MMA NEEDS A "standing 8 count" ? FEDOR vs Bader

Well, first of all, to have a standing 8-count you have to be standing....
 
-guerilla- said:
how can you tell?
mir didn't twitch a muscle after the first of 7 strikes?

Mir was down on all fours so it diddent look as bad

to the Layman it looks a lot worse if your on your back like fedor was.

fedor was perfectly conscious immediately after the ref crawled off him...that was a crap stoppage
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I'm not sure I've ever seen someone this delusional before
 
-guerilla- said:
So why wouldn't it work?

Should they get rid of it in boxing?
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I didn't speak to whether it would work or not, I said it was a horrible idea. The reason I think that is that it's a combat sport and the fighter who knocks his opponent down shouldn't lose the advantage by having a " time out " which is a chance for their opponent to recover. It's an artificial construct which is not necessary and takes the sport one more step away from real combat.
Personally I don't think it's a good rule in either MMA or boxing. If you are unable to continue at the moment you are knocked down then the fight should be over.
 
Ling Ling said:
I didn't speak to whether it would work or not, I said it was a horrible idea. The reason I think that is that it's a combat sport and the fighter who knocks his opponent down shouldn't lose the advantage by having a " time out " which is a chance for their opponent to recover. It's an artificial construct which is not necessary and takes the sport one more step away from real combat.
Personally I don't think it's a good rule in either MMA or boxing. If you are unable to continue at the moment you are knocked down then the fight should be over.
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It would be impossible to do in mma because ground fighting is a part of the sport, unlike boxing.
 
Pride style combat attitudes are never gonna transfer well to the American MMA tourneys, Fedor is conditioned to the non American theory in combat sports...they don't stop fights nearly as quick.

Fedor has always fought with a wild kamikaze attack style I thought was terrible and recklessly aggressive

In pride you can get away with this style because they don't stop fights so quickly.

That's why he was so entertaining to watch

in the NERFED American tournaments "knockDOWNS" ARE knockOUTS these days!

That's why I stopped ordering PPV a long time ago.

People who are "out cold" need help to stand and converse...Fedor was never out.

But I completely understand how shocking and scary that looked to the layman. Prob really scared the casual fanboy thats never been in a fight be4....
Plus all that blood!
If your a fake wrestling fanboy that kind of stuff is intense...no costumes and ketchup packets in MMA, even the NERFED American tournaments.

You can see the "progression" as Dana White systematically turned against his original referees In the systematic nerfing of the UFC.

Try to avoid watching MMA like pride, vale tudo and OG UFC....you might need therapy to stop having nightmares.

Guys in turtle with a full cover get "stopped" after they get 3 unanswered punches!

Like I said before this is just biased refereeing and our softer PC world.

Bader knows how to play the game, have to give him that...as soon as he covered Fador he diddent try to throw big punches but went into "wack a mole" mode, everybody knows they stop fights on little hammer fists these days. Smart fighter...

Fedor was PERFECTLY fine off that first flash knock down but the second shot was really good... ref may have panicked and jumped or was told to stop it on 1st opportunity for the franchise fighter.

You can halt a fight and give a fighter an assessment without changing position or or standing them up.

The reason I use quotation marks and question marks in my original thread title is because I'm not advocating for a actual standing 8 count EXACTLY like in boxing.
But a modified version where a ref cannot stop a fight without an assessment of the fighter

I'm suggesting its the next logistically plausible step in the NERFING of MMA in the USA....some seriously dense responses to this thread.
 
Only Here for Attachments said:
Standing 8-counts would make CTE rates skyrocket
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the standing 8 count was introduced to boxing as a safety measure and to combat the accusations of biased referees

however many in the boxing industry suggested they would have the opposite effect on safety

Thank for an intelligent response!
 
Lmao at people saying early stoppage..get over it pride fan boys he's washed up and got beat up by a Tuf winner lol
 
TankvsNelmark said:
Lmao at people saying early stoppage..get over it pride fan boys he's washed up and got beat up by a Tuf winner lol
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It's perfectly understandable how someone with minimal exposure to worldwide MMA would consider this NOT an early stoppage.

American MMA fans have been conditioned to accept referee stoppages on the first knockdown.

This is really great for the promoters as long as the fans don't stop buying the pay-per-views.

it's definitely safer, plus it produces a bunch of exciting knockout highlight reel footage because you don't see the guy that just got "knocked out" stand up and showing that they are perfectly capable of continuing the fight.

Most of the greatest fights in world history contain several knockdowns on both parties and I would suggest that we will not be able to see this level of combat in American mixed martial arts in the future if the fans except a knockdown as a knockout.

Fodor's lost to Matt mitrione was 100% legitimate as a stoppage because when mitrione landed his follow-ups fedors arms went limp and he was unable to defend himself... Matt landed 7 or 8 punches AFTER the knockdown And you can clearly see fedors arms go limp, that's what made the ref stopped the fight.

In contrast Bader only landed four punches total and only two of them had any concussive impact.

For those of you that have never been in a stoppage like this when the referee is covering the fighters you're supposed to stop striking... the ref jumped in there and covered the fighters on the second punch and fador never went limp he simply held his position plus his arms were never limp.

so whether or not fador was able to fight back is a subjective call.... we will never know... but since the man never went limp and there are only two pumches that had any real impact my call is this was an unfortunate early stoppage and should justify an automatic rematch.

That or MMA needs to seriously consider not allowing referees to stop fights but to only halt them for an assessment.

This is the new softer safer PC social justice Warrior approved Nerfed MMA theory and practice...

For God's sake the man was standing up and talking to the referee five seconds after the fight got waived off.

The Mitrione loss was a hundred percent legitimate

the Dan Henderson loss was debatable, I think that Fedor could have continued but I can see why the ref stoped the fight...Fedor got hit went limp and took two more heavy punches to the back of the head

however this Bader stoppage was one of the worst I've seen in MMA
 
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I love it!!

only in 2019 can a "knockedout" fighter get to his feet before the referee
https://www.mmamania.com/2019/1/27/...bader-bellator-214-heavyweight-grand-prix-mma

Here's another photo that illustrates how early of a stop this was... fedors hands and knees were up in a counter grappling posture and his head is off the mat as the ref is stopping the fight.... this should be grounds for an automatic rematch

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2019/1/...ges-697000-viewers-peaks-1-2-million-mma-news
 
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-guerilla- said:
It's perfectly understandable how someone with minimal exposure to worldwide MMA would consider this NOT an early stoppage.

American MMA fans have been conditioned to accept referee stoppages on the first knockdown.

This is really great for the promoters as long as the fans don't stop buying the pay-per-views.

it's definitely safer, plus it produces a bunch of exciting knockout highlight reel footage because you don't see the guy that just got "knocked out" stand up and showing that they are perfectly capable of continuing the fight.

Most of the greatest fights in world history contain several knockdowns on both parties and I would suggest that we will not be able to see this level of combat in American mixed martial arts in the future if the fans except a knockdown as a knockout.

Fodor's lost to Matt mitrione was 100% legitimate as a stoppage because when mitrione landed his follow-ups fedors arms went limp and he was unable to defend himself... Matt landed 7 or 8 punches AFTER the knockdown And you can clearly see fedors arms go limp, that's what made the ref stopped the fight.

In contrast Bader only landed four punches total and only two of them had any concussive impact.

For those of you that have never been in a stoppage like this when the referee is covering the fighters you're supposed to stop striking... the ref jumped in there and covered the fighters on the second punch and fador never went limp he simply held his position plus his arms were never limp.

so whether or not fador was able to fight back is a subjective call.... we will never know... but since the man never went limp and there are only two pumches that had any real impact my call is this was an unfortunate early stoppage and should justify an automatic rematch.

That or MMA needs to seriously consider not allowing referees to stop fights but to only halt them for an assessment.

This is the new softer safer PC social justice Warrior approved Nerfed MMA theory and practice...

For God's sake the man was standing up and talking to the referee five seconds after the fight got waived off.

The Mitrione loss was a hundred percent legitimate

the Dan Henderson loss was debatable, I think that Fedor could have continued but I can see why the ref stoped the fight...Fedor got hit went limp and took two more heavy punches to the back of the head

however this Bader stoppage was one of the worst I've seen in MMA
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Hahahahahaahahahahahhahahahahah please sir it's time to put the pipe down and go to bed
 
TankvsNelmark said:
Hahahahahaahahahahahhahahahahah please sir it's time to put the pipe down and go to bed
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You know your probably correct, this is not an early stoppage by today's standards.

I come from an earlier time in MMA and in watching some recent international events I saw some one knockdown stoppages as well.

Seems to be the norm in modern mma competition...

I've noticed that the call-outs seem to be more organized and in the fake wrestling Style

Seems like something that'll go over big time, maybe one day they'll have fake MMA.
 
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Ling Ling said:
I didn't speak to whether it would work or not, I said it was a horrible idea. The reason I think that is that it's a combat sport and the fighter who knocks his opponent down shouldn't lose the advantage by having a " time out " which is a chance for their opponent to recover. It's an artificial construct which is not necessary and takes the sport one more step away from real combat.
Personally I don't think it's a good rule in either MMA or boxing. If you are unable to continue at the moment you are knocked down then the fight should be over.
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ok but HOW do you determine if they can continue or not without taking a few seconds to access them...

just remember what we are giving up with this quick stoppage mentality.

you will never see this again:
 
Fedor v Bader - wouldn't it have been a lying 8 count?! What a fucking thread.
<BirdieOwn>
 
-guerilla- said:
ok but HOW do you determine if they can continue or not without taking a few seconds to access them...

just remember what we are giving up with this quick stoppage mentality.

you will never see this again:
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Was different, watch Fedor's face and arms, Kongo at least rolled, you need to show quickly some defence
 
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-guerilla- said:
Fedor vs Bader:
there were 4 punches total. One flash knockdown off the lunging hook, one good follow up and 2 egg cracker hammer fists.

The ref was on Fedor about the same time the follow up was landed. He was entangled with the ref as Bader dropped his egg crackers.

IN CONTRAST
Mir took a hook that flashed him down and then took 6 full power hooks to the face b4 the same ref stopped that fight!

PLUS mir stayed completely still (like a heavybag) while Fedor was counter grappling and sitting up!

BAD STOPPAGE!

Fedor is a hyper aggressive fighter (thats why he gets hit) and thats the reason hes so exciting!

Its not his Age, hes not washed up, hes from a different era, or perhaps they are trying to push Bader...hes their franchise, Fedor was on his last contract fight!

If Fedor won they would have to negotiate with him...
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Fedor is a twice retired fighter, and a beloved legend, with possibly hundreds of combat sport bouts (MMA and Sambo) already behind him. Imagine what it would look like for Bellator and the AC if Fedor got seriously hurt because of a late stoppage? There would be outrage! Was he out? No. Was he out against Henderson? No. Crap stoppage vs Bigfoot? Of course. We know he doesn't get a fair shake in the USA. But this was all about protecting the brand.

On the other hand, did he lay down? Fedor did not throw a punch... 80 year old Fedor gets in a shot.
 
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