Rating Bernard Hopkins career?

[deucesarewild]

The thing that was impressive about Foreman in his 40s isn't what he did but the revealation about how badly he would have beaten the 90s HWs if they were the same age. Hopkins success at 45-50 was just that success at 45-50 it didn't put past dominance into perspective because he didn't have it.

Hopkins greatness comes from stopping Trinidad and De La Hoya when they came up to MW rather than how good a MW or LHW he was. Thats really were his hype comes from

The weird thing about both those fights is that Trinidad was a 3 to 1 favourite to beat Hopkins and I don't think he won a round. Years later, an inactive De LA Hoya looks way better against Hopkins and actually wins some rounds. That always made me raise an eyebrow. Not a big deal I guess, though.

 

[deucesarewild]

Respectable resume but he embarrassed himself repeatedly in the ring and said dumb racist shit. I have little respect for him, honestly.

Yeah, that racist crap was unnecessary. I don't get how he could get away with it. It affects my opinion a bit, too, even though the old man could fight.

 

[Hagler]

The weird thing about both those fights is that Trinidad was a 3 to 1 favourite to beat Hopkins and I don't think he won a round. Years later, an inactive De LA Hoya looks way better against Hopkins and actually wins some rounds. That always made me raise an eyebrow. Not a big deal I guess, though.

Well, I'm a big Tito fan but I do believe the DLH fight showed us that Oscar was the better boxer (I 'm not mad at the decision BTW as Oscar shouldn't have coasted).

 

[Jonny Ninja]

I'm not a fan of Hopkins, cause he often used the hit and hold tactic. But I have him as a top ten middleweight.

My issue was his fighting style. He’s was a dirty fighter, I didnt like his fighting style either but it was clearly affective. He’s not someone who’s fights I’ll ever rewatch if I’m being honest

 

[iwannabeadored]

What Hopkins achieved after 40 is amazing.

Agreed. For that guy to say Hopkins greatness comes from what he did against Trinidad and de la Hoya is absolutely dog shit statement. To be an elite boxer in your 40s below heavyweight has never been done..


Heavyweights are proven in both mma and boxing to last far longer. Power is the last to go.


Mw and lhw have some real athletes and for him to compete and be elite is a testament to his greatness.


To win a title at 48 is beyond boxing, that’s ahead of Brady as far as longevity goes.

Lebron is going to have to play another 9 years to do what Bernard did in a far more dangerous sport


The dude took kovalev to a decision when he was fucking 50 years old. Fucking insanity.

 

[William Munny]

all time great, incredible career, especially in terms of longevity.

And it's awesome how smart he was with the long game (post fight career), and didn't end up broke like so many other pugilists.

 

[biomed190]

ATG, Got to see him fight a couple of times live. He had a technique where he would pound guys on their hips opposite of where the ref was. It seemed to be pretty effective in taking his opponents legs away later in fights.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

To win a title at 48 is beyond boxing, that’s ahead of Brady as far as longevity goes.

It's insane but also slightly exaggerated. Bernard's LHW title reign wins/defenses at 48-49 years old were realistically B-level guys (Cloud, Murat & Shumenov). Two of them just happened to have alphabet titles. When Bernard did step up at that advanced age to an actual A-level guy he got shut out.

You really can't directly compare boxing to football. They're completely different. The only thing they have in common is that they're both popular full-contact sports. Like Bernard, what Brady did has also never been done. Winning NFL championships in your 40s, and being crowned Super Bowl MVP at that, is unfathomable. Especially since he took the worst team in the NFL to the top in his very first season. The Bucs hadn't even gone to the playoffs in 14 seasons. Brady's detractors claimed that the only reason he won so many Super Bowls was because of all those great teammates he had on the Pats. Well, he debunked that theory as soon as he left and joined the Bucs. The Pats have been a real joke ever since. In reality, Brady was the Patriots.

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

I don't know about his rating, but I have mad respects for what he's done in boxing.

 

[Sullen Drunkard]

If in order to stop you we need prime Roy Jones, i think you are ATG material

 

[iwannabeadored]

It's insane but also slightly exaggerated. Bernard's LHW title reign wins/defenses at 48-49 years old were realistically B-level guys (Cloud, Murat & Shumenov). Two of them just happened to have alphabet titles. When Bernard did step up at that advanced age to an actual A-level guy he got shut out.

You really can't directly compare boxing to football. They're completely different. The only thing they have in common is that they're both popular full-contact sports. Like Bernard, what Brady did has also never been done. Winning NFL championships in your 40s, and being crowned Super Bowl MVP at that, is unfathomable. Especially since he took the worst team in the NFL to the top in his very first season. The Bucs hadn't even gone to the playoffs in 14 seasons. Brady's detractors claimed that the only reason he won so many Super Bowls was because of all those great teammates he had on the Pats. Well, he debunked that theory as soon as he left and joined the Bucs. The Pats have been a real joke ever since. In reality, Brady was the Patriots.

To fight a prime kovalev at nearly 50, I think he was maybe 50 days away from his 50th is unheard of.

Yeah he got shut out but wasn’t stopped. Bring back any 50 year old former athlete and have them match up against a prime version of an opponent in any sport and they 99.9% get absolutely blitzed.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

To fight a prime kovalev at nearly 50, I think he was maybe 50 days away from his 50th is unheard of.

Yeah he got shut out but wasn’t stopped. Bring back any 50 year old former athlete and have them match up against a prime version of an opponent in any sport and they 99.9% get absolutely blitzed.

Right but not getting stopped, while impressive, is just a moral victory. The point was that Bernard, at age 48-49, wasn't able to beat the very best at LHW anymore. Guys that were actually genuinely elite, A-level, light heavyweights.

 

[Blastbeat]

Yeah, that racist crap was unnecessary. I don't get how he could get away with it. It affects my opinion a bit, too, even though the old man could fight.

yeah same here. the only color in boxing that should matter is RED

 

[iwannabeadored]

Right but not getting stopped, while impressive, is just a moral victory. The point was that Bernard, at age 48-49, wasn't able to beat the very best at LHW anymore. Guys that were actually genuinely elite, A-level, light heavyweights.

How many athletes in any sport have been able to actually compete in professional sport and actually give them a run for their money?

In football there’s Brady.

Basketball the oldest who was hood was probably Jordan at 40 and lebron at 39.


Foreman never fought any elites like Lennox or bowe. He got Evander early I guess

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

How many athletes in any sport have been able to actually compete in professional sport and actually give them a run for their money?

In football there’s Brady.

Basketball the oldest who was hood was probably Jordan at 40 and lebron at 39.


Foreman never fought any elites like Lennox or bowe. He got Evander early I guess

Bernard & Brady are the best examples in each of their respective sports. We already know what Bernard accomplished. This is a boxing forum so that's to be expected. I don't think as many know what Brady did, though. For example, he won more than half of his Super Bowls (4 of 7) after he was already in his late 30s. He went 3-for-3 as a Super Bowl underdog and was game MVP in all of them. Two of his Super Bowl wins came in his 40s (3 if we round up slightly).

• 43½ years old when he won Super Bowl LV (2021)
• 41½ years old when he won Super Bowl LIII (2019)
• 39½ years old when he won Super Bowl LI (2017)

Those are mind-blowing stats. Let's also not forget that he had to take on the future of the NFL in Mahomes when he won his last Super Bowl. How good is Mahomes? His team are the reigning Super Bowl champs. He's the best quarterback in the sport and they were favored to beat Brady & the Bucs.

 

[r-harper-1]

Hopkins mid 40’s losing a competitive fight against calzaghe doesn’t hurt his legacy at all

 

[r-harper-1]

Can’t see Hopkins rated ahead of Jones

 

[tomjones]

Can’t see Hopkins rated ahead of Jones

 

[mozfonky]

The weird thing about both those fights is that Trinidad was a 3 to 1 favourite to beat Hopkins and I don't think he won a round. Years later, an inactive De LA Hoya looks way better against Hopkins and actually wins some rounds. That always made me raise an eyebrow. Not a big deal I guess, though.

It shouldn't, Delahoya was fighting a losing game, Hopkins was letting him use all his energy while he played defense and waited. Delahoya basically quit in a lot of people's opinion, because he knew a beating was coming. It was a dumb fight to take from his perspective, the size disparity was ridiculous even if he could match skills.

 

[mozfonky]

Can’t see Hopkins rated ahead of Jones

People will rate him over some other greats just based on his longevity and his list of defenses. I guess those are valid credentials but stats never tell the whole story. You know, the old, "Rocky/Floyd were never defeated so he is the true greatest".

Hopkins had his chances with Jones, the first time he didn't do much and the second time Roy was shot and he didn't do much. Maybe he could have beaten Roy, I think anyone with the balls, heart and chin to get to Roy had a chance but no one he fought at his best had enough of those qualities to try without getting kayoed first.