Sport Jiu-Jitsu in a street fight, Its not all the same!

Why cant anybody admit that the best style of Brazilian/Gracie jiu jitsu would be a mix of both self defense and sport? Train street effective stuff and the what not to do's in a street fight in the self defense version, and learn how to defend all the sport only moves by training sport itself
 
I'm glad you don't work for the feds!

I honestly expected him to deny it.. Now I'm wondering if the mugshot photo was actually him. Because if I'm 2/2 as Stoner Sherlock I might need to apply for the CIA.

"Well Agonyandirony certainly has irregular methods. He only works at 3:00AM and has to have three blunts and a stack of 80's penthouses.. and a blender full of margaritas."

"Don't question the mans methods! He's doing Gods work!"
 
Why cant anybody admit that the best style of Brazilian/Gracie jiu jitsu would be a mix of both self defense and sport? Train street effective stuff and the what not to do's in a street fight in the self defense version, and learn how to defend all the sport only moves by training sport itself

It is due to business reason.

It seems that there is 2 camps at the moment: self defense and sport.

For me, you hear only the self defense guys critic the sport section.
 
Why cant anybody admit that the best style of Brazilian/Gracie jiu jitsu would be a mix of both self defense and sport? Train street effective stuff and the what not to do's in a street fight in the self defense version, and learn how to defend all the sport only moves by training sport itself

When I made this thread I was somewhat confused with it all,now that I have thought about it for sometime it, IMO would be best to start jiu jitsu by learing the bunch block series/ self defence aspects and THEN focus on the sport techniques and what not after that. I think what I was trying to say was there are many many people who havnt done the self defence/space management stuff and only do sport BJJ ,which is perfectly fine, people are saying it doesn't matter too much and I can agree with that to an extent jiu jitsu is jiu jitsu and if you know how to armbar or triangle that's what you know how to do, I think it's just best to always filter techniques you learn or do and understand which ones would work for which situation.

In a fight it would definitely be best if you had practiced and trained all the counters to things untrained people Tend to do in a fight along with punch block series/distance control from strikes. Instructors at BJJ schools should IMO go over with their students on what techniques they should use in a self defence situation versus moves that should be kept to only the mats and competition.

I was basically comparing these 2 at first then someone chimed in with MMA which is great also, I was mostly comparing jiu jitsu but MMA obv great for self defence. That's the route I want to take, Im a BJJ( not GJJ) purple belt 4 1/2 yrs of training, not really sure what to do because the MMA schools in my town are pretty meathead mentality ,( not every MMA school is I know) I trained at one and basically right away I felt a huge difference can't fully describe it but I feel like I'm at a peaceful temple when I go to my jiu jitsu school and this gym felt super uneasy and hostile. I wanna learn I'm not afraid to get punched In the face or choked that's a fact but for now I'm just using MMA friendly position/transitions and do nogi whenever I can. + small town, instructors all know each other if mine found out I was cross training might not be to happy so it's one big dilemma. what is a good belt level to start MMA?
 
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It is due to business reason.

It seems that there is 2 camps at the moment: self defense and sport.

For me, you hear only the self defense guys critic the sport section.

Because some of the those who consider themselves self defense guys are clinging to a fantasy that they are jedi killing machines. Like anyone who secretly knows that what defines them is in fact a lie, they go on the attack to buoy their beliefs. A man's got to know his limitations.
 
Oh fkn BS. We aren't animals to kill somebody who might have a fkn problem. Are you a women?

What a pansy way to view the world. 'I might lose this fight I may have somewhat started, better shoot.' ANIMALS don't always use their deadliest weapons against each other when fighting over females or territory. Jesus.

Where Im from many stabings happen often they're actually pretty common lately, even in the nicer places there's bad everywhere and there are loons who will stab and kill ppl for no reason. Don't think of the world as such a safe place it's really not.

Edit:I misread, my post is towards confrontations with strangers some ppl will do anything that's why it's best to run if u can. ppl r crazy
 
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When I made this thread I was somewhat confused with it all,now that I have thought about it for sometime it, IMO would be best to start jiu jitsu by learing the bunch block series/ self defence aspects and THEN focus on the sport techniques and what not after that. I think what I was trying to say was there are many many people who havnt done the self defence/space management stuff and only do sport BJJ ,which is perfectly fine, people are saying it doesn't matter too much and I can agree with that to an extent jiu jitsu is jiu jitsu and if you know how to armbar or triangle that's what you know how to do, I think it's just best to always filter techniques you learn or do and understand which ones would work for which situation.

In a fight it would definitely be best if you had practiced and trained all the counters to things untrained people Tend to do in a fight along with punch block series/distance control from strikes. Instructors at BJJ schools should IMO go over with their students on what techniques they should use in a self defence situation versus moves that should be kept to only the mats and competition.

I was basically comparing these 2 at first then someone chimed in with MMA which is great also, I was mostly comparing jiu jitsu but MMA obv great for self defence. That's the route I want to take, Im a purple belt 4 1/2 yrs of training, not really sure what to do because the MMA schools in my town are pretty meathead mentality ,( not every MMA school is I know) I trained at one and basically right away I felt a huge difference can't fully describe it but I feel like I'm at a peaceful temple when I go to my jiu jitsu school and this gym felt super uneasy and hostile. I wanna learn I'm not afraid to get punched In the face or choked that's a fact but for now I'm just using MMA friendly position/transitions and do nogi whenever I can. + small town, instructors all know each other if mine found out I was cross training might not be to happy so it's one big dilemma. what is a good belt level to start MMA?

I did a year and half of JJJ which covered all this, plus some rudimentary striking (with zero footwork). I tossed it all in the bin when I discovered BJJ. It was fun, but it was neither sport nor self-defense.
 
Despite thread upon thread arguing this shit, it seems to me that most of us actually agree on the basics:

1. GJJ and other BJJ is about 90% the same anyway
2. They're both useful for fights/SD but neither is a complete answer
3. SD stuff like headlock escapes are useful but much of the set-piece SD curriculum, like knife-defence, is unrealistic TMA stuff
4. If you want to be prepared for da streetz you should do some training with punching and take-downs and ideally learn a striking art too.
5. Self defence is hard to define and is much more than just physical techniques

The problem with guys with JohnSouth is that they're fundamentalists. In his case he appears to be a fundamentalist in religion, politics and martial arts. Fundamentalists by definition see things in black and white terms and only their viewpoint can possibly ever be correct. There is no point in arguing with them. They will only ever become more and more extreme in defending their original position.
 
This entire thread is riveting.

I take back every bad thing I ever said about JohnSouthShallRiseAgain. He gives even the most boring threads that pasty pizazz that keeps them going and going.
 
Because some of the those who consider themselves self defense guys are clinging to a fantasy that they are jedi killing machines. Like anyone who secretly knows that what defines them is in fact a lie, they go on the attack to buoy their beliefs. A man's got to know his limitations.

I guess so.
Sport guys always get their reality check via competition loses and whatever so they stay humble .

Also, in a cult you need to point out to the ennemies and haters in order to make your cult group feel more alienated to others. The day you do not have ennemies and haters, the group does not need to continue to exist.
 
Also, in a cult you need to point out to the ennemies and haters in order to make your cult group feel more alienated to others. The day you do not have ennemies and haters, the group does not need to continue to exist.

Are you referring to Stormfront or GJJ? :icon_chee
 
It isn't a bullshit fantasy.

I roll evenly with blue belts and often threaten to tap brown belts. I'm a solid average player. I'm also large and I command enough technical understanding that better people come to me and say, "what do you think about that and how should I do it?"

Guys that I train with, who I outweigh by 100 pounds and have that much on them when it comes to virtually every major lift, are routinely able to escape to their feet by utilizing classic escapes like the elbow knee, free your head from Kesa and uphill turn, by starting early and knowing where they are going, or waiting for me to start an attack from a dominant hold and moving.

Better, if we don't start a round timer and they play safely enough, they will eventually tap me as I start to gas, by evading a submission, scrambling to their feet, and getting on top.

For that matter, a 10 year old who trains for like 2 months will send a fit 12 year old flying with an Upa from mount if he's untrained. That's good self defense.

Yes, if my fat ass 100% gets kesa with elbow control on someone half my size I'll be able to maintain it all day, but how do I get their easily against a small fit man who knows where he is going? All he has to do is endure and escape and it isn't unreasonable.

No one with a brain in their head thinks beating a stronger larger and better trained person is the point. For self defense it is always beating a larger less trained person and that is child's play, because the stuff works.

The other day I saw a 15 year old with 3 months BJJ and 1 year high school wrestling triangle a 30 year old fit man with 80 pounds and twice the strength.

You think very highly of yourself, your skills, and your method of doing everything.

Especially as a white belt.

Stay gold.
 
non resistance training doesn't do jack and squat for self defense PERIOD.
You can practice some self defense move for 10 years, but if you never had someone who is going full speed and putting force on you while you are trying to do that move, you might as well take dance lessons.
 
You think very highly of yourself, your skills, and your method of doing everything.

Especially as a white belt.

Stay gold.

Or the brown belts at his gym must downright suck. I have absolutely nothing on my gym brown belts.
 
He definitely has everything figured out as a whitebelt. We had a guy just like him at our school we nicknamed the professor. Wonder what happened to him after he flamed out.
 
Oh fkn BS. We aren't animals to kill somebody who might have a fkn problem. Are you a women?

What a pansy way to view the world. 'I might lose this fight I may have somewhat started, better shoot.' ANIMALS don't always use their deadliest weapons against each other when fighting over females or territory. Jesus.

So much truth in this post, most people talking about guns and SD arent going to be killing a freaking fly, but yeah each time some dude ducks around wtih him hell just shoot the mother fucker... yeah have fun in jail...
 
Well this thread blew up 10+ pages in one day of troll-feeding. What did I learn?
Ryron Gracie has good defense but also leaves his arms open when caught in north south. So he's good and he sucks too.
Kurt Osiander used to be a bouncer.
AgonyandIrony is a fucking detective.
John South is a white supremacist (shocking) from Ohio.
Beating a dead horse thread > creative kind of threads.


Did I miss anything?

Oh my GOD!!! This thread fucking DELIVERS!!!

You need to add SummerStriker as the whitebelt that mastered the art of grappling.
 
Ok ok I tap and appologize for having a good opinion of myself. I should be more humble as a white belt. I was trying to illustrate a point about how powerful I think good technique is but came off too uppity.
 
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