how would you improve group classes such as crossfit?

[MMouse]

Crossfit classes are notorious for injuries. I assume this is the case of cookie cutter workouts or one size fits all.

How would you go abouts imroving it? Or if crossfit classes are wrong to begin with?

Like to hear some feedback

 

[ben236]

There are pros and cons about classes in general. Let's not just keep this exclusive to Crossfit.

The pros are that being surrounded by like-minded individuals with a common goal which can be very motivating for some. Meeting new people, making new friends, keeping each other accountable, healthy competition. All of these things can motivate people and keep people working out who just wouldn't stick with it otherwise. I've found that it's especially effective for women who seem to get a lot more out of the social aspect of fitness than men do in general. Which to Crossfit's credit, they have nailed down.

The cons are non-personalized programs. You are subject to the exercises of the trainer who is thinking about the class in general when programming his workouts and not necessarily you in particular. Sure, a good class trainer will make sure there are modifications to the exercises he implements (eg. pushups on the knees for beginner, clapping pushups for advanced), but you would get a lot more out of your workouts if your program was more tailored to your particular needs. There's also the risk that despite even having modifications to certain exercises, that you'll still have people who aren't in good enough shape (or don't have good enough form) to perform the workouts increasing the likelihood of injury. Which is a problem in Crossfit.

 

[obroin]

There are pros and cons about classes in general. Let's not just keep this exclusive to Crossfit.

The pros are that being surrounded by like-minded individuals with a common goal which can be very motivating for some. Meeting new people, making new friends, keeping each other accountable, healthy competition. All of these things can motivate people and keep people working out who just wouldn't stick with it otherwise. I've found that it's especially effective for women who seem to get a lot more out of the social aspect of fitness than men do in general. Which to Crossfit's credit, they have nailed down.

The cons are non-personalized programs. You are subject to the exercises of the trainer who is thinking about the class in general when programming his workouts and not necessarily you in particular. Sure, a good class trainer will make sure there are modifications to the exercises he implements (eg. pushups on the knees for beginner, clapping pushups for advanced), but you would get a lot more out of your workouts if your program was more tailored to your particular needs. There's also the risk that despite even having modifications to certain exercises, that you'll still have people who aren't in good enough shape (or don't have good enough form) to perform the workouts increasing the likelihood of injury. Which is a problem in Crossfit.

I agree with everything you said. I work out at a Crossfit gym, and I watch a lot of the classes (there are some gorgeous girls there.) I think the biggest thing that these classes lack is a consisten, progressive strength base. The classes I watch have a "strength" portion before the WOD, but I would never call these sections a strength program. The lifts and weight selection are seemingly arbitrary and random, which is the exact opposite of progression. If you miss a workout or two, you might not do a squat variation for a month or more. And worse, these "strength" sections sometimes devolve into mini WOD's themselves. I remember one workout was

Deadlift 6-8 reps, 45 sec rest
Pull ups 6-8 reps, 45 sec rest
Handstand Push Ups, 6-8 reps, 45 sec rest

Repeat 5 times. No percentages of max given, no goal, nothing. That was supposed to be the strength section, before they went into a WOD with high rep deadlifts and other stuff. I get the idea of met cons and circuits for conditioning, eat your heart out with that and make them as random as you want. But leave the "strength" section to a dedicated progression of sorts.

The other problem I see a lot is basically with technique. The number of shitty cleans, squats, and overhead squats I've seen is incredible. And the coaches do little to correct them. Or, they emphasize "correct" technique, but fail to account for differences in flexibility or body shape. I understand the "push hard" mentality, but the coaches should be stopping anyone doing quarter overhead squats with inward buckling knees and fix the technique with light weight, instead of letting them go as hard as they want.

 

[Eric Brown]

I would have people quit doing crossfit and return to methods that work with lower injury rates.

 

[Tosa]

I think there's a couple of ideas in the question, and that they need to be considered individually. Although you could just say Eric is right, if you want a short answer.

First, is the "programming" of Crossfit. Which has been done to death, and I feel no need to go over it again, beyond to say that while I can understand someone being interested in being generally "fit", however that may be defined, rather than training for something specific, I don't believe Crossfit is a good or safe way to go about it.

Second, is conflating group classes with a group atmosphere. I pretty much always train with other people - it's a very social group, and it's motivating and a lot of fun. But everyone does their own training. Which is how it should be. A lack of individualized programming in group exercise really just makes it a way to accumulate more total physical activity.

 

[miaou]

I would segregate beginner, intermediate and advanced trainees, and would require them to go through some sort of training/assessment to proceed to the next level.

For example, I might have a very simple/basic exercise selection, with loads/WODs unlikely to injure anyone, for beginners, and would require them to demonstrate proficiency in the movements before advancing to intermediate. For the ones who just can't get form down I would offer the option of personal instruction and would allow them to stay in the beginner groups, but not allow them to advance.

For intermediate trainees, their WODs, I might replace "hard exercises" for easier ones (for example, if a person can't clean properly, I'd have them deadlift, or some shit like that) until they can show they can perform the exercise safely. They would be required to showcase a fair degree of proficiency before proceeding to advanced (again, private instruction, or maybe small group training in things like oly lifting could be options).

Advanced would be people who are fairly proficient in the technique of pretty much all the lifts.


Basically, I would work in segregation, scaling, personalization and basic requirements for each level.

 

[AggieBoy]

Get rid of the Olympic lifts.

If you wanted to design a class to injure people, taking untrained people with no technique and have them do olympic lifts to failure and try to beat the guy next to them doing the same would be hard to top.

I would think the fad has already peaked anyway. Lazy and unmotivated people I'm sure are looking for the next fix.

Football teams have already given us the model for group lifting.

 

[MMouse]

Good advice hear so far. So I guess it's safe to say group lifting done properly should have anyone lifting on their own pace but having an instructor/ coach go around for guidance? rather then having a fixed time work:rest for everybody.

Quick question. What is WOD's?

 

[ironwolf]

-not having people getting paralyzed during their oly lifts is a good start.

-dont have people oly lift to failure

-get to know clients and get to know where they are at so you can get a good progression program with them.

-spend 10x more time going over technique

-dont make people lift heavy for time

-dont make people lift heavy for time

-dont make people lift heavy for time.....

 

[BorisTheSpider]

I would segregate beginner, intermediate and advanced trainees, and would require them to go through some sort of training/assessment to proceed to the next level.

For example, I might have a very simple/basic exercise selection, with loads/WODs unlikely to injure anyone, for beginners, and would require them to demonstrate proficiency in the movements before advancing to intermediate. For the ones who just can't get form down I would offer the option of personal instruction and would allow them to stay in the beginner groups, but not allow them to advance.

For intermediate trainees, their WODs, I might replace "hard exercises" for easier ones (for example, if a person can't clean properly, I'd have them deadlift, or some shit like that) until they can show they can perform the exercise safely. They would be required to showcase a fair degree of proficiency before proceeding to advanced (again, private instruction, or maybe small group training in things like oly lifting could be options).

Advanced would be people who are fairly proficient in the technique of pretty much all the lifts.


Basically, I would work in segregation, scaling, personalization and basic requirements for each level.

This would be unlikely to happen, because there is no way to make money doing it this way (the correct way). The beginners would want to advance to keep shelling out money for classes. While sad and dangerous, it is still very true.

 

[redaxe]

Having a small group powerlifting class would be kinda cool. Are there any gyms that even have such a thing?

I guess Crossfit places used to have "Starting Strength class" back when Rippetoe was affiliated with them.

 

[ben236]

Having a small group powerlifting class would be kinda cool. Are there any gyms that even have such a thing?

I guess Crossfit places used to have "Starting Strength class" back when Rippetoe was affiliated with them.

TBF, the Crossfit model is so decentralized that it's impossible to paint them all with a broad brush. Take a level 1 cert (which is just a weekend long), open a gym and pay the annual fee. The rest is pretty much up to the gym owner to run the place as he sees fit. Because of this, you do have plenty of Crossfit gyms opened by people who have extensive Oly lift backgrounds, and do put a lot of focus on form and low reps based off of 1RMs.

Of course, you also have the opposite. With people who have no idea what the fuck they're doing resulting in stupid shit like this:

 

[Seriously-Dead]

I would segregate beginner, intermediate and advanced trainees, and would require them to go through some sort of training/assessment to proceed to the next level.

For example, I might have a very simple/basic exercise selection, with loads/WODs unlikely to injure anyone, for beginners, and would require them to demonstrate proficiency in the movements before advancing to intermediate. For the ones who just can't get form down I would offer the option of personal instruction and would allow them to stay in the beginner groups, but not allow them to advance.

For intermediate trainees, their WODs, I might replace "hard exercises" for easier ones (for example, if a person can't clean properly, I'd have them deadlift, or some shit like that) until they can show they can perform the exercise safely. They would be required to showcase a fair degree of proficiency before proceeding to advanced (again, private instruction, or maybe small group training in things like oly lifting could be options).

Advanced would be people who are fairly proficient in the technique of pretty much all the lifts.


Basically, I would work in segregation, scaling, personalization and basic requirements for each level.

This is exactly how two of the biggest Crossfit gyms in my city work already (well, four gyms actually - but three of them are owned by the same people). It's how most CF gyms work that have people who compete in the higher levels of Crossfit (regionals, to the games).

 

[Tosa]

Having a small group powerlifting class would be kinda cool. Are there any gyms that even have such a thing?

My gym does a few powerlifting and weightlifting clinics a year. Beyond that, people just have to ask for help - get to know the other members, and let them know they're receptive to advice.

 

[Dan O]

This is exactly how two of the biggest Crossfit gyms in my city work already (well, four gyms actually - but three of them are owned by the same people). It's how most CF gyms work that have people who compete in the higher levels of Crossfit (regionals, to the games).

This is very accurate from what I've seen. As a gym grows and becomes more competitive they tend to segregate their ability levels. Which is possible on a "class" level from a business perspective when there are enough of the athletes at that level.

 

[M1ksondong]

Quick question. What is WOD's?[/QUOTE]


Workout Of the Day. It's the workout that the group does that day. If you get it from 'crossfit central' (or whatever it's called), it's the thing that allows you to compete with other 'crossfitters' in other cities/countries, etc....

 

[Wikinger]

Quick question. What is WOD's?

Workout Of the Day. It's the workout that the group does that day. If you get it from 'crossfit central' (or whatever it's called), it's the thing that allows you to compete with other 'crossfitters' in other cities/countries, etc....[/QUOTE]

yep. but it's my understanding that most gyms do their own programming (ahem. ymmv), if you wanna call it that and that competition folks have their own specialized (ahem. ymmv) programming.

*basks in the irony of the above*

cheers