB player ... by far, and he's PB was 6.56s.

So I guess the 'nothing special' 6.49 the WC ran is still better than the PB of the outlier of CFB players.

 

[bragglefraggle]

For people ('tards)that think NCAA football players are A-level athletes who would crush real sprinters, consider that Jeff Demps (Florida) won the NCAA's 60m with 6.56sec and was the alternate to the US 4x100m that didn't even win at 2012 olympics.

Demps is almost certainly the fastest NCAA/NFL player in recent history.

Marvin Bracy had a 6.51 60m and he would have only been a sophomore if he stayed at FSU playing football instead of going pro in track

 

[Groundswell]

What is puzzling you? I responded to a guy who claimed any group of top level NCAA (LOL) football players would destroy a field of 60m runners at the Worlds. I pointed out that Jeff Demps (Florida returner/RB) was the fastest CFB player ... by far, and he's PB was 6.56s.

So I guess the 'nothing special' 6.49 the WC ran is still better than the PB of the outlier of CFB players.

Those top sprinters and top level NCAA & NFL players are often one and the same. An internet search will provide a long list. Travis Williams, Bob Hayes, Willie Gault, Johnny Jones, et al. I can think of about 15 of them who ran in the Olympics. The list is much longer if you add other events.

 

[therealdope]

Those top sprinters and top level NCAA & NFL players are often one and the same. An internet search will provide a long list. Travis Williams, Bob Hayes, Willie Gault, Johnny Jones, et al. I can think of about 15 of them who ran in the Olympics. The list is much longer if you add other events.

To be fair, Johnny 'Lamb' Jones shouldn't count. I mean Richard Todd almost always threw it to the receiver on the other side of the field ... who was blind.

You also left out Jim Hines, Rob Brown, Sam Grady, and Renoldo Nehemiah (and his total of 43 NFL catches).

None of that changes the fact that a group of NCAAFB will NOT pawn sprinters at the WC.

 

[OderusUrungus**]

For people ('tards)that think NCAA football players are A-level athletes who would crush real sprinters, consider that Jeff Demps (Florida) won the NCAA's 60m with 6.56sec and was the alternate to the US 4x100m that didn't even win at 2012 olympics.

Demps is almost certainly the fastest NCAA/NFL player in recent history.

You bit hard homie.

 

[therealdope]

You bit hard homie.

It's hard to tell. There are a lot of people who think that football players are the alphas of all sport.

 

[Groundswell]

To be fair, Johnny 'Lamb' Jones shouldn't count. I mean Richard Todd almost always threw it to the receiver on the other side of the field ... who was blind.

You also left out Jim Hines, Rob Brown, Sam Grady, and Renoldo Nehemiah (and his total of 43 NFL catches).

None of that changes the fact that a group of NCAAFB will NOT pawn sprinters at the WC.

They all count. I left out many because there are so many.

There is much more specialization these days, so maybe not so much anymore, but many of the fastest guys in the world were, in their day, also NCAA or NFL players. This is undeniable.