Social Can homeless people be fined for sleeping outside? A rural Oregon city asks the US Supreme Court

[Blayt7hh]

Good idea. That way if they ever do get a job and try to get back on their feet we can take it from them

 

[Sinister]

Criminalizing human existence. Because freedom.

 

[avenue94]

A few years ago maybe. Not these days, as explained in the next paragraph of my post which you ignored.

And West Virginia does have a pretty bad homeless problem.

It would absolutely get tossed out. You don't seem to understand how laws work or how Due Process intersects with them.

And at any rate, West Virigina has a much lower homeless rate than their drug use rates would imply. The part that you miss/ignore is that there is a strong correlation between drug addiction and homelessness, but not a causation between them. Hence targeting drug addicts does nothing to reduce homelessness.

 

[avenue94]

In the western world, we should be criminalizing politicians for even having homelessness. Not that it should be a free for all, but there's really no excuse for it in the west with all our resources. A war breaks out a million miles away, and the government is all of sudden tripping over billions and billions of dollars that they previously said they didn't have to help their own population, to help another people's population.

Dre Buetow, 48, from northern California, has been living in his car for three years after a bone cancer diagnosis and $450,000 in medical bills. The illness and treatment kept him from returning to his old tree-trimming job, he said.

Laura Gutowski’s husband died from a pulmonary embolism and she suddenly found herself, in her 50s, with no income. They didn’t have life insurance or savings and, within a month, she was sleeping outside in the city she grew up in.

Hmmm, if only there was something we could have done to make sure elderly widows have a safety net and Americans didn't get absolutely assblasted by medical bills.

 

[skysolo]

Novel idea.

If they don't pay, let's house them and feed them 3 times a day and take care of their medical needs in a place, what's it called, jail.

 

[HereticBD]

Hmmm, if only there was something we could have done to make sure elderly widows have a safety net and Americans didn't get absolutely assblasted by medical bills.

Canada, bro. The free healthcare and safety nets are nice, but not a solution. We still have issues with it, regardless.

 

[tenniswhiz]

How do you fine a homeless person?
How do you collect money from someone who is broke?

 

[Poatan Power]

So I worked in stockton for about a decade. people don't go to the homeless shelters because they don't want to relinquish their drugs and liquor, so they end up sleeping in parks, etc. or jamming up local ER's.

Occasionally they migrate to the rural areas surrounding the valley and are swiftly cited for trespassing, loitering, etc etc and they return to the cities where it is allowed.

You have to address mental health. You have to address addiction. These people have options (on a whole) but choose drugs/alcohol or aren't in good enough mental capacity to make good decisions. High prevalence of sex offenses, high prevalence of theft, drug use, etc etc in public parks and ruining neighborhoods.

The biggest mistake people make is thinking homeless people are just down on their luck and being picked on. It's much more nuanced than that and I'd wager the vast majority of people you see on the streets walking about aren't down on their luck, it's a combination of mental health/addiction 3/4 of the time or more.

How do you fine a homeless person?
How do you collect money from someone who is broke?

you don't. it's a fine because it's an infraction, which are punished via fines. you still don't get to repeat the behavior.

 

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

You have to address mental health. You have to address addiction. These people have options (on a whole) but choose drugs/alcohol or aren't in good enough mental capacity to make good decisions. High prevalence of sex offenses, high prevalence of theft, drug use, etc etc in public parks and ruining neighborhoods.

That's what it boils down to.

Addiction is the issue.

 

[Sinister]

So I worked in stockton for about a decade. people don't go to the homeless shelters because they don't want to relinquish their drugs and liquor, so they end up sleeping in parks, etc. or jamming up local ER's.

Occasionally they migrate to the rural areas surrounding the valley and are swiftly cited for trespassing, loitering, etc etc and they return to the cities where it is allowed.

You have to address mental health. You have to address addiction. These people have options (on a whole) but choose drugs/alcohol or aren't in good enough mental capacity to make good decisions. High prevalence of sex offenses, high prevalence of theft, drug use, etc etc in public parks and ruining neighborhoods.

The biggest mistake people make is thinking homeless people are just down on their luck and being picked on. It's much more nuanced than that and I'd wager the vast majority of people you see on the streets walking about aren't down on their luck, it's a combination of mental health/addiction 3/4 of the time or more.



you don't. it's a fine because it's an infraction, which are punished via fines. you still don't get to repeat the behavior.

It's also very difficult to be mentally healthy when you're housing, food, or employment insecure. In many areas of the Country which are riddled with drug addiction, drugs are the only functioning market there, the only economy, or at least, the only easily accessible one.

Then there's the cost of being homeless. I hadn't thought of this until I saw interviews of working homeless people, how much money they have to spend in a week because they dont have basic infrastructure. Have to pay for storage, pay for meals, pay for access to showers, every little thing they want to do is something they have to pay for. Not to mention that a lot of programs for homeless and addicted people have lots of red tape, and in the meantime they are the most vulnerable to crime.

 

[avenue94]

Canada, bro. The free healthcare and safety nets are nice, but not a solution. We still have issues with it, regardless.

Yes, and all people suffer issues, some stub their toes, some get hit by a bus lol

 

[Sinister]

That's what it boils down to.

Addiction is the issue.

Suggesting that addiction is a mere choice is a gross oversimplification of the problem. Most people who suggest this just prefer to write off the homeless and addicted as morally or intellectually inept.

 

[fedorthegoat777]

Obviously the point of a fine wouldn't be to collect the money. Sounds like they're trying to furnish law enforcement with the legal grounds to remove the homeless at their will from places they shouldn't be.

These people are a blight on small town America. That's mentioned in the article. They're littering the ground with thousands of dirty, potentially disease-carrying needles just yards away from playsets built with taxpayer dollars that were meant to be playgrounds for children. That doesn't even mention the trash and pollution they create. My town dredges out many tons of human waste every year because they don't take care of it. Some of this runs off into the river.

So I'm all for it. It's time to get more proactive. It was just so much better for everyone involved when we committed these people to state mental institutions.

Agree.
But these people are homeless. Of course they crap on the ground. Where are they supposed to go? Would it be that hard to put out a few public toilets and trash cans?

Then if they do crap on the ground or leave needles out, fine and jail them. But don't just harass them for being homeless, that doesn't help things.

It must suck enough to live in a tent. Don't need people lighting the tents on fire or something.

 

[Limbo Pete]

Where else are homeless people supposed to sleep lol

 

[Thepaintbucket]

Where else are homeless people supposed to sleep lol

The likely response will be homeless shelters. But what from what I hear it's not always great to live in a shelter. You are living around a bunch of people who are probably on drugs and crazy. Sooner or later you'll get your s*** robbed or be attacked by another bum

 

[Limbo Pete]

The likely response will be homeless shelters. But what from what I hear it's not always great to live in a shelter. You are living around a bunch of people who are probably on drugs and crazy. Sooner or later you'll get your s*** robbed or be attacked by another bum

And at least where I live there's nooooowhere near enough to shelter everyone

 

[NoSmilez]

The issue with homeless people isn't the homelessness. It's all the fucking crimes they commit.

It's a spectrum.

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

I don't know if some you people don't realize. But about 90% of these homeless people are mentally unwell/unstable. No one wants to choose this lifestyle, if they had a choice. A lot of these guys have severe mental illness, so please be more empathetic to their situation.

 

[Cole train]

I still find it crazy that usa doesnt have free healthcare when even poor countries like russia have it and you can end up in trouble only due to health problem

(Of course free healtcare comes out of taxes so not completely free)

 

[Teppodama]

In today's America one must understand the priorities of the government and learn to manipulate and take advantage of those priorities to one's advantage. Maybe they should renounce their citizenship then turn around and claim asylum status as a migrant. The government would likely be much more favorably disposed to providing them housing and other services.