Gracie Combatives/Helio Gracie Self Defense is just plain old Marketing Scam to get Clients

[Cinta Negra]

A lie told once remains a lie but a lie told a thousand times becomes the truth.

To many in those Cult like academies, this lie is not a lie, but a very strong belief. Ever tried having a convo with a member from those Self Defense Only academies? It's like arguing with a Jehovahs Witness...

 

[Rico]

 

[Cinta Negra]

Obviously you get it. But you will be surprised by the large numbers of followers that don't know this, and will probably never even see this post. They are encouraged to not even get into these rooms, convos etc.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

you were part of what? and what is it exactly that you are bitching about? anyone with a brain realizes that helios 36 SD is pure uttterly bs. Well, its part of the art, but aint making you a fighter.

Modern combatives though, its a great program for fighting, or SD or whatever you want to call it.

 

[Which Doctor]

If Helio was such a scam artist, how did he become one of the best judoka the world has ever known?

 

[Papawash]

I train at a team that competes regularly but I sometimes watch their vids. Gotta admit that the bros, especially Rener, are really good at marketing their stuff.

That's their niche in the market and can't hate them on that, but it can also be dangerous as dudes can go out on the streets all pumped up by knowing 36 lethal moves lol

 

[Rico]

Obviously you get it. But you will be surprised by the large numbers of followers that don't know this, and will probably never even see this post. They are encouraged to not even get into these rooms, convos etc.

This forum isn't full of a bunch of GJJ white belts. You're essentially beating a dead horse to a crowd of relatively experienced grapplers of various disciplines.

 

[Matsukaze]

Not this again!!

 

[BJJ_Rage]

I train at a team that competes regularly but I sometimes watch their vids. Gotta admit that the bros, especially Rener, are really good at marketing their stuff.

That's their niche in the market and can't hate them on that, but it can also be dangerous as dudes can go out on the streets all pumped up by knowing 36 lethal moves lol

New combatives has very little to do with being able to do Helios 36 sd techniques

 

[Ton]

You're getting alot of hate, but I'm curious to hear about your experience and how you've personally arrived at this realization.

 

[Big Nasty Edison]

I train at a team that competes regularly but I sometimes watch their vids. Gotta admit that the bros, especially Rener, are really good at marketing their stuff.

That's their niche in the market and can't hate them on that, but it can also be dangerous as dudes can go out on the streets all pumped up by knowing 36 lethal moves lol

This is the "Gracie Combatives" curriculum taught by Rener and Ryron.

Lesson 1: Trap and Roll Escape
Lesson 2: Americana Armlock
Lesson 3: Positional Control (Mount)
Lesson 4: Take the Back (Mount)
Lesson 5: Rear Naked Choke
Lesson 6: Leg Hook Takedown
Lesson 7: Clinch (Aggressive Opponent)
Lesson 8: Punch Block Series (Stages 1-4)
Lesson 9: Straight Armlock (Mount)
Lesson 10: Triangle Choke
Lesson 11: Elevator Sweep
Lesson 12: Elbow Escape (Mount)
Lesson 13: Positional Control (Side Mount)
Lesson 14: Body Fold Takedown
Lesson 15: Clinch (Conservative Opponent)
Lesson 16: Headlock Counters
Lesson 17: Double Leg Takedown
Lesson 18: Headlock Escape 1
Lesson 19: Straight Armlock (Guard)
Lesson 20: Double Ankle Sweep
Lesson 21: Pull Guard
Lesson 22: Headlock Escape 2
Lesson 23: Guillotine Choke
Lesson 24: Shrimp Escape
Lesson 25: Kimura Armlock
Lesson 26: Standing Headlock Defense
Lesson 27: Punch Block Series (Stage 5)
Lesson 28: Hook Sweep
Lesson 29: Rear Takedown
Lesson 30: Haymaker Punch Defense
Lesson 31: Take the Back (Guard)
Lesson 32: Guillotine Defense
Lesson 33: Elbow Escape (Side Mount)
Lesson 34: Standing Armlock
Lesson 35: Twisting Arm Control
Lesson 36: Double Underhook Guard Pass

 

[BJJChess]

Just another hater... stand in the line, man

 

[Cinta Negra]

Just another hater... stand in the line, man

Not a hater dude, I'm not hating on anyone in particular, just the SD marketing that's all. I was very much in the system. I was an instructor in their system. Everyone here post their opinion from the outside. I'm giving mine from the inside. I can rebuttal every comment posted above but I'm not here to get into arguments or disagreements, just informing those that are on the fence.

 

[Cinta Negra]

If Helio was such a scam artist, how did he become one of the best jodoka the world has ever known?

Nobody is discrediting Master Helio Gracie's contribution and part creation to our beloved art, but this post isn't about HG. This is about some certian schools saying that only SD Schools like G.A. teach real Jiujitsu completely geared toward SD, and all other BJJ schools are only geared toward sport, and wont teach you how to defend yourself. That isnt true at all. If you train at a good school, after just a few months, even a year you'll be able to defend yourself agaisnt a non jits street attacker just as easily. Thats the point. Jiujitsu is Jiujitsu.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Nobody is discrediting Master Helio Gracie's contribution and part creation to our beloved art, but this post isn't about HG. This is about some certian schools saying that only SD Schools like G.A. teach real Jiujitsu completely geared toward SD, and all other BJJ schools are only geared toward sport, and wont teach you how to defend yourself. That isnt true at all. If you train at a good school, after just a few months, even a year you'll be able to defend yourself agaisnt a non jits street attacker just as easily. Thats the point. Jiujitsu is Jiujitsu.

99% of the whole bjj comunity knows this.

 

[Pixelated Porn]

Not a hater dude, I'm not hating on anyone in particular, just the SD marketing that's all.

Show me ONE SCHOOL that does not have self defense listed on their website. ATOS does, MG does, and on and on. Every fucking one of them. Gracie academies are the only ones that act like punching even exists.

But I take it you are today's new worthless troll.

 

[SummerStriker]

Most people do martial arts to shore up their feelings of insecurity. It might be insecurity regarding safety (SD) or insecurity of manliness (Combat Sport). Only a small portion of people do SD out of a love of the arts, or combat sports for the thrill of conflict or fun of the game.

It is like the difference between feeling self actualized by lifting weights, and lifting weights because you are insecure about your power lifting total and what that says about you.

Martial arts instructors know this, and market heavily to people's insecurities.

The fact that combat sport athletes are so fucking insecure about their manliness explains why they get tied in knots over someone claiming they know more about self defense.

"Nuh uh! I could take him. Can't everyone see that it is I who could actually take him?!"

Please. Bitching about this looks weak.

 

[The Persian Prince]

You're getting alot of hate, but I'm curious to hear about your experience and how you've personally arrived at this realization.

Can't speak for his experience but in mine every move taught in combatives was geared towards street defense hence made less effective for actual grappling (look at the gracie variation of a double leg for example) combatives also has no rolling after class i understand that it's geared towards self defense but if your a guy who wants to train competitively it's extremely annoying.

Once in the master cycle level rolling is only the last 10-15min of class and I had several guys literally do nothing (blue belts) but sit in my guard in a defensive shell the entire time because they take the "react to your opponent and make your move" to an extreme an did literally nothing I opened my guard with zero grips just to get the one guy to do something and it took a couple minutes at Blue belt.

 

[Cinta Negra]

All you guys have valid points. I'm not hear arguing. I wrote this because I got into a discussion on another forum about this topic. Hence my post. I'm new here so not trying to create any hate. I only thought some would be interested in what an actual academy instructor like myself thinks of current SD programs at any school compared to the Gracie Combatives taught at a Gracie Jiujitsu school.

 

[Lamfadha]

If Haymaker defence isn't lesson number one you fucked up in teaching your students how to defend themselves from the majority of attacks that aren't sexual. Well apart from stressing running.

Getting up from the ground is number two, running sprints and around the block is number three, positional control number four. In order of priorities.......
Also if your attacker uses any straight punches run like shit you aren't beating him he has likely trained stand up for 2-3 years cause for the first two years people don't punch straight without flaring elbows.

Well that is my opinion at least I could be wrong.