Connor's Coach's Take on Prepping for Khabib

[tekkenfan]

Agree with everything you've said but Eddie Bravo says Tony is also going to play closed guard against Khabib instead of trying to get up.

According to Eddie, people waste their energy trying to get up against Khabib and burn themselves out, so instead Tony is going to attack from bottom.

eddie doesnt understand mma at a top level he thinks closed guard is the answer and it was before 2009 cause most guys in ufc were under purple belt level. but now everyone is brown black belt level so trying to catch guys when theres sweat punches are legal and only having 5 minutes to work not even counting for how long it took for you to get to the ground u may only have 50 seconds to work its a losing game plan

also u cant compare conor to tony as tony is a great grappler leagues above conor so i could see tony actually trying to make it work but conor has nothing form his back at all

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

I’m not sure that many big names want to have their training session filmed and edited to make them look like fools.

 

[biscuitsbrah]

The problem is that in straight up coach speech. Kavanaugh said that Conor won’t accept training partners that can beat him

Lol I know I just quoted you in the other thread, but I think this mentality comes from striking and especially boxing where you don’t necessarily want other high level strikers in with you all the time because you will just go through gym wars and take uneccesary brain damage. Although in grappling you are totally allowed to have guys in the gym better than you as long as they are careful not to hurt you

 

[Dirty Holt]

eddie doesnt understand mma at a top level he thinks closed guard is the answer and it was before 2009 cause most guys in ufc were under purple belt level. but now everyone is brown black belt level so trying to catch guys when theres sweat punches are legal and only having 5 minutes to work not even counting for how long it took for you to get to the ground u may only have 50 seconds to work its a losing game plan

I can assure you with 100% certainty, this isnt true. I came from a gym that had multiple UFC fighters on roster that were successful names, as well as Bellator. Include many UFC and Bellator guys coming through. There were blues and purples that werent even world class that could catch these guys. Many of them are considered good grapplers, with submission finishes in the UFC. I would guess not even 1/2 of the UFC roster is at a brown belt level. Many of them are blue belts at best with athleticism and striking.

I do think he is correct. A black belt level (real black belt, not a black belt you were given for winning MMA fights) closed guard would do serious damage. Maybe not in subs, but in getting to top position. You look at all of the legitimate, proven, black belts in the UFC and they can score from bottom.

 

[tekkenfan]

its very rare to see guys catching subs from the bottom today even at the lower levels i just dont see any examples and yeah lots of guys will get caught by good blues and purples at times but its a different game when the guy on top can hit you

 

[tekkenfan]

it comes down to him not wanting to los en the gym hes a bully type guy

Lol I know I just quoted you in the other thread, but I think this mentality comes from striking and especially boxing where you don’t necessarily want other high level strikers in with you all the time because you will just go through gym wars and take uneccesary brain damage. Although in grappling you are totally allowed to have guys in the gym better than you as long as they are careful not to hurt you

lots of pro guys are like this one guy use to train with was a great striker great boxer for mma and decent dd but every single fight he lost was by choke cause he refused to go get smashed and learn it was his fault at the end his ego was too much

 

[dsdoubled]

Conor supposed to bring in Ben Askren. It's only their arrogance that doesn't allow them to do so. Same thing happened with the Mayweather fight. Literally zero high level boxers or boxing trainers.

Except for the sparring session with Paulie, but yeah they may need to change it up. And this isn't a typical case of a fighter loses and all of us "keyboard warriors" start second guessing the pros. It is pretty much common sense that the only way to prepare for a dominating wrestler is to get dominated by a wrestler.

 

[Uchi Mata]

Agreed. And this isn't hating on Connor or SBG, it was clear he was woefully underprepared to deal with being underneath Khabib. You could tell they worked some TDD but that is only half the problem that needs solving. Even working with a really dangerous/active bottom player with Bjj would've been better than to just try and survive the round (which is what Kavanagh said was the plan).

I don't think that's true at all. He showed great defense on the ground in the first round, Khabib wasn't able to get anything going against him in terms of actually doing damage once he had taken him down. He was doing all the right things. Conor's big problem is he just fatigues really quickly. He was trying to do some of the same things in the second round and just couldn't, and ended up taking a lot of punishment which meant that when Khabib chose to trade on the feet in the third he had no pop on his shots and his timing had gone to shit because he was so tired. Conventional wisdom was that Conor had to hurt him early, or else he would get ground out due to his ineffectiveness in the late rounds and I think that's exactly what happened.

 

[Ishaq]

I don't think that's true at all. He showed great defense on the ground in the first round, Khabib wasn't able to get anything going against him in terms of actually doing damage once he had taken him down. He was doing all the right things. Conor's big problem is he just fatigues really quickly. He was trying to do some of the same things in the second round and just couldn't, and ended up taking a lot of punishment which meant that when Khabib chose to trade on the feet in the third he had no pop on his shots and his timing had gone to shit because he was so tired. Conventional wisdom was that Conor had to hurt him early, or else he would get ground out due to his ineffectiveness in the late rounds and I think that's exactly what happened.

Khabib took him down at will. If he wanted any chance at winning, there's no point in just defending gnp. He was supposed to avoid the takedown altogether long enough for him to light Khabib up.

Defending against gnp is not going to win you a fight. They didn't even call in someone like Askren for 6 months to study the tapes, formulate a gameplan and defend a thousand takedowns a day.

 

[Uchi Mata]

Khabib took him down at will. If he wanted any chance at winning, there's no point in just defending gnp. He was supposed to avoid the takedown altogether long enough for him to light Khabib up.

Defending against gnp is not going to win you a fight. They didn't even call in someone like Askren for 6 months to study the tapes, formulate a gameplan and defend a thousand takedowns a day.

I agree, but that's not what I was responding to. He did well defensively on the ground. That's not the same as saying it would ever be sufficient to win him this sort of fight. He did a pretty poor job of denying Khabib angles to go for TDs or framing off the entries. He also let himself get backed up to the fence in R2 and R4, which is really where Khabib is most dangerous as a TD artist.

Jose Aldo trains (or at least trained) with the Brazilian national wrestling team. GSP did the same in Canada. If you want to learn to stop TDs, you need to train with guys who are fantastic at takedowns. It sounds like Conor trained mainly defense after already being taken down, and both of those showed.

 

[yetanother]

Brazilian national wrestling team. fantastic at takedowns.

Does not compute.

 

[dsdoubled]

I don't think that's true at all. He showed great defense on the ground in the first round, Khabib wasn't able to get anything going against him in terms of actually doing damage once he had taken him down. He was doing all the right things. Conor's big problem is he just fatigues really quickly. He was trying to do some of the same things in the second round and just couldn't, and ended up taking a lot of punishment which meant that when Khabib chose to trade on the feet in the third he had no pop on his shots and his timing had gone to shit because he was so tired. Conventional wisdom was that Conor had to hurt him early, or else he would get ground out due to his ineffectiveness in the late rounds and I think that's exactly what happened.

I hear what youre saying, and I do agree Connor did pretty good in these areas early in the fight. However, Connor gassing was at least in part due to him being underprepared in that position. Obviously everybody is going to gas eventually if theyre spending rounds underneath khabib, Im saying, for a fight with so much at stake, I expected Connor to be better prepared for it in every way i.e. TDD, stalling, escapes, conditioning on bottom, maybe even the occasional threat from bottom, etc.

 

[dsdoubled]

Does not compute.

This was funny. However, in the context of MMA and factoring in the overall grappling ability of many Brazilian wrestlers who also have MMA, BJJ, and/or judo experience, Id say they are capable of teaching MMA guys very good TDD.

 

[Poochie]

its very rare to see guys catching subs from the bottom today even at the lower levels i just dont see any examples and yeah lots of guys will get caught by good blues and purples at times but its a different game when the guy on top can hit you

Before the fight I saw an interview with Dillon Danis where he said Khabib's grappling was low level because he never passes the guard and this got me thinking, does it even matter if you don't pass full or half guard if you can strike? So few people finish from the bottom in high level MMA. There is Brian Ortega, Anthony Pettis and maybe another couple of guys but otherwise you're seeing very few submissions from guard.

 

[tekkenfan]

Before the fight I saw an interview with Dillon Danis where he said Khabib's grappling was low level because he never passes the guard and this got me thinking, does it even matter if you don't pass full or half guard if you can strike? So few people finish from the bottom in high level MMA. There is Brian Ortega, Anthony Pettis and maybe another couple of guys but otherwise you're seeing very few submissions from guard.

but thats not true khabib passes the guard alot he passed conors lol he just does what he think is best n that current position

 

[Uchi Mata]

I hear what youre saying, and I do agree Connor did pretty good in these areas early in the fight. However, Connor gassing was at least in part due to him being underprepared in that position. Obviously everybody is going to gas eventually if theyre spending rounds underneath khabib, Im saying, for a fight with so much at stake, I expected Connor to be better prepared for it in every way i.e. TDD, stalling, escapes, conditioning on bottom, maybe even the occasional threat from bottom, etc.

I think his gassing fast may just be who he is as a fighter. He does it every long fight, I have to assume he's training the way he should for long fights but he just seems to blow his wad early every time.

 

[Uchi Mata]

Before the fight I saw an interview with Dillon Danis where he said Khabib's grappling was low level because he never passes the guard and this got me thinking, does it even matter if you don't pass full or half guard if you can strike? So few people finish from the bottom in high level MMA. There is Brian Ortega, Anthony Pettis and maybe another couple of guys but otherwise you're seeing very few submissions from guard.

Khabib's grappling is top notch. He passes guard all the time, but that's not really the point. The reason you pass guard in MMA is so that you can damage a guy with strikes. There are other positions like top turtle or top half where you can also control a guy and land a lot of strikes, Khabib is rightfully happy to sit in those positions and do damage rather than spend time passing and not striking. What Khabib really does is ride people. Guard passing can be an aspect of that, but it's not necessary. Keep them down, strike when it's hard for them to defend or counter attack, that's all that matters.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Maybe even Maia. Different games but he would be better than Danis imo

Damian would’ve been good to get him use to Been grinded... Damian’s path to mount are not the same nor is his control, but no doubt would’ve been great to have someone as Damian at his camp

 

[Ishaq]

Khabib's grappling is top notch. He passes guard all the time, but that's not really the point. The reason you pass guard in MMA is so that you can damage a guy with strikes. There are other positions like top turtle or top half where you can also control a guy and land a lot of strikes, Khabib is rightfully happy to sit in those positions and do damage rather than spend time passing and not striking. What Khabib really does is ride people. Guard passing can be an aspect of that, but it's not necessary. Keep them down, strike when it's hard for them to defend or counter attack, that's all that matters.

Khabib's grappling is great but his passing is just good. He doesn't have Demian Maia passing. I read in another thread that Khabib passes Dillon Danis guard with ease. I have to reject this assertion. At best Khabib rides Danis, but he doesn't pass.

 

[tekkenfan]

he doesnt

Khabib's grappling is great but his passing is just good. He doesn't have Demian Maia passing. I read in another thread that Khabib passes Dillon Danis guard with ease. I have to reject this assertion. At best Khabib rides Danis, but he doesn't pass.

need maia passing as he has the bets gnp int he game and he is stronger and has better control riding than maia does maia doesnt have good gnp he is very passive khabib isnt hes a crusher so mix his gnp in with passing makes him a super force

tbh passing today vs good guys isnt always good thats why maia lose position at times being in half guard is great cause u can hold them by turking the leg ect and beat the hell out of them and grind